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It shouldn't matter if you aren't doing anything wrong

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posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 09:06 PM
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Originally posted by defcon5
Nobody made a big fuss when they passed the Patriot Act.


Because it was right after 9/11, W assured the people it was to help fight terrorism, the average citizen had not, and probably still has not read the damned thing, and really, what "good american" is gonna question something as wholesome-sounding as the "Patriot Act"? which is why nobody really argued with Iraq, even though it made no sense to anyone with a brain. There are still people who believe that Iraq had WMD, and that they had a hand in 9/11, even though both have been proven false.



Few said anything when they started holding people without due process.


Because they were brown people, the media told us they were terrorists, and after 9/11, the media made people believe that ALL brown people were potential terrorists.



No one got in trouble when they were resorting to torture.


because the people being tortured were: brown, "terrorists", and/or "Insurgents/enemy combatants", and it was to help protect 'murrica



Nothing was said when they began assassinating US citizens.


Because they were either: A: Brown, B: Terrorists, or C: Brown Terrorists



Mum was the word when they started issuing biometric ID's and installing facial recognition tracking everywhere.


Because the average citizen is completely oblivious to these things...most times, if it ain't on fox, CNN, twitter, or facebook, the average citizen doesn't know much, if anything, about it...and if they have heard about it, they usually support it, because they were lied to, and told it was more secure, or to prevent identity theft, or to help combat terrorism...because, you know....brown people are everywhere, and they're frickin' SCARY




You honestly expect them not to take the next step down “police state avenue”?


I dunno, this time is a little different....it's being reported EVERYWHERE now, and it's being painted as a bad thing...not the usual media spin of "it's not that bad", or "it's for your own good", or "it's to fight brown people half a world away", or "it's a conspiracy theory"




posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 09:15 PM
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Originally posted by Logarock
reply to post by DeadSeraph
 


There was an NSA guy on TV yesterday talking about all the personal security measures he had to deal with on a daily basis........and made it clear that he felt it was no big deal if average Joe and Jane had to put up with some of this in their personal life/communications ect. Really?


which is absolutely laughable, because there is a HUGE difference between "CIA Officer", and "United States Citizen"...one is a high-clearance, very security-oriented civil service vocation, and the other is a status of civil citizenry....

trying to compare the two is utterly asinine, and shows just how far out of touch with reality these people are..



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 09:20 PM
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Originally posted by TheBlackHat
Yes I have indeed noticed the "I dont care if Im monitored" attitude, for a very long time. To be frank, I am one of those who doesnt really care.
Ill explain why. I am not naive enough to think that the internet in not monitored 24/7. I know TPTB read all emails etc, or at least have access to them. And that's the deal we make with the devil, when we use the internet. You give up your privacy for quick emails and message boards and easily accessible porn etc. The thing is, I know my internet usage is pretty much no different for most of the population. So they aint gonna find much of interest with me or 80-90 percent of everyone else. So their monitoring the entire population is a waste of time.
Thats the first point.

Secondly its obvious that any "terrorist" or such as, would have to be pretty damned stupid to make plans over the internet...pretty dumb...and any "terrorist" they catch from using the internet probably wasnt that dangerous in the first place, more likely just some idiot or lunatic who likes to rant or fantasize online.
So monitoring the internet is also a waste of time if the objective is to catch terrorists...even tony soprano was smart enough to use pay phones...etc.

The intelligence community cant be that stupid...so the real reason for monitoring everyone is not to catch terrorists etc...the real reason is to cause mass paranoia...and coerce everyone to be submissive..or else.
Also this "leaked" information that they are monitoring everyone...how leaked is it really?? seriously. They want to reinforce the message that "WE ARE WATCHING YOUR EVERY MOVE". Well only an authoritarian parent would want to make children believe that, so they behave like well trained drones.

We have seen this pattern of behavior in the USSR..and we will see it again and again in the future. The Stazi had files on every citizen, and the west cried foul back in the day, about police states and big brother authoritarian regimes... but the FBI had files on everyone too..or almost...or was that the CIA.

So you have history repeating itself..as it always does anyhow. Lets face it, we do not need cell phones, we do not "need" the internet. And perhaps we should all just quit making it so easy for "them" to monitor us. i mean how much less full of anxiety would you be if you knew you couldn't be monitored? So opt out of the technological BS, it hasn't improved your life, just allowed you to become monitored voluntarily. Of course if you know you made a willing deal with the devil in the first place, the first time you used the internet, then you already accepted you gave up your privacy.

