Pyramid Schemes. How Do People Still Fall For Them?

A friend I havent spoke to in a while called me a while ago and was telling me about a new business venture that she was getting into and wanted to come by and talk to me about it. I asked her what was it about, and she seemed standoffish, as she knows me a bit better than that, but what a goal it would be to get me to get involved, then she knows she has a shot.

So anyway, she explains to me that she found an organization that is helping people help themselves, by bettering themselves with the knowledge that they can do anything, and take back their rights, oh yeah and have a massive earning potential.

So I am first thinking that she may have just got into a group thats a little shady with all this take back your rights stuff, which I thought she meant our "rights" in the government sense. But she did not. So I began to ask her a few more questions, like, well, are you just randomly talking to people to help out communities, and she says yes.

The I ask her has she bought anything, you know to "help" her to deal with people, that seem to desperately need her help, and of course the scam goes wild! She tells me that first she has to deal with her own communication issues and that requires buying a book.... then a few DVD's, and lastly a few seminars, but that happens later... you know when she hits "Platinum".

So I ask her, did she read about the "archetypes" yet, and she says sort of.

Then I ask her is there any tips on how you approach certain people based on things like, whether you know them well, or if they are strangers. She says yes.

I take a pause and ask her if she knows what pyramid scheme is. She says of course I do. But my family has been doing this for years, and the guy that sells this stuff is rich, and when she goes into the upper levels, then she can get tips from "millionaires".

So now In my eyes this is about money, and frankly Im a bit bothered that she thought I would be interested, but hey, she had to give it a shot, right?

Now I know her, and I know that she is genuine, and she means well, and I am sure that this thing is telling her things like, "Hey, you have to follow your rainbow, but not without your Unicorn.. oh and $89.99" The books may be helping her and thats great, she has had some mental issues recently, but I feel like I may have dampened it a bit for her.

That was not my intent, not dampened like I ruined her rainbow trip, but that I let her know that the books that she was reading were in fact things to teach her manipulation, and not how to take someone rights back, and make them money for a low price of $89.99+ oh wait... theres more because her family is involved, she thinks that this HAS to be on the up and up.

I dont want to convince her of anything honestly. I just dont see how these types of things are still working on people, if she would have said, "Hey, I am going to make a fortune selling crap dreams to people" Then, hey good luck with that, but it will come back to bite you on the a$$, but this is someone who really doesnt care about people, and I dont have the heart to tell her that her family got her into this, but that she should seriously just do a bit of research.

Anyone dealt with this, I know it cant just be me. If so please share what happened, she will be here tomorrow, and I will hold back as much as I can, but I want to help her, not hurt her.

Peace, NRE.

BTW, I know some of you will start your post like "Its her life let her make her own mistakes" and yes that fine and I know but I care about her, and if there is something that I can do, I will, and if that means to write a thread asking for advice, well... here it is

reply to post by NoRegretsEver


maybe because pyramid schemes are too awesome to resist

I have had so many people in my life who I had to talk out of MLM pyramid schemes... The short of it is:

Those people aren't in my life anymore.



I found that anyone dumb enough to fall for those things are not smart enough to be in my inner circle. Be it naivety, gullibility or whatever it is that possesses them not to analyze the situation properly, I don't know. It wasn't simply the fact that they fell for the schemes that made me cut them off, I just looked back and realized, those people, all of them, something would come up where I'd end up cutting them off.

So now, for friendship process, I may as well just ask: "Have you or anyone you know ever fallen for an MLM scheme?"

Seems it would be much easier to weed them out in the beginning.

On a side note:

I was planning on starting my own company, MLM style, because hey, a sucker is born every minute and even if you try to talk sense in them, certain people will always be looking for a quick fix, or some story that makes them feel special, that makes them think they could make a million bucks no work involved.


The way the systems work, is the books, training guides, whatever it be, it doesn't matter about the product. If my company takes on 10,000 new "agents" a year and I'm charging them 500 a pop for a "license" on top selling some aimless product, I'm pulling in 5 million simply on sign ups.

