This Has To Stop...It Really Does

page: 1
10

log in

join

posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 10:30 AM
link   
Some of you will be aware of the almost endless list of companies who pay very little or NO Corporate Tax in the UK. Google, Starbucks, McDonalds etc.

Yet again we find ourselves in the same old, same old. Companies using legal loopholes to get out of it. The most recent being Vodafone.

According to Sky News, even after over £5,000,000,000 in UK sales, they paid a massive £0.

The UK at the moment is on the band wagon of blaming all the welfare claimants for the countries mess, not the banks, the elite, the tax avoiding companies etc...but the guys struggling to feed their families and get a job.

These loop holes should be closed as a matter of urgency. Is it any wonder the UK is in such a mess? Is it any wonder why we are the laughing stock of Europe.




Mobile phone giant Vodafone paid no UK corporation tax for the second year running, despite earning more than £5bn of revenues in Britain.

The Berkshire-based group said investment in its UK network and interest payments more than wiped out corporation tax liabilities during the year to the end of March, although it paid around £3bn of tax overseas




posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 10:39 AM
link   
Totally agree.

All taxes over the world need to be scrapped. and re-instituted at something very simple like this:

All businesses/corporations pay tax at 30% of profits earn't in this country. (NO MORE LOOPHOLES). Basically force any company who wants to do business in that country has to open a bank account in that country where the profits /revenue earn't in that country go into and operating costs come out of. It will make it easier for auditors too.

All individuals pay tax at the varying percentages of how much they earn depending on how much they earn, etc, like up to $10,000 no tax, anything over $10,000 15% tax. Anything over $30,000 is taxed at 30% and anything over $60,000 35% tax, etc or whatever is reasonable at those income levels...
edit on 7-6-2013 by DaRAGE because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 10:44 AM
link   
A flat tax structure would make a flat reality for all. From the poor man in the street to the CEO in the corner suite.

% can change as the scale does, but there ought to be that %. Period. No write offs....no credits...no exceptions. Period. End of story. Full Stop, now pay up and shut up is what I'd have to say to the Companies and Business around the world.

I'll bet the increase in revenue by just seeing everyone actually pay their bill as they've always supposed to, would see revenue to all major governments jump like no one would quite believe. Of course the base of corruption and power rests in manipulation of the tax code. Follow the money...as always. So it's not likely to ever happen.



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 11:05 AM
link   
They've said it's all been reinvested in the UK


That's from the head.......who makes 11 million a year........sounded German/Swiss/Dutch ........wonder if he's paying income tax.......



Which has kinda made me wonder a little off topic with my frustrated mind but the bilderberg group describe themselves as

"The group describes the conference as "a forum for informal, off-the-record discussions about megatrends and the major issues facing the world"

They've been doing this since 54
If what they say is true why the hell haven't they sorted anything significant out since 2008 or even foresee and avoid it
These guys are the heads of commerce, banking, national and international policy makers and CEO's

I mean come on these guys get together every year to sort major issues ....... But we still seem to get screwed over and they get richer ...............flarn flarn filth


Soz for the mini rant op
edit on 7-6-2013 by Neocrusader because: Added



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 11:06 AM
link   
It is utterly insane to punish successful businesses with tax reforms specifically aimed at reducing their profits. If these corporations have found ways of minimising their tax, good for them!

The more money they make, the more they put back into the economy and the more they can grow. This benefits everyone.

A 30% flat tax is madness. You would destroy the business sector in 12 months, forcing hundreds of companies to close and many others to go offshore. If a corporation is legally paying 5% tax, what right does the government have to increase its burden by 500%? None whatsoever!

Higher taxation = class envy. Flat tax with no so-called 'loopholes' = wealth redistribution, which is neo-Marxism.



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 11:21 AM
link   
reply to post by jrmcleod
 


The problem is, when we demand more money in taxes from these corporations, there are other countries willing to demand less to get them to move there. It's a race to the bottom for taxes, and it's the people who are left to pick up the tab.