To me its much like drinking alcohol or smoking...there are potential consequences that people like to forget about...thats the internet.
edit on 8-6-2013 by TheBlackHat because: (no reason given)


show me the contract for the internet that says i legally waive my constitutional right to privacy.

as to opting out of internet usage...you first. i could do with a few less ignorant posts to reply to.



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 09:26 PM
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Originally posted by kingofmd
There is nothing that can be done. This world's history has been written in that book that most of you hate. The Antichrist and one world govt system will happen just as it was described 2000+ years ago. Repent and put your trust in the Savior before its too late. Or, you can just continue to mock and ridicule and take the mark of the beast like a good hell bound goat.


give up and bend over, if you like...cling to your book of desert fairy tales, and superstitious bronze- age mysticism......the rest of us will be at the adults table, discussing the implications of the recent news, and debating the facts and issues at hand..



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 09:58 PM
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On the face of things, you APPEAR to be so frustratingly stupid, it makes me wanna scream....

then i entertain the idea that you could be a paid agitator...not sure which is true, but i'll go with the hunch that you're not bright enough to get PAID to piss people off.


Originally posted by Sankari
* All of these initiatives began under Bush--most of them in 2001--which mean they've been running for 12 years already. The fact that most people were totally unaware of this until now proves these initiatives had no discernible impact on the lives of the people being monitored. If something runs for 12 years without changing your life in any perceptible way, it's difficult to get angry about it when you finally learn what's been going on.


That's. Not. The. Point.

it doesn't MATTER if it's had no discernible impact on the average citizen's life..it's still wrong, they still have no right, and it's still none of their damned business.

hypothetically, if you found out that i'd been tapping into your webcam, and watching you have sex for the last 5 years, you'd probably be pretty angry about that. you'd probably get even angrier when you found out i had a pinhole camera in your shower head as well...

it had no discernible impact on your life, but it was still wrong, was it not?



* All of these initiatives are 100% legal, and have operated with complete court approval. This makes it difficult to claim that civil liberties and constitutional rights are being infringed. Moreover, as previously noted, the alleged infringement of civil liberties has gone completely unnoticed by the alleged victims for 12 years, which suggests (a) there was no actual infringement, or (b) there was, but it didn't actually change anything. Either way, people have nothing to be frightened about. It seems that for the vast majority of people, 'you have nothing to fear if you've done nothing wrong' is entirely correct.


"100% legal"? "alleged infringement of civil liberties"? look, i understand that you're not from these united states, and that you are most likely not entirely familiar with our laws, but it doesn't take a genius to know that spying on your citizens is probably not legal, and that doing so constitutes a MASSIVE violation of basic human rights..

i mean, what you're basically saying here is that "it's completely ok to break the law, as long as nobody notices" that's bollocks..

"you have nothing to fear if you've done nothing wrong" is the same bulls**t rationale used by the brownshirts, the SS, the Stasi, Cheka, OGPU, NKVD, NKGB, MGB, KGB, FSB, and every other secret police organization throughout history...it was bulls**t then, it's still bulls**t now, and it will continue to be bulls**t in the future..



On a final note, I think it's amusing that conspiracy theorists are claiming vindication on the grounsd that 'This is what we said all along.' I have two thoughts about that.

Firstly, considering the conspiracy theorist community has about 5 million consiracy theories on its plate at any given time--and constantly produces new ones--it's not entirely unexpected that one of them will at least appear to be correct... EVENTUALLY.

Secondly, can anyone direct me to a conspiracy theorist who accurately predicted these Bush-implemented data monitoring initiatives long before they were implemented? I doubt it. Most conspiracy theories are either too specific to be fulfilled by anything but the most extraordinary set of details--which are so unlikely that they never eventuate--or so vague that a subjective interpreter can consider them 'fulfilled' under almost any circumstances whatsoever (just like religious 'prediction.'

This issue is not 'bigger than Watergate.' Watergate was illegal. By contrast, these Bush-implemented data monitoring initiatives are entirely legal.


i find it amusing that you are so delusional that you can type out such complete idiocy, and not feel the least bit bad about it..you seem awfully focused on downplaying the severity of this issue, and marginalizing "conspiracy theorists"

see, you call people who pay attention to the world around them "conspiracy theorists", we call them "keen observers", or "astute individuals", or "reasonable, intelligent human beings".

you want a "phrophecy"?

