Video: I AM BRADLEY MANNING

If you witnessed war crimes, what would you do? More coming soon... iam.bradleymanning.org... | #iambradleymanning

Awesome!!

I figured Oliver Stone would take his talent and contribute to this cause, but I'm glad actors/musicians and lots of people that our youth look up to have taken a stand.

If he is sentenced to life in prison, this won't go over well.

Good Luck, America!

It is an utter disgrace that he is still locked up!

It took courage to do what he did.

reply to post by Lady_Tuatha


Keep in mind.. He's locked up at this point by his own admission of guilt to the crimes which he did commit. His words. Not mine. His admissions..not our assumptions. His acceptance of his deeds...not our forcing it.

Now having said that, the trial is overkill to an extreme and just dumping on the kid like nobodies business. It was an insult added to his own accepted injury that was over the top of unnecessary, IMHO.

Hello, Bradley.

Meet, Eli.

Eli Manning.

elimanninglookingatthings.tumblr.com...

reply to post by CALGARIAN


Love it!! Thanks for the youtube link. I have shared it with my people.

Peace Out

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Hi Wrabbit,

It is my understanding that he pled out to a few of the lesser chargers in hopes of making the larger ones go away. It was a defensive strategy and tactic. Unfortunately they are still going after, "Aiding the Enemy", which is a capital offense.

It's awful! The government talks about people having freedom of speech but that freedom only exists if you're talking in favour of the government NOT against!

Where's the freedom in that?

What I don't get is ... He aided the enemy how???

By telling the truth? By trying to save innocent people?

Ummm! Yup! He's wrong surely! He aided them!

reply to post by GrantedBail


You and I likely aren't too far off for thinking on this. I think you prefer he get a full walk if I recall your msgs correctly, and I'm entirely against that ...but he sure doesn't deserve life. As for his pleas?

(Reuters) - The U.S. Army private accused of providing secret documents to the WikiLeaks website pleaded guilty on Thursday to misusing classified material he felt "should become public," but denied the top charge of aiding the enemy.

You're right about the specifics. He did deny the Aid to the Enemy. I also tend to feel that was overcharged. If he'd even HINTED one time in the records of phone calls and statements that he knew that was going to happen and he was okay with it, I'd say give me a rifle and put him against a wall. I'll do it myself. However..he never did. I think he was a bit too naive to even think that far through what he was doing. Sad, but true.

Military judge Colonel Denise Lind accepted the guilty pleas late in the afternoon. Manning pleaded guilty to a series of 10 lesser charges that he misused classified information and faces a maximum of 20 years in prison for those offenses.

"I believe that if the general public ... had access to the information ... this could spark a domestic debate as to the role of the military and foreign policy in general," Manning, dressed in full military uniform, testified calmly.

Source

I tend to believe what he claims his motives were. Not least of which because he also said them when he didn't know his words would be part of the record later and become public knowledge...but more because it fits everything else we know about what he did and how he did it.

....and I think he should serve every day of the 20 year maximum for them, too. Just not life. That's overkill. Badly.

reply to post by CALGARIAN


Manning is a silly fruitcake with serious mental issues who violated his oath. His actions were treasonous and put Americans at greater risk.

I have no sympathy for him and I hope he gets the max punishment because he earned it!

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Well I disagree. This inhibits other individuals coming forward with other war crimes. Bradley wasn't a spy, and he didn't sell anything. Furthermore no one has alleged that he aided the enemy nor will there be any evidence brought forward that suggests that from the prosecution. Also, the defense will not be allowed to argue that Manning did not aid the enemy.

Fat chance in this day and time. Whistleblowers are prosecuted and have their lives destroyed and the perpetrators move on to their next victims. In this time, especially in this time, where the government completely OWNS the media, and where nothing gets past the minders, there must be some protection provided to those that would risk their lives to save this country.

On edit: I don't understand your complete support for Snowden, yet not for Manning?? I don't get the disconnect?

reply to post by GrantedBail


The difference in what Snowden did or what Elllsberg did to what Manning did is simple.

Really, very simple when it comes down to it. Maturity could be one way to put it. However, in more specific terms, Snowden and Ellsberg had SEEN every document of what they kicked out to the public. Both of them knew, for fact, who would or who would not be put in harm's way or killed by what they did. In both cases, (by what we know so far of Snowden) I'd argue, they've caused no one's death. At least in no direct way.

