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The Zimmerman Trial

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posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:12 AM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan
reply to post by JuniorDisco
 

Racist is racist. Your continued free pass to Martins racism because his ancestors MAY have had racial things happen is absurd. His racism was evident right up to the point of death. Literally, his last words on earth were racial slurs ... 'crazy ass cracker'. His social media was steeped in racism and bigotry (and drug use and thuggery). And yes, his continued use of racial slurs over and over and over and over do indeed equal a white person saying the 'n' word. There is no good excuse for his behavior and his language. None.






You didn't answer the question. Are you unable to?




posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:12 AM
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Man ... yesterday Jeantel was all angry and 'in your face'. Today she is half asleep.
She hasn't woken up yet. (did someone give her a valium or something?)
Her answers keep contradicting herself. She's mumbling.
And she just admitted that she lied under oath while making a police statement.

Who on earth will believe that she heard 'get off ... get off'???

.... next ....



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:13 AM
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Originally posted by JuniorDisco

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by JuniorDisco
Are you of the opinion that Martin's use of this twitter handle is absolutely identical to a white person screaming that word into the face of a black person?

Martin used racial slurs right up to the instant he died. His racial slurs are just as obnoxious and pathetic as the 'n' word racial slur. Racist is racist. Your wanting to give him a free pass because his grandpappy may have been discriminated against or because his great great grandpappy may have been a slave .. that's absurd.


Amusingly, you probably are.

Biased, you probably are.


Answer the question.

Are you of the opinion that Martin's use of this twitter handle is absolutely identical to a white person screaming that word into the face of a black person?

Because if you aren't then suddenly your simplistic rendering of "racist is racist" isn't quite as obvious, is it? And you might have to admit that there are degrees of prejudicial effect based, yes, in part on the things that happened to Martin's forebears. (Which I'm not at all surprised you are so keen to minimise).


Seriously, you really think that it is ok for a black person to use racial slurs about/towards a white person just because someone in their family tree may have been a slave 150+ years ago? It isn't ok for anyone to use racial slurs against anyone else, and yes there is a double standard in today's society about people being racist. The only people that you ever hear replied to as being racist are white people, when anyone of any ethnicity can and are racist.
TM used a racial slur to describe GZ and the witness doesn't think that using that slur is racist, but if GZ would have described TM using the N word instead of correctly referring to him as black, then he would be considered a racist, he is already considered a racist because he referred to TM as black and because he shot a black guy. What would you have liked GZ to refer TM as to the 911 operator?



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:17 AM
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Originally posted by JuniorDisco
You didn't answer the question. Are you unable to?

Can't you read? I did ... I said that Martins continued use of racial slurs does ended equal the same thing as a white person using the 'n' word OF COURSE it does. To say otherwise is absurd.

It should be noted to those reading this thread ... Zimmerman didn't use the 'n' word. JuniorDisco is just employing the 'black people can't be racist ' silliness that some people try to pass off as some kind of pseudo-psychology.

Martins last words on earth ... racial slurs ... 'crazy ass crackers' ....



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:19 AM
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Originally posted by RickKilgannon
TM used a racial slur to describe GZ and the witness doesn't think that using that slur is racist, but if GZ would have described TM using the N word instead of correctly referring to him as black, then he would be considered a racist,

Serious double standard going on ...


If Zimmerman had said the 'n' word .. it would indeed have been racist.
But he didn't. He said 'black' when describing Martin. Which was correct
but the media got all huffy saying it was racist to say so.

Of course .. they ignore the REAL racist statement ... Martins 'crazy ass cracker' statement ...



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:19 AM
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Originally posted by JuniorDisco

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by JuniorDisco
Are you of the opinion that Martin's use of this twitter handle is absolutely identical to a white person screaming that word into the face of a black person?

Martin used racial slurs right up to the instant he died. His racial slurs are just as obnoxious and pathetic as the 'n' word racial slur. Racist is racist. Your wanting to give him a free pass because his grandpappy may have been discriminated against or because his great great grandpappy may have been a slave .. that's absurd.


Amusingly, you probably are.

Biased, you probably are.


Answer the question.

Are you of the opinion that Martin's use of this twitter handle is absolutely identical to a white person screaming that word into the face of a black person?

Because if you aren't then suddenly your simplistic rendering of "racist is racist" isn't quite as obvious, is it? And you might have to admit that there are degrees of prejudicial effect based, yes, in part on the things that happened to Martin's forebears. (Which I'm not at all surprised you are so keen to minimise).