I know AJ is not terribly popular here, but he has read on air, MSM reports about this sort of thing for years...before a few days ago, when the MSM reported this stuff, it was always in the middle of the night, when nobody was watching, or was published in a newspaper, in the back, probably in the wrong section, in the smallest print they could get away with...

we've known about google and facebook for years...and verizon for nearly 2 decades now..

i dunno, maybe you ARE being paid for this....i don't think anyone is THIS stupid.

all i know for sure is, much like your stated mood, i facepalm every time i hafta reply to one of your posts



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 10:05 PM
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reply to post by Daedalus
 

You deserve many stars for this:




it doesn't MATTER if it's had no discernible impact on the average citizen's life..it's still wrong, they still have no right, and it's still none of their damned business.

hypothetically, if you found out that i'd been tapping into your webcam, and watching you have sex for the last 5 years, you'd probably be pretty angry about that. you'd probably get even angrier when you found out i had a pinhole camera in your shower head as well...

it had no discernible impact on your life, but it was still wrong, was it not?


But I can only give you one.

Very well put !



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 10:09 PM
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Originally posted by beatbox
I'm with you 100%....but what can we do about it. We can type and talk till our faces are blue but at the end of they day, they will do what they want. Pass the laws that they want. Kill us if they want. What can we do? How do we fight this BS? The only thing I see is, dropping off the radar but how hard will that be? People don't want to rock the boat. They're too comfortable...so can you blame them?


What can we really do about it? Serious question...


Getting used to it is all we can do. The real question is who's hands do we want this technology in?



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 10:23 PM
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reply to post by DeadSeraph
 


Just a hanful of short comments about your first post...

If you are doing nothing wrong, why shouldn't they be able to routinely stop you in the street for "stop and frisk", seatbelt check points, and drunk driving check points.

If you are doing nothing wrong, how about putting surveillance cameras on the streets?

If you are doing nothing wrong, then you shouldn't be concerned while some TIA grabs your crotch.

Enough already! When will it stop? Our phones and internet connections were supposed to be the last shred of privacy we had left! We all need to stop and think. Perhaps it is time for all of these to be taken to the Supreme Court!



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 10:33 PM
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Originally posted by Rocker2013

Originally posted by Sankari
* All of these initiatives began under Bush--most of them in 2001--which mean they've been running for 12 years already. The fact that most people were totally unaware of this until now proves these initiatives had no discernible impact on the lives of the people being monitored. If something runs for 12 years without changing your life in any perceptible way, it's difficult to get angry about it when you finally learn what's been going on.


There is no evidence that the extensive nature of this monitoring has been in effect for those 12 years. There is evidence to suggest that the massive trawling of data is comparatively new. Take a look at the leaked powerpoint presentation and you can see that Apple only joined the collective of data gathering last year.

These companies have not been allowing access to their systems for 12 years, to suggest so is false. In addition, those companies are denying that they gave permission for their systems to be open to such intrusion, meaning - if true - the US government has been ILLEGALLY hacking and mining the data of PRIVATE companies.


Originally posted by Sankari
* All of these initiatives are 100% legal, and have operated with complete court approval. This makes it difficult to claim that civil liberties and constitutional rights are being infringed. Moreover, as previously noted, the alleged infringement of civil liberties has gone competely unnoticed by the alleged victims for 12 years, which suggests (a) there was no actual infringement, or (b) there was, but it didn't actually change anything. Either way, people have nothing to be frightened about. It seems that for the vast majority of people, 'you have nothing to fear if you've done nothing wrong' is entirely correct.


They most certainly are not legal.
If the NSA, DHS, FBI and CIA (etc) have been accessing the private computer systems of private companies without presenting those companies with the legal requests and permissions to do so they are a fundamental breach of law.

The law, as I understand it, does not allow the UK or US governments to spy on their own citizens without individual court requests. Even if one of those parties requests another government or foreign agency to do so on their behalf, they are still gaining that information ILLEGALLY.

If I pay someone to hack the computer systems of a bank and transfer funds to me, am I innocent? Have I not taken part in a crime? The same applies here.

The fact that a crime has taken place is not rendered irrelevant simply because the criminal party has used another party to break the law for them.


