The Religion of Peace - Well, except for the 21,026 Terrorist attacks around the World since 9/11

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by NavyDoc

 

That they all repeat the same claim from the same dude?

So basically, we all need to go with what taipei times says?

Either way, it does not magically change the fact that George W.Bush IS a Christian, and that he is responsible for the hundreds of thousands of deaths of Muslims.

Seems a lot of people can dish it out, but can't take it.

No, what that means is that your single source, no matter how often repeated, is still a single source.

So what if he is a Christian, that does not mean that he started a war for Christ. Believe it or not, leaders who happen to be religious make secular decisions all of the time.

reply to post by NavyDoc


In that case, we can also dismiss the OP's source as well.

Ironically, BBC is quoted in the OP.... yet you seem to accept BBC as a source, as long as it supports the OP's message... while at the same, you reject BBC when I cite it to frame a case against a Christian President.

reply to post by mobiusmale


You know what?

When I see the Headlines in the News of another bombing in Iraq or Afghanistan, I just ignore it and move on. It's been going on for so long now.... that I can't be bothered.

I'm even becoming immune to the whole situation in the ME as its just got to the point where there seems no end and people just won't grow up!

And its all to do with some Prophet who started the whole thing.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by NavyDoc

 

In that case, we can also dismiss the OP's source as well.

Ironically, BBC is quoted in the OP.... yet you seem to accept BBC as a source, as long as it supports the OP's message... while at the same, you reject BBC when I cite it to frame a case against a Christian President.

edit on 12-6-2013 by sk0rpi0n because: (no reason given)

Logically, the onus on someone making the claim. You can't prove a negative.

reply to post by MrInquisitive

So when you count up all the attacks by Muslims, do everybody a favor and count up all the attacks by Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists and members of all other religious cults before singling out a particular religion for criticism of the violence of some of its adherents. It's rather easy to point the finger at the darker side of some religion or culture other than your own. Acknowledging the the dark side of your own culture, religion and/or nation is a bit more difficult for some.

Wonderful idea! So I did. 57% of the world's terrorist attacks were committed by Sunni Muslims, accounting for 70% of the deaths. (2011) The next highest category were political and secular attacks with the various Communist parties leading the list of those types of attacks.

Other religions? Nowhere near those two biggies.

Thanks for suggesting that I check the facts. Now, according to you, I can single out "a particular religion for criticism of the violence of some of it's adherents."

All of this is nonsense.

All religions speak of peace, love and harmony.
Why do people (and I mean ALL people) find it so difficult to drink, make love, be fruitful and multiply, be generally good people to one another and be happy.

It's really just that simple. Would any God (beit Jehova, Allah, et al) condem you for honestly attempting to be a generally good person who drinks, makes love is fruitful and multiplies, and is generally happy?

Doubtful.

And yet - here we are. Only Humans are capable of misinterpreting something so simple and mangling it so much that we end up in the current state.

Originally posted by zeeon
All religions speak of peace, love and harmony.

Religions LIE...

That is why most don't believe a word that religious people say.

There are two kinds of people in the world – sayers and doers.

Doers actually do all the things that sayers talk about.

God told Howard Pittman during his NDE that not all the sayers would be in heaven, but all the doers would be.

On August 3, 1979, Howard Pittman, a Baptist minister for 35 years, died while on the operating table during surgery and had a near-death experience.

Instead of allowing me to enter, the angel stationed me before the Gates, slightly to one side. He instructed me to stay there and watch as the saints were permitted to enter into Heaven. This point was so important that the Holy Spirit told me Himself. I watched the fifty saints enter Heaven, but the point I missed was the time frame involved.

It was explained to me that at the same time those fifty saints died on Earth, 1,950 other humans also died; or only 50 out of 2000 made it into Heaven. That other 1,950 were not there. Where were they? That was only 2 ½ percent going to Heaven! Ninety seven point five percent did not make it! Is that representative of the entire world today? If so, 97 ½ percent of the population of this world today is not ready to meet God.