I actually do think that his use of the twitter handle is as bad as a white person saying it to a black person. I do not understand why a black person would call another or themselves a derogatory racial slur. I personally think that anyone using a racial slur to describe themselves or anyone else are more than likely racist. You do not use those types of words unless you have hatred in you.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:20 AM
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reply to post by JuniorDisco
 


My bad.... I see that you also know GZ. Please update me more on his personal life. Please inform me of his exercise habits and previous career choices and twist them as you please. Then tell me how any of what you think you know is relevant to this case.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:26 AM
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From all appearances, Martin was a thug (or at least a wannabe thug).
From all appearances, Zimmerman was a wannabe cop.

Zimmerman confronted Martin, Martin beat him up, Zimmerman shot Martin.

To me, the "spirit" of the Stand Your Ground law was broken the moment Zimmerman pursued Martin (especially after reporting him to the police).

However, legally, the Stand Your Ground law is so vague, I can easily see Zimmerman getting off here. (Had the state gone for involuntary manslaughter, may have had an easier time?). But, so far, Zimmerman's lawyer is puzzling me. He seems accomplished on paper, but a knock knock joke insulting the jury as an opening?
His own lawyer may get him convicted when he could get off.

If he does get off though, there WILL be some rioting, no doubt. I think the police will be ready for it, and expect it though...so hopefully won't get too out of hand. Guess we'll see.


Seriously, you really think that it is ok for a black person to use racial slurs about/towards a white person just because someone in their family tree may have been a slave 150+ years ago? It isn't ok for anyone to use racial slurs against anyone else, and yes there is a double standard in today's society about people being racist. The only people that you ever hear replied to as being racist are white people, when anyone of any ethnicity can and are racist.


We whiteys never gave ANY racial slur the power to hurt us, so we can easily just laugh off words like cracker, honkey, etc. It isn't like we all had some kind of a meeting...we simply collectively laugh and shrug it off...don't know why. When others ALLOW a word to sting, THEY give it the power to do so. If folks would let these words go, instead of making a federal case every time some celebrity uses one, they'd find that the power of such words would disappear....but NO....we have to crucify someone instead (look at Paula Dean, or Mel Gibson), giving such words even more staying power. Idiots. It's hard to believe we're still having conversations about racial slurs in 2013...
But, if we keep making such a big deal every time a taboo word is said, it will remain taboo, and remain powerful with the power to hurt.

And, it really should be a non-issue in this trial. There is nothing to suggest Zimmerman's actions were based on race. (and newsflash, he's not whitey! He's Hispanic (with some black in his ancestry) So to call him racist is kind of funny, really).


edit on 27-6-2013 by Gazrok because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:27 AM
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Originally posted by RickKilgannon


Seriously, you really think that it is ok for a black person to use racial slurs about/towards a white person just because someone in their family tree may have been a slave 150+ years ago?


No. But I think that racism and racist terminology are informed by the structures of the society from which they issue. That being the case, calling someone a cracker is not the equivalent of calling a black person a n--ger, because of the historical freight that comes with the latter.

People who insist that they are equivalent are seeking a pass to ameliorate white on black racism by insisting that, hey, these blacks do it too. In this trial this is a convenient way to smear Martin.


TM used a racial slur to describe GZ and the witness doesn't think that using that slur is racist, but if GZ would have described TM using the N word instead of correctly referring to him as black, then he would be considered a racist, he is already considered a racist because he referred to TM as black and because he shot a black guy. What would you have liked GZ to refer TM as to the 911 operator?


I don't know whether Zimmerman is racist or not, although I doubt he would have acted as he did to a white person. And people aren't calling him a racist because he called Martin "black". The attempt to suggest this is why is another effort to defuse the likely racial overtones of Zimmerman's actions by suggesting they are based on an absurd premise.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:27 AM
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Originally posted by dudeman351

Originally posted by IvanAstikov

Originally posted by dudeman351
reply to post by Baddguy
 


To be fair, the cop beating was due to the fact that it was an off duty cop in a bar. Who didn't identify himself and was harassing George's buddy.


Think about that. George went up to a larger stranger and got right in his face over something George believed was wrong. That was before he'd spent 18 months training at a well regarded fighting gym and done a bit of freelance "security" work at private parties.