Originally posted by Sankari
This issue is not 'bigger than Watergate.' Watergate was illegal. By contrast, these Bush-implemented data monitoring initiatives are entirely legal.
edit on 8/6/13 by Sankari because: (no reason given)


See above.
The documents leaked suggest that under PRISM these agencies have access to the computer systems of private companies such as Google, Microsoft, Apple, Facebook and others. Google has stated on record that they have not supplied this access and only comply with legal requests for information on individuals when presented with a legal request for that specific information. So if access is possible as stated in the documents outlining PRISM, and these companies have not provided that access, then the only reasonable explanation is that these government agencies have illegally hacked and mined the private data of private individuals through attacking private companies.


The issue with this argument is that it is utter bulls**t....it doesn't hold up..

OF COURSE the named companies are going to backpedal, and claim no knowledge, and no involvement...

do you honestly think they would openly acknowledge their involvement with something like this to the general public? they'd be put out of business by the people....their first obligation is to their shareholders, not their country of origin, and their sole priority is the corporate bottom line..

they were in on it, they KNOW they were in on it, and now they're trying to cover their asses. it's just that simple.



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 10:37 PM
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Originally posted by Djayed
reply to post by DeadSeraph
 


Really I expected them to monitor everything after 9/11. Phone, email, credit cards, viewing habits, browsing habits. They probably have some algorithm to say, hey maybe we should look into this guy based on A,D, and H.


Why is 9/11 any different than say; the Kennedy assassination, or Oklahoma City, or the first WTC bombing?

In those, a good man died, a building was destroyed (with lots of dead people), and a national icon was attacked.

invoking 9/11 as justification for all of this is...i dunno...not entirely stupid, or idiotic...it's...insane..

saying you EXPECTED everything to be monitored after 9/11, is like saying you EXPECTED brown people to be killed for being brown...it makes no sense..



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 10:57 PM
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Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101
Let's all calm down and deal RATIONALLY over the situation, so that we all may not become manipulated by others to become canon fodder of those whom have intentions to divide, hurt and harm.


1. Most citizens fear such intrusions of privacy and is real, for none of us, none is an angel. Let' be honest, for only in acknowledging truths can we ever hope to find solutions.

We do not want such information to be archive and some years later down the road, when we had matured and changed, be held accountable or blackmailed for our past discretions, more so for those who are seeking for public office.

Today, President Obama's administration may be benevolent, and will not do such a thing, but what about FUTURE administrations with such powers of information on their hands? Will they, can they, be as benevolent?


2. Equally, let us be honest too that there are evil persons HIDING in our midst whom do have the intentions to cause hurt and harm to others, such as criminals, pedophiles, bankers, corrupted,racists, discriminatorists, druggies, terrorists, insane minds, etc whom uses our communications systems to carry out their atrocities upon innocent humans.

The greatest trick the Devil had done is to prove that he does not exist. And those evil misanthropes hiding in our midst had done the same, using our laws and liberty against us, and the deluded support them in crying that they do not exists in our midst, as if an evil misanthrope would put on a shirt which says 'I am a criminal, arrest me now'.

NSA and FBI have a duty to defend and protect by all means possible, even stopping crimes and attack before it can happen and hurt caused to innocents.

Its act and approved by the judiciary was meant to protect and defend innocent civilians, and there are safeguards within that jurisdiction to not use it for anything else which will not be upheld by the judiciary in a court of law except for what is meant for - stopping crimes and terrorism.


3. BUT MOST CRITICALLY OF ALL - WHO leaked this NSA info?

NSA is an uber secret agency and YET - it had proven itself vulnerable, to have its secret information revealed not only to the public, but to the criminals and terrorists as well, whom will now take better precautions to avoid detection so that they can kill, hurt and harm MORE innocents.

WHO LEAKED THE INFO?

And WORSE, the timing was just right for China's President Xi visit to USA, a time when USA was going to confront China to hold them accountable for stealing american tech and science secrets, but now that the press is going on a circus villifying the american govt of spying on its own people - never mind that it was for a different purpose - USA will have a hard time to convince China who is laughing behind their backs.


WHO IN NSA SOLD OUT USA'S SECRETS TO CHINA WHO LEAKED IT TO THE UK AND USA PRESS who then went to the circus with it???