The only solution to this is blackmail. The government should immediately announce a fair rate of tax, removing the right for a corporation to take HMRC to court to avoid it, and then threaten a national boycott of their products or services if they refuse.

It's about time the people started putting their money where their mouth is. If Vodafone doesn't want to pay fair tax in the UK, we should not be giving them our business. I would prefer that it's us making that decision rather than the government banning them from operating here, but to be honest I've pretty much had enough of this charade.

Boycotts work, but we need the government on this too. That's not likely to happen when these corporations have such cozy relationships with our elected.



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 11:22 AM
link   

Originally posted by jrmcleod
Some of you will be aware of the almost endless list of companies who pay very little or NO Corporate Tax in the UK. Google, Starbucks, McDonalds etc.

Yet again we find ourselves in the same old, same old. Companies using legal loopholes to get out of it. The most recent being Vodafone.

According to Sky News, even after over £5,000,000,000 in UK sales, they paid a massive £0.

The UK at the moment is on the band wagon of blaming all the welfare claimants for the countries mess, not the banks, the elite, the tax avoiding companies etc...but the guys struggling to feed their families and get a job.

These loop holes should be closed as a matter of urgency. Is it any wonder the UK is in such a mess? Is it any wonder why we are the laughing stock of Europe.




Mobile phone giant Vodafone paid no UK corporation tax for the second year running, despite earning more than £5bn of revenues in Britain.

The Berkshire-based group said investment in its UK network and interest payments more than wiped out corporation tax liabilities during the year to the end of March, although it paid around £3bn of tax overseas


you point your finger at the wrong people. The government allows them to have these tax loop holes. If you want them closed, kick all the bums out of Parliament



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 11:27 AM
link   
Still the belief that when a successful company 'legally minimises' it taxes, it will be recirculated into the economy, the same old line of taxing less on the rich that the republican party LIED to the american People, and only saw the middle classes and poor socializing debts but rich privatizing profits?

During a crash or a poor economy situation, money seemed to disappear in the market with less being circulated. Money DO NOT disappear. It only went into hoarding, by the rich who refuses to circulate their wealth and thus the entire financial eco-system collapses.

When companies 'minimizes' their taxes instead of being outright honest in paying the rightful dues, those money only went into being hoarded up in banks or under their bed, leaving nothing or at best a little in the market when it is most needed to fund social expenditure of which those very same companies became successful from, as with NO schooling, no roads, no health, etc - where the heck will workers and increase in productivity and technology come from?

It's a no brainer.


Flat tax system works very well but ONLY when the national economy is humming along well.

However, when the economy stutters, the tax system can be used as a tool to fire back up the economy, such as tax breaks for companies willing to use their profits to hire more workers or increase productivity, tax increases for still booming companies to help share in firing up the economy through greater share of wealth, etc, etc.

OP is right. The shirking of responsible duty to society through legal or illegal tax cheating is unconscionable and MUST stop, because if the masses are the ones to socialize debts, they will one day have no more money to spend and will only starve, while the rich are getting richer as deflation sets in and in the end when no goods or services are produced, may the last human teach a monkey to bury him when he dies.



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 11:27 AM
link   

Originally posted by Sankari
It is utterly insane to punish successful businesses with tax reforms specifically aimed at reducing their profits. If these corporations have found ways of minimising their tax, good for them!

The more money they make, the more they put back into the economy and the more they can grow. This benefits everyone.


The problem is that this is a myth.
A minor % of that profit actually goes back into the economy.