First off he was on even ground in that instance. Secondly you ever been sucker punched? When thug life punched him and broke his nose, Zimmerman couldn't see anything but white for a few seconds at least. Plenty of time for the punk to just start wailing on him and kick his ass.

He was stood on a footpath(he says) when Trayvon Martin called from behind him and to the left, "Do you have a problem, homie/mofo?"(depending who George is telling it to), so how is that not flat ground? In his re-enactment, he says Trayvon wa stood about 10ft away on the footpath. How is that not flat ground? You're getting distracted from the more important factor of George's confidence in thinking he could handle the situation and challenge this larger stranger.

Remind me again what evidence there is that George was ever sucker punched at any moment? Pointing to pictures of George's slightly bloody nose doesn't count.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:28 AM
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One person killed another person. Does it matter who, what, where, when, how or why? What happened to a good ole fashioned @$$ kickin'? Why does everyone have to play John Wayne???



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:31 AM
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Originally posted by WonderBoi
One person killed another person. Does it matter who, what, where, when, how or why?

OF COURSE it matters. It could have been murder. It could have been self defense. It could have been accidental (manslaughter). It matters a whole lot because justice needs to happen. Justice for Martin or justice for Zimmerman. It matters a whole lot.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:32 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


ok...you don't understand racism....firstly the term "cracker" will never hold as much weight a the "n word".
second the term "cracker" comes from slaves that referred to the masters as "whip crackers"....you can use all the logic you want but is not the same...I know..i know "racism is racism" but white people didnt go through slavery and segregation like blacks did so they will never understand what blacks still deal with...

but any way...how about GZ beating on women??



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:33 AM
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reply to post by IvanAstikov
 


Face it. No one is going to come to common ground on this. You're on one side or the other. Just like every other thing in this country. The country is more divided now than it was in 1860. This could very well be the trigger for it all to implode. I'm ready for it are you?



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:33 AM
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Originally posted by TeflonBear
reply to post by IvanAstikov
 


There you go again with your wealth of knowledge on George Zimmerman and his personal life that you derived from the one-sided media circus.


What are you on about? George has admitted under police caution what he did, which is why he was let off with a smack on the wrist, rather than the court case any person without a parent who was a magistrate would have got.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:33 AM
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reply to post by Gazrok
 

I totally agree with you. John Wayne wannabe meets street thug wanna be.
Manslaughter would have made sense. Murder doesn't.
But I guess we'll see what the state thinks it has during the trial to take this to 'murder'.

So far ...
Prosecution opening remarks - very good.
Defense opening remarks - really bad.
Prosecution witness - two airheads who admit to telling lies about the case and get their facts wrong.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:35 AM
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Originally posted by Baddguy
reply to post by FlyersFan
 


ok...you don't understand racism....firstly the term "cracker" will never hold as much weight a the "n word".
second the term "cracker" comes from slaves that referred to the masters as "whip crackers"....you can use all the logic you want but is not the same...I know..i know "racism is racism" but white people didnt go through slavery and segregation like blacks did so they will never understand what blacks still deal with...

but any way...how about GZ beating on women??


A cracker had nothing to do with slaves. A cracker is a Florida cowboy. Back in the day Florida was the #1 beef supplier to the Confederacy.



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:36 AM
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reply to post by dudeman351
 


yea...im pretty sure your wrong



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:37 AM
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Originally posted by Baddguy
you don't understand racism....

yes I do.

firstly the term "cracker" will never hold as much weight a the "n word".

Because people give it a free pass when in fact the hate behind that word is just as deep.

second the term "cracker" comes from slaves that referred to the masters as "whip crackers

DUH. No kidding.

you can use all the logic you want but is not the same..

Yes .. I state LOGICALLY ... the hate behind the words is exactly the same.

but any way...how about GZ beating on women??

Yep ... already mentioned that. He's got some history. So does Martin.
If one persons history is to be used, then both should be.
Either it all has to do with just the events of that evening and everyones history doesn't matter.
Or it has to do with EVERYTHING and both Martin and Zimmermans histories matter.

All or nothing ...



posted on Jun, 27 2013 @ 09:37 AM
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reply to post by Baddguy
 


It is also slang. Just as the n word can be when used in the way that she testified to yesterday. She didn't clean anything up. She repeated the words just as she heard them. I have used both words as slang and every teen I have ever met I have at least heard them use the n word, in slang, when addressing each other. They were all white or crackers.



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