An attractive form of Feminism...?

The Antigones are a group of French women who oppose the Marxist orientated Femen movement;

Dozens of young women gathered Saturday afternoon in Paris to denounce the "totalitarian and manipulative methods" of the radical feminist movement FEMEN, close to their local, said a journalist from AFP.

Protesters, for Most dressed in white skirts, wanted to head to the local FEMEN in the popular neighborhood of La Goutte d'Or, in the north of Paris, but they were prevented by an impressive array of mobile police in riot gear .
"The woman's dignity, it does not pass through exhibitionism and hysteria Thus we oppose Femen, which act as watchdogs, are the orders of an ideology that undermines the foundations of our society and violates our values, "according to a statement distributed by the protesters, who claim the name Antigones .

Among them, "Iseul" claimed to have infiltrated the movement FEMEN "for understanding and awareness." She denounces the "young French women, pawns, trapped and recruited by foreign activists and rich leaders seeking to impose values ​​that are not natural to our society."
"These totalitarian and manipulative methods must stop," the statement said, requesting the return of the two heads of Ukraine FEMEN France, from that country, stopping subsidies to their movement and the end of immunity for their actions.

antigones.fr...





They are interesting in that Antigone is an icon of a form feminism;

In Greek mythology, Antigone is the daughter of Oedipus and Jocasta, Oedipus' mother. The name has been suggested to mean "opposed to motherhood", "in place of a mother".[1] It may also mean "against men" since men were dominant in the Ancient Greek family structure, and Antigone clearly defied masculine authority, or "anti-generative", from the root gonē, "that which generates"

en.wikipedia.org...


They adopt then this position derived from Classicism of independent maidenhood, protective of it's own integrity, as opposed to the Marxist position rooted in Jewish Masculine Absolutism, were the system is everything and power is always right, and were the ideal woman is as the man.

Okay but does it oppose sexist oppression and and patriarchy that involves so much of our politics? Now that is the question. The feminism of the sixties was deeply critical of capitalism. Do these women question capitalism?

Now those are the questions.

It is too bad the video does not have subtitles for english speakers. I think what they have to say is worth considering. It is very representative of french values in particular, which I personally found to shine light on a different perspective than what I was used to as an american.

It is more than a perspective upon women- it is a perspective upon self-other relation, (woman being the "other" sex, symbolic of all that is "not self"; not ego), upon the balance and complimentary nature of Yin and Yang, not only in a society, but in an individual.
Their ideals seek to bring creative weaving between opposites- not destroy difference, nor encourage war between them.

I wish I had the time to write up a translation for that video, but I am working full time (on jet lag too) and have to get to work. But I thank the OP for bringing this to the table for discussion.

reply to post by Tiger5



The French Right is looking to re-define its roots in Greek Classicism, one idealized model would be that of the deterministic Apollo and his sister of integrity, Artemis, though Greek thought was multi-faceted and Antigone is another aspect acceptable within European tradition, not a model involving however patriarchy or any form of absolutist dogma.

Classical Greek thought was neither Capitalistic or Imperialistic.

Feminism/attractive, anathema alert

Hmm... an attractive form of feminism? No doubt the ladies in white have a certain physical appeal, but the fact is that feminism is no different to male chauvenism in its effect, except the particulars of which gender takes a back seat in its dogma. Neither feminism, nor the oppression of women, by men, are acceptable ways to run a society. Equality does not mean several hundred years of the balance being tipped the other way.

Also, I would question the worth of any organisation which names itself after the product of an incestuous relationship between a son and his mother. Sounds awfully fishy in its intent and meaning if you ask me.

reply to post by TrueBrit



Honestly. the only thing I understood in the 1st video, was women showing their breasts as a form of freedom of expression but most of the men I saw looked offended, or priest like, so I am kinda unsure if this was done in front of religious buildings and if so, I'm not sure boobs and religions go hand in hand in today's PC world.

In the other hand, bravo for getting my attention via visual stimulation, I can now rest happy knowing protests are faught with boobs rather than fists.

reply to post by TrueBrit




As a daughter of Oedipus, Antigone is about being true to ones conscience when caught up in a tragic series of events, the right of the individual to defy the state and to not fear the oppression of men....it's all good.

