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Originally posted by KaelemJames
reply to post by Akragon
I turn my back on questions i ask myself, those which i cannot understand.
edit on 09/02/2012 by KaelemJames because: grammar
I am more of the opinion that he always knew he was to die... It wasn't God (or at least his Father) that wanted his blood... it was the jews and their god...
The plan seemed to work okay,
until Darby came along and wrecked it
by claiming "No, the prophecies of a physical rulership must still happen,
the Kingdom of Heaven is nothing
we want the Earth kingdom.
I don't know what to do with this...
Originally posted by pthena
reply to post by Akragon
I don't know what to do with this...
That's under the wrecking of the plan.
I thought that the dotted line would be a less than subtle transition mark.
The dispensationalists reject that the prophecies have been fulfilled and demand that all the physical Unitary Military Absolute Monarchy stuff happen physically.edit on 31-5-2013 by pthena because: (no reason given)
Darby is John Nelson Darby
Originally posted by pthena
reply to post by Akragon
His plan was to end Messiahism. I guess that doesn't quite get rid of Yahweh though, does it? Maybe tomorrow.
Darby: Inventor of Dispensationalism:
Short tutorial: according to Dispensationalism
The gross temple worship(idolatry, by the way, man made stone with a deity in it) and physical earthly kingdom and the god of OT is "the real deal"
The Christian Church is just a temporary fluke, it will go away, so "the real deal" can happen for OT deity.
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edit on 31-5-2013 by pthena because: (no reason given)edit on 31-5-2013 by pthena because: (no reason given)
Didn't he claim to be the Christ?
I don't think anything can get rid of YHWH... its dualistic but its really one or the other,,,
SO that means you believe OT God will take over as the real deal?
I ran into an interesting verse yesterday while looking up verb forms for my reading the Bible in Greek blog.
Jesus died so that he could kill the Messiah.
. . . The gross temple worship(idolatry, by the way, man made stone with a deity in it) . . .
I ran into an interesting verse yesterday while looking up verb forms for my reading the Bible in Greek blog.
Romans 15:8 • γεγενῆσθαι • For I tell you that Christ has become a servant of the Jews on behalf of God’s truth, so that the promises made to the patriarchs might be confirmed
So the point is, I think that Paul is doing the same thing, killing expectations by saying that whatever rightly should have been taken from those things, already happened.
If Paul says "saves us from the wrath to come", then he is using Passover imagery.
What wrath? From the old entity that we don't have to worry about anymore, who is going to smite us for not following the dictates of Moses.
Lev 26
13 I am Yahweh your God, who brought you forth out of the land of Egypt
14 “‘But if you will not listen to me, and will not do all these commandments; 15 ... but break my covenant;
16 I also will do this to you:
I will appoint terror over you,
17 I will set my face against you
18 I will chastise you seven times more for your sins.
21 I will bring seven times more plagues on you according to your sins.
24 I will strike you, even I, seven times for your sins.
25 I will bring a sword upon you, that will execute the vengeance of the covenant
28 I will walk contrary to you in wrath; and I also will chastise you seven times for your sins. 29 You will eat the flesh of your sons, and you will eat the flesh of your daughters.
33 I will scatter you among the nations,
I will draw out the sword after you
Zechariah 13
7 “Awake, sword, against my shepherd,
and against the man who is close to me,” says Yahweh of Armies.
“Strike the shepherd, and the sheep will be scattered;
and I will turn my hand against the little ones.
Jesus said his father was the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.
Jesus said that we would not die until all of the scriptures in the Old Testament concerning him had been fulfilled.
Jesus quoted over 60+ scriptures from 24 different books of the Old Testament!
Jesus said he came to sacrifice himself for his sheep.
John 5:37-47
37 And the Father Himself, who sent Me, has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time, nor seen His form.
Exodus 19: 9 Yahweh said to Moses, “Behold, I come to you in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with you, and may also believe you forever.”
11 ... Yahweh will come down in the sight of all the people on Mount Sinai.
17 Moses led the people out of the camp to meet God;
20 Yahweh came down on Mount Sinai,
20: 1 God spoke all these words, saying, 2 “I am Yahweh your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
18 All the people perceived the thunderings, the lightnings, the sound of the trumpet, and the mountain smoking. When the people saw it, they trembled, and stayed at a distance. 19 They said to Moses, “Speak with us yourself, and we will listen; but don’t let God speak with us, lest we die.”
31 But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying,
32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.