Placebo by Howard Pittman

Christians in Hell

The two angels escorted me to Hell. I then saw many pastors, elders, and deacons in Hell. I asked the angel, “I know them. They had served God faithfully while on the Earth. They had died some time ago. We all had thought they were in Heaven with God. But now, I see them all in Hell and they are crying out that it is so hot! Why are they here?” There were so many pastors, elders, deacons and all other lay believers.

The angel answered, “Pastor Park Yong Gyu, a person can appear to be a true follower of Christ on the outside but God knows the heart.

There are multitudes of churches on the Earth and many of the churches are filled with many people. However, most of them are not true Christians. They are but church attendants. The true churches will firmly believe in Heaven and a Hell. The lives of many Christians are in chaos because they do not firmly believe in Heaven and Hell. When one soul enters Heaven, one thousand cursed souls enter Hell. The rate of Heaven and Hell is 1 to 1000.” (Matt 7:14)

Heaven & Hell 1000 to 1

Bishop Wilfred Lai is the founder and senior Pastor of Jesus Celebration Center in Mombasa, Kenya and it is a church of over 15,000 members. One day he asked the Lord how many of them were ready for heaven and the Lord told him only 200. Only 1% of that church is going to heaven! Dr. Lai said that some pastors have created large groups of sinners meeting in the name of God. “What you have are not churches, but large congregations of sinners.”

Message from Pastor Wilfred Lai

reply to post by charles1952

Excellent post, thanks Charles...

A few more facts:

7 out of 10 terrorist acts are attributable to 23 percent of the worlds population who subscribe to the Religion of Peace ®.

"70 percent of terrorist acts are attributable to those murdering in the name of a religion subscribed to by 23 percent of the world." dailycaller.com...

(Peshawar, Pakistan) - A doctor is among two Shiites shot to death by Lashkar-e-Jhagvi.

(Karachi, Pakistan) - A targeted shooting attack on three Ahmadi minorities at a bazaar leaves one dead.

(Damascus, Syria) - Fourteen people at a public square are ripped apart by Shahid suicide bombers.

(Kabul, Afghanistan) - A devout Muslim blows himself up outside a courthouse, taking seventeen other souls with him.

(Sadr City, Iraq) - Sunnis bomb a cafe popular with Shiites, killing at least four.

(Mosul, Iraq) - Five coordinated al-Qaeda bomb blasts leave two dozen people dead and over a hundred more in agony.

Islam's Latest Contributions to Peace

reply to post by Murgatroid

Dear Murgatroid,

Thanks, I appreciate the kind words.

Where I'm having trouble, is that the Muslims don't seem to want to (or be able to) say, "Yep, this whole situation is screwed up. A whole ton of our "beleivers" are going the wrong way, and we're willing to sit down with anybody who wants to help us fix this and return to peaceful relations."

I just can't see why this is so hard.

With respect,
Charles1952

Click here for more information.

Originally posted by bodrul
reply to post by mobiusmale

 

Religion doesn't start wars, its the homicidal control freaks who follow it that start wars
Religion has been used for centuries to justify butchering each other in the name of their gods or to control the people

end of the day if your deluded enough to think that religion is a force which has physical bearing on someone then you are very deluded

Religion is nothing more then a tool used by MAN, created by MAN

its not that hard to push an individual in the wrong direction, some divine being doesn't telepathically speak to the person and say go blow up that bus or go kill that abortion doctor, but a a Twisted individual with his or her own agenda

all religions are evil and good in sense.

Personally I think all you are deluded freaks who are barking up the wrong tree quoting scriptures from the bible, Quran and so on pointing out how my god/religion is less evil when in sense I have found on ATS most Christians are bloody hypocrite and same to Muslims and Jews

all these fools Preach hate towards others that dont follow their own faith by trying to discredit their counterparts with out context text (this has been done from the Torah, Bible, Quran)

*Jesus is in my heart* but screw you

end of the day all religions has their twisted individual who have their own personal agenda and the best thing about religion is how you can control the masses of sheep

* US UK West arming Fanatics
* US supporting Israel and its occupation
* US sanctions which has killed a lot of people
* US double standards in middle east
* US drone strikes which kill civilians
* US support of countries like Saudi and other wahbi led countries

end of the Day a book cant do jack all but used with something to cause harm and this is all religions as they all justify murder and peace, it just takes individuals to take these and use them how they see fit

* US gun crimes which kill thousands of people
* US armed forces which have killed thousands and since they are Christian, Christianity must be responsible as religion can act on its own

how about you work on the root cause of the problems?
since religion cant do anything and its up to individuals how they act
[snip]

Peace is when people will have limitless tolerance for others and their views. Balance between the opposites.