Look at any local economy anywhere in the world and you will see the same thing. Corporations are designed to do one thing; make profit at all cost. That's the soulless nature of corporate business. Because of this, money is sucked out of communities. A small amount is paid back in the form of wages, but in comparison to what ten smaller local businesses would do to actually support a small economy, a corporation is like a steamroller mowing its way through and funneling everything OUT of that community - usually to offshore accounts and shareholders living in luxury apartments in Manhattan.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I sometime wonder if you're a troll. Then I remember politicians like Bachman and Palin and I get a shiver of realization that there really are people like you out there in the world



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 11:28 AM
link   
reply to post by Sankari
 


Your explanations and logic would give an economics professor a nervous breakdown at the level of remedial education required. It's kinda confusing and kinda scary to see that logic thrown out, not as opinion or supported fact, with non-msm sources to back it ....but as a self declared set of facts to talk down across a discussion with. Wrong...is the best word.

One of your posts is also describing trickle down economics as a winner. Well, it looked like it on paper? However, with economic lag and all things considered? I'd say the economic malaise and slump under George H.W. Bush to follow Reagan's trickle down efforts show that what we get trickled down onto us isn't wealth or good tidings ...but evidence someone needs potty trained in the Governments and leadership that continue to try that system, IMO.

@ Thread

Here is a chart of Corp taxes, world wide and for 2006-2013.

World Corporate Tax Rates

BTW... The US is the highest at 40%...and highest by far. So much for top tax rates equating to anything like successful outcome. Perhaps if even a fraction of that was actually paid by the largest corps? It would mean something.

Anyway, what burns my buns is what the UK Tax rate IS, as it so happens. 23%. Among the lowest...and yet, the corps can't even pony up that much. Oh yeah, the system needs reform alright. Stop setting tax rates normal people must follow at penalty of prison or total ruin......and business just laughs at while they dial their accounting and legal departments to make it go away.



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 11:35 AM
link   

Originally posted by Rocker2013

Originally posted by Sankari
It is utterly insane to punish successful businesses with tax reforms specifically aimed at reducing their profits. If these corporations have found ways of minimising their tax, good for them!

The more money they make, the more they put back into the economy and the more they can grow. This benefits everyone.


The problem is that this is a myth.
A minor % of that profit actually goes back into the economy.

Look at any local economy anywhere in the world and you will see the same thing. Corporations are designed to do one thing; make profit at all cost. That's the soulless nature of corporate business. Because of this, money is sucked out of communities. A small amount is paid back in the form of wages, but in comparison to what ten smaller local businesses would do to actually support a small economy, a corporation is like a steamroller mowing its way through and funneling everything OUT of that community - usually to offshore accounts and shareholders living in luxury apartments in Manhattan.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I sometime wonder if you're a troll. Then I remember politicians like Bachman and Palin and I get a shiver of realization that there really are people like you out there in the world


Oh thank you for so eloquently putting what so many have been thinking.......and even had a 404'd thread about

post removed by mods in 3,2,.......meh take my points you know it's true .....1
edit on 7-6-2013 by Neocrusader because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 11:35 AM
link   

Originally posted by Sankari
It is utterly insane to punish successful businesses with tax reforms specifically aimed at reducing their profits. If these corporations have found ways of minimising their tax, good for them!

The more money they make, the more they put back into the economy and the more they can grow. This benefits everyone.

A 30% flat tax is madness. You would destroy the business sector in 12 months, forcing hundreds of companies to close and many others to go offshore. If a corporation is legally paying 5% tax, what right does the government have to increase its burden by 500%? None whatsoever!

Higher taxation = class envy. Flat tax with no so-called 'loopholes' = wealth redistribution, which is neo-Marxism.


No it's not. The current fiscal system which these corporations are able to manipulate for their own benefit, puts them in a unfair position competitively. Smaller businesses who won't be able to use the loopholes are in danger of going out of business, whilst these BIG corporations just see an explosion in profits.

If you want to do business in the U.K, then expect to pay the going rate regarding corporation tax. We have every right to set any rate of tax on business, that's politics.

But the lobbying of these corporations have ensured many politicians have been bought off and Government will not even consider closing these loopholes. It's not about jealousy, it's about fairness and transparency in our fiscal system, therefore allowing a competitive market.