Sure they might sell a little of whatever I'm giving them, (they pay for their product line too) but it's meant to make the person at the top money, not at the bottom.

Is it moral, ethical? Hmm. Depends on how you rationalize it. Is it legal? Yes.

Hence my consideration for such a program.

Can you do a little research on the scheme to present her with some hard facts? Something that might break through to her?

I've had friends approach me about similar schemes. Usually ten minutes on google blows it wide open.

Good luck!

Originally posted by boncho
I have had so many people in my life who I had to talk out of MLM pyramid schemes... The short of it is:

Those people aren't in my life anymore.

I will bet you that some very strong pyramid scheme believers are still in your life. Social Security is a huge pyramid scheme, one of the largest ever. Only the debt based fiat currency scheme itself is truly bigger.

reply to post by boncho


No this isnt the first person that I have met that has fallen for such a thing, but thinking about it now. Nope they are no longer in my life.

This person is different as she is impressionable and young, If I thought it was because she was just ignorant, then sure I would have been more brash, but that isnt the case.

And yes, you arent the first person who thought about something like that to go into business for themselves, once you see what its about its not really that hard to start one.

Peace, NRE.

reply to post by smyleegrl


Yup, as soon as I read this she called, even though I thought she wouldnt based on my questions so I told her that I was interested in maybe getting the material for her before she gets here for free on PDF, and I got all the info, my first search and BAM!!

Nothing good

Peace, NRE.

If you value the friendship then you should just say no thanks, and leave it at that.
If you intervene then her failure to get rich will become your fault.

reply to post by VoidHawk


Based on just 20 minutes of research so far, she will NOT get rich. Apparently this "guy/guys" go to small churches as self help motivators, and convince the congregation that this is another way to help. Which explains why she old me her family was involved.

Looking into it, it seems like they got run out of a few towns, and have separated into smaller groups across the US. If she has dreams of being rich if any of this has merit than I dont see how I can be responsible, as what she is buying is trying to convince her that no one can stand in her way.

Peace.NRE.

BTW< I do know what your saying though.

I have tried a few myself when I was younger and have a few things to offer:

1. You CAN make money but you have to be the first in, the creator of the MLM or be VERY good at what you do. (99% of people can't do this)

2. When they say anyone can do it...wrong. It takes a certain personality type to continue after you learn that you are taking money off of people who will never make it. I possessed that trait.

I was very good. Although I failed at the first few MLM tries, I learned what it took and my first success had me earning about 7,000 per Month for about 2 yrs. It crashed and burned of course.

My last and most successful had me being fortunate enough to be in the beginning (Ground Floor) and I was the first person in Canada to take it seriously and run. Within 1 Month I had built a downline of about 1,000 and 2 Months later I was at about 20,000 under me. I started making some serious money but had to fight the company in the US for every penny.

I was that guy that stood up in front of a few thousand stating that if I can do it so can they. I actually believed it. And then I started to realize that the only way I made serious money was taking it from the promises to those whom I knew couldn't do the same. They didn't have the sales skills, public speaking, flare for wardrobe etc.

Anyways, the company imploded with too much growth, too fast and everyone was left hanging. I did convince much of my downline to do a cross-migration to another MLM I found with a similar pay out model but I lost heart for many reasons and dropped it completely.

Damn, forgot my point. Oh yeah...NOT EVERYONE CAN DO THIS but if you are that certain breed of folks, you can earn a lot of quick cash. The very rare type of person that is.

Peace

reply to post by jude11


YES! YES YES! Thats what I was trying to tell her, without being offensive, believe me Ive been told a few times I would be a great cult leader

But I KNOW this is not for her, she is barely getting by now, and hate to see her wasting money like that.

Peace, NRE.