Moderation is the key.find balance accept to learn all other ideas. you will become educated appy man grabbing the good parts of all

reply to post by bodrul

May I try this a different way? I don't want you to be mad at me and a different approach might fix things.

There are many groups of people in the world who are doing bad things, sometimes it's even countries. There have been many criticisms on ATS about Israelis, Americans, Britons, North Koreans, Chinese, Iranians. I've seen severe criticism of Ireland, of all places.

There are also criticisms of people below the level of nations. Westboro Baptist Church, EDL, Sunni Muslims, Catholic Priests, etc. Each of the stories of these groups are different from the others. They have different goals, different motivations, methods, etc. Because they are all so different, it's difficult to compare one group to another, or apply the same remedy to their bad behavior.

What I would like to do is explore the group "Muslims." This is because there is a lot of fear about them, they seem to be very active, their goals and motivations are mysterious, and there in the news a lot. Those all may be false, but they're the reasons I'm particularly interested in them now and would like to explore it. It's not out of hatred for individuals, or religions, or races, or anything else other than that they're a big mystery which frightens a lot of people, and are in the news a lot.

Can we have a discussion on that basis?

With respect,
Charles1952

Who profits from the killing again?
Muslims?
hahahhaha
nope

Bush ( et al) didn't give out blanket immunities to all his corporate buddies for nothing

bankers make more in a day of war then in a day of peace
pretty simple to understand

oh, remember the skid of money that just disappeared in IRAQ?
what 8 BILLLION USD?
hohoho

anyone who thinks this is about religion is just cracked

reply to post by charles1952


You had the privilege of reading my previous reply and as I clearly stated
go out and Protest against the Root causes of the problem

as I recall I end with Enjoy using scripture from Holy books to try and put your point across
as all scripture can be used for evil and it takes the individuals to justify how they use it

to quote you

Originally posted by charles1952
reply to post by Murgatroid

 

Dear Murgatroid,

Thanks, I appreciate the kind words.

Where I'm having trouble, is that the Muslims don't seem to want to (or be able to) say, "Yep, this whole situation is screwed up. A whole ton of our "beleivers" are going the wrong way, and we're willing to sit down with anybody who wants to help us fix this and return to peaceful relations."

I just can't see why this is so hard.

With respect,
Charles1952

You say Muslims Should sit down and talk, I gave you a list of things and repeated it and bullet pointed it
again why I think its pointless and humorous

read my previous reply and what you read before it was deleted
and I have addressed that and cant be bothered to address anything else as to me


and I will be honest with you, its utter crap
you are using the middle east section for religious debate on how Muslims are cause of most terrorist attacks
when in terms of deaths Gun violence in America and US is higher in a year and the US in terms of First world country highest in the world

so in your terms Christan are more dangerous

US gun crimes along with Latin America
US invasion of two countries

You fail to want to look at Root causes of problems but jump on Religion instead and quote verses from the quran which mean jack all without fuel when it comes to justifying anything

anyhow I shall leave this topic as I may get banned for insulting everyone again for their deluded views on god and how religion plays the ultimate force in actions taken by people and not factoring the circumstances or what leads up to such violence

Have fun and enjoy

reply to post by bodrul

Dear bodrul,

It seems like you are making three points in your most recent post. (Four, if you count the threat to leave ATS.) May I respond?

It seems that your first point is that the US and other Western nations are causing a lot of suffering in the Middle East. I agree. Yes, they are. They are shooting and being shot there. They are not in any country whose government has asked them to leave. While I may question your examples, let's leave them be for a moment. You don't like the Nation of America or what it's doing. Got it.