Manning didn't see or care to try and review a small FRACTION of what he tossed out. He just read headers....and only that fraction at that, to say 'Yup! Looks good', then copied and sent.

Some may suggest no one died by what Manning did and I'd say thats hoplessly naive or some very powerful wishful thinking. We'll never see bodies with his fingerprints on them but the documents which name the names the enemy was using as a "Who's Who" of civilian collaborators came from his hand. From his computer and his actions, they came to be in the hands of the enemy. No one can much argue that and it cannot be taken back or undone.

Perhaps he regrets that. I've never really heard him make a comment about the Iraqis and Afghans he almost certainly caused the deaths of. Oh and good lord....if you think the Jihadis are wicked about killing a hostage, you really ought to read accounts of how they consider it proper to kill a traitor. That's how they saw some, if not all the civilians who worked with US and Coalition people...and that's how those people met their end, I've little doubt.

Manning is lucky....exceptionally so...that we don't have any AQ or Taliban Prisoners like the Captain of the U-Boat that sank the Indianapolis to testify and remove all doubt of how the enemy handled that data, once in the public domain. I don't think he'd survive this if such a witness existed. For that reason, 20 years isn't that much and the least he should get.

We can disagree with respect tho.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


They were diplomatic cables. That is clear. Embarrassing yes, TOP SECRET, no.

Like he had CIA operatives, missions, et al. I don't think so. Like he had top secret NSA data. I don't think so. That stuff he would have never had access to. He knew what he was giving up. And it doesn't matter, he is going to fry and there will be those that justify his punishment and those that will be deterred in the future.

You tell me that what appeared in Collateral Murder was not a war crime. ON TOP of being there on a sack full of lies. You tell me the MSM once, JUST ONCE, told the truth about the war in Iraq and all of it's intendant suffering for all of mankind.

He is a hero. I don't give a donkey's butt.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Wrabbit, even the DOD is not alleging that anyone was hurt. Wouldn't they be in the best position to know and certainly it would strengthen and justify their charge of "Aiding the Enemy". However, they are not They will not be putting on any evidence that suggests that Manning actually did "Aid the Enemy". It's a would of, could of type of prosecution on that charge. Likewise the Court is not allowing the Manning defense to put on evidence that Bradley "DID NOT" aid the enemy.

Doesn't matter. It is a rigged game. Kid is going down. Lucky for him, he at least has some decent representation unlike those poor souls down in Guantanamo.

reply to post by GrantedBail


I think we're missing a major point here and oddly, it's a point I find missed when the debate goes to the other side was well. Manning released three major things.

#1. State Department Cables over 3+ decades of international communications which run to Secret/NOFORN level

#2 Iraq Action/After Action Reports Database for the Theater

#3 Afghanistan Action/After Action Reports Database for the Theater

Did the State cables get anyone killed? Nope... Not directly. They just blew our diplomatic trust and efforts, world wide, for years. Notice when things really started going sideways in various nations around the globe? I sure did,

The action reports?? Those detailed DAILY patrols. Individual contact reports. Direct mention of local people contacted and worked with.

Those are the reports Al Qaeda made clear they were going over...page by page. I'm sure they did. That is the material found in the Bin Laden house in Pakistan, to my knowledge.

Manning blew two VERY different areas of government effort. Diplomatic and Military and those actions had two VERY different outcomes. To focus on just State? You're right. To include those civilians named in the action reports across two different war zones for activity on a daily basis? Of course people got killed. To assume otherwise is folly and to think our enemy are a bunch of total morons to the last man. An assumption I NEVER make about an opponent.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Seriously, do you really think these cables eroded the thoughts of other diplomats in other nations??? Or was it really the actions that have been taken by the government in our name that have everyone sideways?? It is like you think the espionage game is only played by rookies?? The American people needed to see them more than the supposed countries we have years of diplomatic relations with. And quite frankly when has any dealing by our diplomatic assets done anything to help "We the People". This crap is usually about finding areas for the mega-corps in this country to rape and pillage someone else. There certainly wasn't any diplomatic negotiations taking place that concerned jobs in this country. Or how to fix our infrastructure. NOPE, I don't think any of those conversations took place. So tell me how this functionary of our government serves us???

Those are "after-action" reports right??? So those would be war logs?? How are we supposed to have a discussion as a nation about the way we have been had by liars and war mongers when the MSM is all bright and cheery about what is going on. It was well past time to have that discussion.