I will tell you how. It is greed. Those who fall for these types of scams see only the potential money they think they can make, and apparently disregard all associated risk. For instance, if someone is promising 40% returns per year, they are more than likely a fraud. That is not necessarily a pyramid scheme, as these types of investment operations are usually ponzi-schemes, where those perpetrating the fraud use new investor money to pay back old investors. Theoretically this type of scam can last for a long time, until people stop getting paid, and start doing some investigating, and start bringing legal action against the person.

I also think people do not pay attention very well. And even more importantly, they have no real knowledge of what exactly they are attempting to do. If they were familiar with a certain market for instance, they would be in a better position to spot fraud. And actually there are pyramid scams that really do work, but the important thing to remember is that it only works for so many people. There are going to be just as many, or more, people who lose their money as compared to who make money.

Originally posted by DarthMuerte

Originally posted by boncho
I have had so many people in my life who I had to talk out of MLM pyramid schemes... The short of it is:

Those people aren't in my life anymore.

I will bet you that some very strong pyramid scheme believers are still in your life. Social Security is a huge pyramid scheme, one of the largest ever. Only the debt based fiat currency scheme itself is truly bigger.

Except their isn't. I don't know anyone who would ever consider living off social security. Not my crowd.

Originally posted by NoRegretsEver
reply to post by boncho

 

No this isnt the first person that I have met that has fallen for such a thing, but thinking about it now. Nope they are no longer in my life.This person is different as she is impressionable and young, If I thought it was because she was just ignorant, then sure I would have been more brash, but that isnt the case.And yes, you arent the first person who thought about something like that to go into business for themselves, once you see what its about its not really that hard to start one.

Peace, NRE.

Thanks, I appreciate the honesty and openness looking at the subject. Most on ATS are just quick to lash out at the entire scope of the situation. Sounds like you have a head on your shoulders. As for your friend... Some will be extremely upset, feel betrayed once they realize they are being bamboozled. Others are kind of just let down, and even when you present them with the facts, there's something inside of them still curious, still wondering if it might be, just maybe, possibly be real.

I fear if it's the latter there is not much you can do, and your time and energy invested might be wiser if limited.

If she responds to your guidance, keep patience and put the time in. I've done it before and it's rewarding to see what comes from people who just need a little direction.

-B

Why does anyone fall for anything?

The fact is that there will always be people who are less able to discern a good plan from a stupid idea, and those people will always fall for a trick. Hell, look at the number of people who vote, genuinely believing it might make a difference. I know its all a sham, anyone who has been paying attention knows that votes are either rigged to provide a predictable result, or the candidates are so limited in terms of the difference between one and the other, that a vote for either of them is a vote for stagnation.

Its the same with Pyramid schemes. You and I know they are ridiculous, and are designed to make money for one person, the person selling the scheme in the first instance. But those who go in for it, who are prepared to sacrifice thier money in order to access the "potential" they offer, genuinely believe that they are on the way up! There is no accounting for idiocy, and no known cure either.

www.youtube.com...
Heres some Hypocrisy with the nutshell on this subject.

the wordplay "pyramid" scheme is not to be missed

in response to the OP, something along the lines of boncho's reply but tacked onto the end of it - if we're not going to try and light up the darkness what is the bloody point of it all?

people might also like to hear Bill Cooper call out Aaron Russo on this very same issue. tinfoil infighting.

stick to your morals, folks.. this is the thing they are constantly trying to erode.. because this is the thing that saves you in this world of #.

everything is about power and control.. don't ever let anyone tell you otherwise.. "especially if they've got the good lord telling them how to ____ you over on the deal" (-burroughs) people fall for this kind of crap because it tells them sweet things.. they're gonna have money.. yadda yadda

..someone long ago offered, 'the love of money is the root of all evil'

it takes a very, very long time to reason someone out of their love affair with the world..
i have found the simple things in life are often the best.

reply to post by smyleegrl

Can you do a little research on the scheme to present her with some hard facts? Something that might break through to her?

Bingo. beat me to it, so I'll just second it.