But what, really does that have to do with a thread about Islamic terrorist violence? Unless you're saying, that because the US hasn't finished it's withdrawl from Afghanistan yet, it's a reason for Islamists to invade Mali and other areas which have nothing to do with the fighting?

Your second point seems to be that since most ofthe US soldiers fighting in a war are Christians, that is an example of Christian terrorism. But since most of the soldiers are male, will you claim that it's male terrorism? Just as the sex of the soldier has no bearing on the motivation of that soldier, neither does the religion of the soldier who is part of a national army following the orders of his duly appointed leaders up to and including the President.

Your third point is a request to work on the root cause of the problem. I assume you mean the problem of Muslim terrorism. Ok, fine. What do you think is the root cause? It can't be anger at the US, because there is terrorism going on in countries not affiliated with the US. Can it be anger at having Americans in the Mid-East? But we're leaving. Muslim attacks just provide arguments for staying longer. Is it our support for Israel? I hope you're not claiming that until we toss aside Israel as an ally, Muslims are going to kill aand blow things up all over the world?

So what is the root cause?

end of the Day a book cant do jack all but used with something to cause harm and this is all religions as they all justify murder and peace, it just takes individuals to take these and use them how they see fit

* US gun crimes which kill thousands of people

since religion cant do anything and its up to individuals how they act
[snip]

Sorry I couldn't make sense out of these lines. Let me know what you were thinking.

With respect,
Charles1952

Originally posted by charles1952
reply to post by bodrul

 

Dear bodrul,

It seems like you are making three points in your most recent post. (Four, if you count the threat to leave ATS.) May I respond?

It seems that your first point is that the US and other Western nations are causing a lot of suffering in the Middle East. I agree. Yes, they are. They are shooting and being shot there. They are not in any country whose government has asked them to leave. While I may question your examples, let's leave them be for a moment. You don't like the Nation of America or what it's doing. Got it.


Charles1952

Did I say I hate america or point out its actions in General which contribute to problems?
my threat to leave more to do with ATS Mod removing 20min typing

Originally posted by charles1952
reply to post by bodrul

 

But what, really does that have to do with a thread about Islamic terrorist violence? Unless you're saying, that because the US hasn't finished it's withdrawl from Afghanistan yet, it's a reason for Islamists to invade Mali and other areas which have nothing to do with the fighting?

Since My previous Reply was deleted which contained the response about the US financing Militant Islamic Groups and how they are funding extremists who are fighting their proxy wars

these groups are nothing more then splinter groups of Alqeda who have gotten more bolder over the years and thanks to weapons filtering down to them


*UK, France along with the US giving arms to Fanatics who are openly allied with terrosist like alquida

Originally posted by charles1952
Your second point seems to be that since most ofthe US soldiers fighting in a war are Christians, that is an example of Christian terrorism. But since most of the soldiers are male, will you claim that it's male terrorism? Just as the sex of the soldier has no bearing on the motivation of that soldier, neither does the religion of the soldier who is part of a national army following the orders of his duly appointed leaders up to and including the President.

So what is the root cause?

Most Muslim terrorist are Men, in your terms then these acts arent religious based but male terrorism?
The united states armed forces is majority christian and follow christian values and thus would fall under your category of religious control

most gun crime is committed by Christian males so this must mean Christianity is responsible

Originally posted by charles1952
Your second point seems to be that since most ofthe US soldiers fighting in a war are Christians, that is an example of Christian terrorism. But since most of the soldiers are male, will you claim that it's male terrorism? Just as the sex of the soldier has no bearing on the motivation of that soldier, neither does the religion of the soldier who is part of a national army following the orders of his duly appointed leaders up to and including the President.

So what is the root cause?

Originally posted by bodrul



* US UK West arming Fanatics
* US supporting Israel and its occupation
* US sanctions which has killed a lot of people
* US double standards in middle east
* US drone strikes which kill civilians
* US support of countries like Saudi and other wahbi led countries

end of the Day a book cant do jack all but used with something to cause harm and this is all religions as they all justify murder and peace, it just takes individuals to take these and use them how they see fit

* US gun crimes which kill thousands of people
* US armed forces which have killed thousands and since they are Christian, Christianity must be responsible as religion can act on its own

how about you work on the root cause of the problems?
since religion cant do anything and its up to individuals how they act
[snip]

edit on 12-6-2013 by bodrul because: if you guys delete this I am off ATS for good

edit on 12-6-2013 by elevatedone because: (no reason given)

end of the Day a book cant do jack all but used with something to cause harm and this is all religions as they all justify murder and peace, it just takes individuals to take these and use them how they see fit

* US gun crimes which kill thousands of people

since religion cant do anything and its up to individuals how they act
[snip]

Sorry I couldn't make sense out of these lines. Let me know what you were thinking.

