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Killing vs. murder. The ages old argument continues

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posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:04 PM
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The taking of anothers life. The chances are that most in the ATS community have not had that ignoble decision forced upon them. I’m talking about the personal level. Not drone strikes or artillery barrages, but up close and personal. You either have or have not.

It’s a decision that changes a person. Not always for the best, but sometimes for the better. It is usually a quick decision as well. You don’t have a lot of time to think about it.

This isn’t really about how a person came into this arena, after all, hindsight is 20/20 and the future is blind, but rather the here and now.

The original texts from the bible states that, “Thou shalt not commit murder.”

The later texts state, "Thou shalt not not kill.”

BIG difference there.

I have thought upon this for years and still haven’t come to a conclusion. I guess I am human. Maybe I have as I can sleep soundly at night. But it still troubles me while I am awake.

edit on 28-5-2013 by TDawgRex because: Spelling




posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:09 PM
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reply to post by TDawgRex
 


what exactly troubles you? murder? or the bible? or...



posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:14 PM
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reply to post by TDawgRex
 


ive never been faced with the thought of ending someone's life but once i had to kill a cat because it had been hit by a truck and was severely injured. not something i like to remember but a very weird feeling once its life had drained away




posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:14 PM
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Had to make the decision to send my dog for the big sleep, and I would have found it easier to send a few humans for the big sleep!
It didn't feel like murder, but it didn't feel right either. But it ended his suffering.

Sending someone or pet for the big sleep is not something anyone should have to do.

ETA: What a miserable subject for a thread. Go find something else to get us all talking please!
edit on 28-5-2013 by VoidHawk because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:14 PM
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Originally posted by Tlexlapoca
reply to post by TDawgRex
 


what exactly troubles you? murder? or the bible? or...


Actually...the argument. Maybe that is why I can sleep at night, but wonder during the daylight.



posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:19 PM
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We kill to survive, whether it's for food or to keep from being killed. That is allowed because we have a right to live. We murder because we want something. It could be money, revenge, to eliminate witnesses, someones mate, there are endless excuses. It is never good and we know it inside. The only exception is someone with mental damage. They have no sense of right or wrong, no moral sense.



posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:19 PM
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Originally posted by VoidHawk
Had to make the decision to send my dog for the big sleep, and I would have found it easier to send a few humans for the big sleep!
It didn't feel like murder, but it didn't feel right either. But it ended his suffering.

Sending someone or pet for the big sleep is not something anyone should have to do.


I've been deployed in numerous combat zones and I have always felt bad about putting a animal down. But when a human carrying a weapon, it doesn't phase me. It's weird.

Maybe it's the old kill or be killed.

I've survived it all and retired, but now I am finding it creepy. It doesn't haunt me in my dreams, but rather while I am awake.



posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:22 PM
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Killing, like that done on the battlefield has never been an issue for me.
As long as you know that you did the best you could in any given situation, there is no need to dwell on it.

Righteous murder I think is acceptable.
If I thought I could get away with murdering a pedophile or rapist, I would.

As has been mentioned in similar statements already, I had to kill a dog who had been hit by a car.
That killing has bothered me far worse than any other I have had to do.



posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:23 PM
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reply to post by TDawgRex
 


you mean the argument of Taking someone's life, if its right or wrong, if its good or bad. Maybe the fact that if you ever came face to face with the decision: to end someone's life or let them live
cold blooded murder. well to be fair it all depends on how much you hate the guy
edit on 28-5-2013 by Tlexlapoca because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:29 PM
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Originally posted by TDawgRex

I've been deployed in numerous combat zones and I have always felt bad about putting a animal down. But when a human carrying a weapon, it doesn't phase me. It's weird.

Maybe it's the old kill or be killed.


If its a case of kill or be killed then like you it wouldn't bother me, its survival. It's the other circumstances when you have to make that decision to end a life, I hope I never have to do it again. Thats why I wont get another dog.



posted on May, 28 2013 @ 09:38 PM
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Originally posted by Tlexlapoca
reply to post by TDawgRex
 


you mean the argument of Taking someone's life, if its right or wrong, if its good or bad. Maybe the fact that if you ever came face to face with the decision: to end someone's life or let them live


I have held off on the trigger more often than not. Those times were dilemmas as well. But people did live.

Thankfully I have never been surprised by a non-combatant, but there are those who have and now have to live with that as well. My prayers are with them.

People applaud a father or mother who take out a burglar, but in the same breath belittle soldiers and cops, when they have no idea what was happening. All they know is that they hate them, for whatever reason.

I’m starting to think I’m ok. I never wanted to kill anybody and still don’t. But I did realize what I was signing up for and the possible consequences.

But the kill vs. murder thing that people argue about still bothers me. And I'm not that all religious.

ETA: I've never hated those who I was in combat with. With the exception of the IED makers, I always respected those who were willing to fight toe to toe for their beliefs.
edit on 28-5-2013 by TDawgRex because: Just a ETA



posted on May, 28 2013 @ 10:50 PM
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reply to post by TDawgRex
 


Very perplexing topic.

I tried myself to differentiate the two and thought of this. .. .. .

There are Probably 100s of types of killing. There are Only 3 Degrees of Murder.

To get a better common frame of reference on a Type of Killing add the cide to the end of a word.
For example Homicide, Aborticide, Matricide, Patricide, etc., etc.

As for Murder and its degrees they might be defined as:
First Degree is the Most serious and indicates that the perpetrator took their time to premeditate and execute with mal-intent.

Second Degree is less intentional with a less degree of mal-intent. Say for example a guy comes home from work and finds his wife in bed with another guy and just goes nut killing either or both.

Third degree is limited to killing by an act of shear Stupidity aka. Negligence. For example a Drunk driver goes left of center and kills someone.

With those definitions in mind, regarding the question, we might easily conclude that the Church re-wrote the good book to reflect the Broader definitions.

They must have had some good lawyers that did their thinking for them.

edit on 28-5-2013 by ShadellacZumbrum because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 28 2013 @ 11:04 PM
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Holy crap,just as I was typing this a lightning bolt exploded outside my sun porch.....I was gonna say there has to be a cleansing of bad people....Oh man 'that was a shot gun blast



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