We need to have the discussion. Right here and right now.

Originally posted by seabag
reply to post by CALGARIAN

 

Manning is a silly fruitcake with serious mental issues who violated his oath. His actions were treasonous and put Americans at greater risk.

I have no sympathy for him and I hope he gets the max punishment because he earned it!

I wont deny all of those statements, but I will argue America is a better place because of it...

Safer? That is uncertain.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

in other words, he plead guilty to releasing the documents. his reason for doing so was because they showed the government carrying out morally objectionable activities, like gunning down unarmed reporters...then a van with kids inside when they stopped to help the wounded. the pilots joked about them, saying "shouldn't have brought your kids to battle". yeahhh...unarmed civilians helping wounded reporters is quite a battle.

so yes. he said that he did leak those files.

in the strictest sense, did he violate the law? probably. did he do anything wrong? no. to not act would have been wrong.

non-disclosure contracts cannot be used as an excuse. *someone leaks files of illegal activities* "he broke the contract, therefore our actions wouldn't have been known if he hadn't violated the law, therefore our illegal activities aren't admissible in court"

Originally posted by GrantedBail
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

We need to have the discussion. Right here and right now.

Do you mind if we might just hold that discussion until after our combat troops are HOME and not still dying in the field?

Afghanistan Casualty Database

According to that, we've lost 7 men this month alone and we're only 10 days into it. Now I'm well aware of the fact that some people find that a point to be happy about, if not celebrate. I'd hope they'd keep those opinions to themselves as much as I keep what I think of ...those who have them...to myself.

This didn't help that. This didn't help END that. All Manning did was get innocent civilians murdered for assisting coalition forces after he dumped entire databases which listed the names in the clear.

Again, Snowden has said he specifically avoided that. Ellsberg did nothing to endanger U.S. men in combat in Vietnam and I thank him for that. My Father was one of them at that moment in time. What he did actually DID help end the war.

It almost sounds like Manning could have released ANYTHING and you'd have still seen him as a Hero. Well, I'm not that free with my respect or praise. Intent, action and outcome ALL ...all 3...play into whether I respect a man. Manning was worthy of respect when he was releasing things like the Apache gun camera footage. He lost it ALL when he went to just document dumping everything but the kitchen sink.


Also... Do I think the cables hurt us diplomatically? OF COURSE it did. Over 250,000 cables isn't a leak. It's a criminal document dump. Have you read them? I mean I play games about this, but lets drop the pretense since no one is fooled and it's kinda silly. I absolutely have read a fair % of them. Many nights I spent reading them because they were better than any fiction I've ever read. They dated right into Hillary Clinton's tenure at State and absolutely dealt with personal and very sensitive issues.

Oh, they didn't deal with T.S. or SCI stuff. Worse. They dealt with PERSONAL issues of leaders who are STILL serving in offices, positions of power in agencies and influential posts around the world.

Telling your buddy someone is a jerk and word leaking back is one thing. Having the fact you think someone is a jerk in bold headlines across world newspapers is quiet another and the damage that kid did to not ONLY U.S., but allied diplomacy around the world is incalculable. The betrayal of trust for basic security of information by a Government? Unforgivable.

Manning get a break? HA! Obama would no doubt like his head mounted on the wall of the Oval Office, right next to the door, so he can sit there and admire it when he's bored. The personal level of animosity is that great, I truly believe. I don't think it's warranted to anything like that, as I've said....but the kid did MAJOR damage.

To suggest he didn't is kinda like this...



You can say the damage he did was worth the gains he brought ..if you believe he actually changed anything (Iraq withdraw early? Nope... Not even by 1 day. Afghanistan? See above.. still there. What was accomplished again??) but to say damage wasn't done is a position I flat cannot comprehend with intellectual honesty to the topic and nature of his actions.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

Do you mind if we might just hold that discussion until after our combat troops are HOME and not still dying in the field?

i understand your position, but consider that perhaps they may never come home if we do not have this discussion. it is not wise to perform a morally questionable action only to discuss whether it should be done AFTER tens of thousands of innocents on both sides have died.

far more death could be prevented by questioning our base actions and motives overseas than will be caused by the questioning itself.

You can say the damage he did was worth the gains he brought ..if you believe he actually changed anything

i disagree. the consequences of speaking out against wrongdoing (specifically mass murder) cannot be known in advance, but attempting to end it by raising awareness through leaked information is a damn sight nicer than passively accepting it.