Charles1962

I am sure you cant
but in very simple terms a Book is interpreted by man and its up to man how they translate and use a book/text

also stop signing your damn posts lol


Signed

Alpha Omega Charlie Wiski bored



dont expect anymore replies from me on this charade

reply to post by charles1952

Where I'm having trouble, is that the Muslims don't seem to want to (or be able to) say, "Yep, this whole situation is screwed up

The situation has been screwed up for years.

The time when US was passing patriot act , it was screwed up.

The time when UK helped Saudi family and made new sect , it was screwed up.

The time when two airplanes crashed into the buildings , it was screwed up.

The time when Saddam was helped and backed by west to invade Iran , it was screwed up.

The time when Saddam used WMD's on Iranian people , it was screwed up.

The time when US army invaded Afghanistan , it was screwed up.

The time when US army invaded Iraq , it was screwed up.


Remember , the more I write , the more the your hate increases even though it is what you asked. Because you are a hater no matter what grammar you use.But you can change it. This is bigotry. People know that you want to hate no matter what you hear. After hundred pages of debate you are the same bigot. Because you are here to change others. Even you like to change the truth.


But the question is who wants this on both sides ?

The puppets on Islam side , the war-mongers on the western side.

reply to post by mideast

Dear mideast,

The time when US was passing patriot act , it was screwed up.

The time when UK helped Saudi family and made new sect , it was screwed up.

The time when two airplanes crashed into the buildings , it was screwed up.

The time when Saddam was helped and backed by west to invade Iran , it was screwed up.

The time when Saddam used WMD's on Iranian people , it was screwed up.

The time when US army invaded Afghanistan , it was screwed up.

The time when US army invaded Iraq , it was screwed up.

Bodrul and I were both interested in finding root causes, but as he is no longer with us, may I ask if you think these are the root causes? Almost all of these things are either history or very soon will be. The exception is the Patriot Act, but I can't believe that act is the root cause of Muslim terrorism.

I know that you didn't intend that your list would be taken as root causes, but what do you think they are? Both sides can play "You did this. Well you did this," over the last 1500 years, but I really don't think that we'll get us anywhere.

But if you're not as interested in root causes, maybe we can look to the future. What should the Islamic states do to stop this terrorism, and what should the Western states do to stop it? I'm guessing that both sides could do something, but I need a different opinion.

With respect,
Charles1952

Originally posted by charles1952
reply to post by MrInquisitive

 

So when you count up all the attacks by Muslims, do everybody a favor and count up all the attacks by Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists and members of all other religious cults before singling out a particular religion for criticism of the violence of some of its adherents. It's rather easy to point the finger at the darker side of some religion or culture other than your own. Acknowledging the the dark side of your own culture, religion and/or nation is a bit more difficult for some.

Wonderful idea! So I did. 57% of the world's terrorist attacks were committed by Sunni Muslims, accounting for 70% of the deaths. (2011) The next highest category were political and secular attacks with the various Communist parties leading the list of those types of attacks.

Other religions? Nowhere near those two biggies.

Thanks for suggesting that I check the facts. Now, according to you, I can single out "a particular religion for criticism of the violence of some of it's adherents."

Obviously you aren't counting attacks by the US military, the CIA and its military contractors or attacks by the IDF. If you ask innocent villagers being terrorized on a regular basis by drones, I'm sure that they would call the drone attacks terrorism.

I'd also be curious to see violent crime statistics in the US split out by the religion of the perpetrator. I really doubt all the murders and assaults in the US are being conducted by Atheists and Agnostics -- especially violent crimes in the Bible Belt.