It's simple economics really, the more we spend on buying goods and services from these corporations, the less money is returned to the public coffers. By allowing this to continue, makes bad business sense for the U.K.



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 11:43 AM
link   
reply to post by jrmcleod
 


Actually loopholes do tend to be closed off come the new budget. The problem is that many of these companies are multinationals who can move to other countries who are more sympathetic taking jobs with them. So the issue is where a the replacement jobs to come from?

Also many of these loopholes are not loopholes but are legitimate methods of minimising tax. To change these would require global changesin International law which would not happen in the foreseeable future.

Sorry to be so negative.

Tiger5


PS we can boycott various companies however



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 01:42 PM
link   
What we see here is the international financial control circuit at work.

The largest corporations control money in most countries.

They use governments and central banking systems.

Most of the big corporations are actually "owned" by the large block stockholders.

The large block stockholders are big institutions that take investment money and spin it around between themselves.

The largest institutions have committees (lots of committees) that attend stockholder meetings and board meetings.

They steer the business for maximum profit.

They have consultant firms that do the bidding for laws and regulations.

This is only the tip of the iceberg.


some examples of who really "owns" some big corporations........

notice the lists of major holders.

notice also that the ceo's etc. are really low level stockholders.

notice two institutions in particular:
State Street Corporation and BlackRock Institutional.
Outfits like these two are some of the companies that offer "parking spots" for the world's richest people.



McDonald's Corp.


Starbucks Corporation


Google Inc.


Deep research needs to be performed with titanium shovels !!


here's an old thread from Aug 2011:
Study shows powerful corporations really do control the world's finances

there's lots more in ATS threads, but the new search feature makes it difficult to find sometimes.



posted on Jun, 7 2013 @ 01:48 PM
link   
Flat tax.

Everyone pays 15%.

No loopholes.

No whining.

Government should also reign in their spending. . . .

But who am I kidding. Corporations will pay nothing. Middle class will see the hikes. Government will pay out more than they rake in. Economies will collapse.

Kinda sad when I start wishing for an effing planet Nirubu!



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 11:33 AM
link   
The irony of this whole ordeal is people expecting these massive companies to display honesty in a capitalistic system. This will never stop until people unite and find a new way of sustainability. We still function on systems whose ideals were born hundreds of years ago. We have technology, we have mechanization to mass produce decent quality products and distribute food. Many things are to be considered including the psychology of mankind. Nothing will develop until the majorities work together though. So lets continue to complain whilst most of us shop at Vodaphone and eat McDonalds. I'm no academic in the fundamentals of economics but it takes common sense to realize that this s%&* is not working for us anymore.



posted on Jun, 9 2013 @ 12:04 PM
link   

Originally posted by Tiger5
reply to post by jrmcleod
 


Actually loopholes do tend to be closed off come the new budget. The problem is that many of these companies are multinationals who can move to other countries who are more sympathetic taking jobs with them. So the issue is where a the replacement jobs to come from?

What jobs? You mean the jobs which cost us taxpayers a fortune in subsidising wages with top-up benefits?


Also many of these loopholes are not loopholes but are legitimate methods of minimising tax. To change these would require global changesin International law which would not happen in the foreseeable future.

Sorry to be so negative.

Tiger5


PS we can boycott various companies however

These loopholes are favours bought and paid for by corporations.

Nothing political is done democratically any more. Everything is decided for the benefit of money and profit - rake as much in as you can and pay out the least you can get away with, with no regard for society - it's nothing short of obscene.

Corporations cost taxpayer money by taking every advantage of services and utilities they need to operate, but they don't pay taxes and their workers are forced to claim benefits, and they don't create jobs. It's all one-sided from what I can see.

Let them push off to foreign shores and rip them off instead, we won't miss them one bit and can function without such huge freeloaders hanging around our neck.





top topics
 
10

log in

join