May the pepertrator be caught, and NSA's liberal governance that resulted in organizational negligence be tightened up, or worse will happen if leaking national secrets becomes a hobby of those whom had sworned to defend and protect America in such secret organizations.



what i see here is just plain weird, and a little misguided...

do you believe this is not a big deal?

do you believe that the one who leaked it did something wrong?

do you believe the federal government is JUSTIFIED in it's actions, with respect to this specific program?

do you believe the current administration is benevolent?

if the answer to any of these is "yes", then you have a LOT to learn.

you also kinda hurt your argument by invoking religious claptrap...such things have no place in a rational debate..



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 11:00 PM
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Originally posted by MichiganSwampBuck
The frog has been in the pot for a long time and the water is too hot to jump out now.

My GF has the attitude, "Were you hurting before?"

A good friend we know had it all going for him. He owned a couple of nice properties, a nice house and big pole barn, he worked from home doing CAD, he married his sweetheart, then he got involved in the sovereignty movement. His attitude changed and he lost his job, got blackballed, lost his property, got divorced and now DJs for a living. Drugs and alcohol were not a factor in this guy's life.

He wasn't hurting before he saw the "truth" about the system, ignorance is bliss. He's not in a great place now by comparison. He never got out of the system either.

This is basically how the better half thinks of all this, "go along to get along" and as my Great Grandmother would say, "Dats da vay it is. Vhat you gonna do?"
edit on 8-6-2013 by MichiganSwampBuck because: Typo


some people can't handle the truth....they go mad with fear and paranoia.....

i've known the truth for a long time, and it's not destroyed me.

i am sorry for your friend's misfortune, i truly am, but this mentality of not questioning the status quo, and never rocking the boat, simply will not do...



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 11:03 PM
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Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101

Originally posted by InverseLookingGlass
Propaganda has conditioned people to be more afraid of terrorism than Fascism in the US.
Propaganda has installed "you're either with us or against us" binary thinking.

That's all you need.


Terrorism and crimes are NOT propaganda. They are real and exists in our world.

The only propaganda that exists are the screams of lies that terrrorism and crimes did not happen, it cannot be stopped and all humans die only of natural old age.


conversely, claiming terrorism where none exists, for the purposes of frightening and intimidating the citizenry into compliance with unjust measures IS propaganda....

the federal government HAS committed crimes, and not all the terrorism they hype on the news channels is genuine..



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 11:07 PM
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Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101

Originally posted by Mizzijr
reply to post by DeadSeraph
 


What's next? FEMA Camps discovered? Maybe somebody's kids have to be taken away for some fire to light inside them.


Fema camps? wow! What a mind you have as a contribution to this thread, and following your example of greatness in unsubstantiated beliefs as great thinking, may I share the following? -

I would prefer if the next thing ALLEGED discovered is that ELVIS IS ALIVE!!!!!!......hehe....


"unsubstantiated beliefs"?

dude....seriously.....go away......come back when you get a clue..



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 11:37 PM
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Originally posted by defcon5
reply to post by ButterCookie
 

The fourth amendment grants you the right to be free from unreasonable search and seizure, and technically the ninth amendment.


what is absolutely SHOCKING to me is that people don't already KNOW this.....

THIS is what is wrong with these united states today.....the schools don't teach, the kids don't learn, and later on, they don't give enough of a s**t to go looking for knowledge on their own, because they already got their schoolin' so they think they know all there is to know.

jesus, how in the hell do we combat THIS level of ignorance?
edit on 10-6-2013 by Daedalus because: winning



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 11:54 PM
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Originally posted by Bluesma

Originally posted by kkrattiger
reply to post by Bluesma
 


I disagree with your premise... Your apathetic "Im not a criminal so nuthin to hide, & never expected privacy in the first place" stance, & your analogy of living in a town being akin to this subject. What, do you think this is just a big 'ol community? The whole internet? The problem with your statement is that there is no pavement & ground tech used throughout the city limits which records every movement, by whom, to where, for what & how long, on a regular basis?, ...


I can only guess you have never lived in a small village. There are people who sit on their porch and watch all movements going on by community members- one couple here had a notebook for keeping track. Everyone knows if you missed your bowel movement in the morning, or if you failed to provoke an orgasm for your wife that night, or what you said at that banquet and to whom.

But like I said to the other person, if it really bothers you for some reason, pull out!
You have a choice.

If your insults and calling me pathetic and all were such a big worry for me, I would not post on public message boards, right? Recognizing I have a choice is useful to keep in mind.
edit on 9-6-2013 by Bluesma because: (no reason given)


there's a HUGE difference between the town busybody being the town busybody, and the federal government keeping tabs on the citizenry for an as yet unknown purpose....

one is harmless, the other is unmistakably sinister, and dangerous (potentially destructive) to the general welfare of the public...

but hey, what do you care, you moved to france, so it's not as if it impacts you in the same way it impacts those of us who are still here...

AMIRITE?
edit on 10-6-2013 by Daedalus because: winning



posted on Jun, 10 2013 @ 12:03 AM
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Originally posted by FurvusRexCaeli

Originally posted by HUMBLEONE
reply to post by terriblyvexed
 


You can bet that the NSA is listening, watching and recording this very thread....searching...for violations...gross deviations from the party line, the rules of the Matrix...always searching... AND BY DOING SO, VIOLATING THE CONSTITUTION

In what way? Which clause of the Constitution says, "The NSA shall not read the public ATS forums?"

Am I violating the Constitution by reading the public ATS forums? NB, I am not an NSA employee or contractor, just curious.


you're joking, right?

Please tell me, you're being sarcastic...



posted on Jun, 10 2013 @ 02:44 AM
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reply to post by DeadSeraph
 



LOL! "Put your emotions aside..."
Yeah, I'M the one upset.


I'm not concerned. I have a life that is not of interest to the government. I have watched your video. I remain in the same state of non-concern.

I actually get more concerned about uncle Joe (or in my case, Jean-Michel, more likely..) Because one rumor of having said a comment that is not acceptable in this community can mean I will no longer get my mail, cannot buy bread, will be refused gasoline or fuel for heating, and suddenly cannot have an appointment to have my hair cut or my car fixed, or even a job. My neighbor had something of that sort happen, the community was able to make him sell his home and leave with his family.

But even that, I recognize is not the end of the world if it happens. And in the big picture, even the Nazi reign came to an end one day. I do not object to others feeling the personal drive to influence events of this sort in their own lifetime- if you feel it go for it. I only stand up for my right to focus my concern on more immediate and close to home things- like the homeless or sick person next to me, right now.

This world needs many different points of view and activity, and even if you feel you have a big mission to change the political world, you can recognize that there are ALSO other concerns that others need to focus on instead at the same time, no?

Or I guess not. That is what the OP was all about, wasn't it? An inability to understand how a person can actually spend more energy and concern on daily care of problems close to them instead of researching and posting about the CIA on internet? I guess it will remain a mystery for some, an it is not I that make you comprehend.




posted on Jun, 10 2013 @ 02:51 AM
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Originally posted by Daedalus



there's a HUGE difference between the town busybody being the town busybody, and the federal government keeping tabs on the citizenry for an as yet unknown purpose....

one is harmless, the other is unmistakably sinister, and dangerous (potentially destructive) to the general welfare of the public...

but hey, what do you care, you moved to france, so it's not as if it impacts you in the same way it impacts those of us who are still here...

AMIRITE?


Read the above response. I would just be repeating same to you.



posted on Jun, 10 2013 @ 03:04 AM
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Originally posted by Daedalus


i'm kinda curious why you believe this thread is "overt provocation", and "public insults and all" against you personally? are you so deluded that you think everything is about you?


About me? I made no such claim. I humorously acknowledged the public and generalized invitation to opposing opinion through provocation. I never claimed it was an invite to any individual in particular. If I start a thread with a generalized insult and name calling of "people who have this ____ opinion" then I do so with the intent of attracting people of that opinion to come and defend it, as the OP did. But it is not targetting an individual.




near as i can tell, this thread is about the OP's bewilderment with regard to the lack of public rage on the part of the citizenry of these united states, with respect to the "revelation" that companies have been providing information about them to the federal government, in direct violation of the law, and guaranteed rights and civil liberties, as defined, and declared in the constitution, and bill of rights.


Got it. Got it then, got it now. The parts of the public who lack the outrage are responding to try to explain and cure his/her "bewilderment".




It's not about you. you'd do well to get over yourself.


Oh stop the childish attempts at painting the woman as "emotional". That is a useless tactic in debate, and cowardly. I never claimed it was about me, and did not feel it was.

For the rest of this particular post, I refer back to the response I just made to your other one.



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