The story of Oedipus is the subject of Sophocles's tragedy Oedipus the King, which was followed by Oedipus at Colonus and then Antigone. Together, these plays make up Sophocles's three Theban plays. Oedipus represents two enduring themes of Greek myth and drama: the flawed nature of humanity and an individual's powerlessness against the course of destiny in a harsh universe.


Antigone is the tragic heroine of the play. Compared to her beautiful and docile sister, Antigone is portrayed as the rebel of her family who seems withdrawn and refuses to play by the rules. The beginning of the play suggests Antigone’s rebellious side, the fact that Ismene seems terrified to disobey Creon for fear of his death penalty, while Antigone tells her Creon does not frighten her. Antigone rebels against the fundamental rules of her society that states that women must be afraid of the men who are considered dominant. Antigone proves to be noble and wise

A well established theme in Antigone is the right of the individual to reject society's infringement on her freedom to perform a personal obligation obvious in Antigone's refusal to let Creon dictate what she is allowed to do with her family members. She says to Ismene about Creon's edict, "He has no right to keep me from my own.


he contrasting views of Creon and Antigone with regard to laws higher than those of state inform their different conclusions about civil disobedience. Creon demands obedience to the law above all else, right or wrong. He says that "there is nothing worse than disobedience to authority" . Antigone responds with the idea that state law is not absolute, and that it can be broken in civil disobedience in extreme cases, such as honoring the gods, whose rule and authority outweigh Creon's

en.wikipedia.org...(Sophocles)



reply to post by Tranceopticalinclined



That aggressive 'feminism', the boobies in yer face, is what they are against...as it's actually masculine behaviour

reply to post by Kantzveldt


I am not sure that any form of feminism is "all good". Again, I say that because neither that nor male chauvenism have any place in an equal society. To be totally frank, getting ones breasts out at a public place is a sign of nothing less than a complete lack of dignity. I would not run about with my member flapping in the breeze, not because I am somehow repressed, but because I respect myself, the sanctity of my body, and the right of other people not to have to encounter my manhood without wishing to do so.

There are public gatherings at which such behavior is more acceptable, rock festivals for instance, nude beaches, and so on and so forth. But I cannot appreciate thier intent because they have no respect for themselves or others, just denial and self delusion.

reply to post by TrueBrit




You completely misunderstand them, they are AGAINST Femen (Female-Men), the aggresive feminists.


Antigone is an entirely passive feminine martyr type figure.

reply to post by Kantzveldt


But are they against any form of feminism, I.E. the upholding of females above males in any respect what so ever? I doubt it.

I don't like extreme radical behavior. These women look like good people, trying to complete a goal in a rational way. Not all men were oppressive in the past. I don't understand why any woman would even want to go out with an oppressive man.

I have seen radical type behavior similar to the behavior shown by the topless women giving the finger in the past and it seemed to cause more problems than it solved in society. I guess I am just old fashioned because I believe the woman actually had a more important job of bringing up the children properly. Men were supposed to go out and work which was more of a servitude job so they could contribute to the family. I guess it went to the head of a majority of the men out there.

Well, I am sure that some radical women wouldn't agree with me.

Originally posted by TrueBrit
reply to post by Kantzveldt

 

But are they against any form of feminism, I.E. the upholding of females above males in any respect what so ever? I doubt it.

A translation really needs to be done- apparently this is being radically misunderstood! They do not call themselves feminists- they are a group which opposes feminist groups and encourages respectful and equal cooperation between men and women.

reply to post by Bluesma




That's true, they call themselves Antigones, and are in no way opposed to men, just women acting like them.

Originally posted by Kantzveldt
The Antigones are a group of French women who oppose the Marxist orientated Femen movement;

Dozens of young women gathered Saturday afternoon in Paris to denounce the "totalitarian and manipulative methods" of the radical feminist movement FEMEN, close to their local, said a journalist from AFP.

Protesters, for Most dressed in white skirts, wanted to head to the local FEMEN in the popular neighborhood of La Goutte d'Or, in the north of Paris, but they were prevented by an impressive array of mobile police in riot gear .
"The woman's dignity, it does not pass through exhibitionism and hysteria Thus we oppose Femen, which act as watchdogs, are the orders of an ideology that undermines the foundations of our society and violates our values, "according to a statement distributed by the protesters, who claim the name Antigones .

Among them, "Iseul" claimed to have infiltrated the movement FEMEN "for understanding and awareness." She denounces the "young French women, pawns, trapped and recruited by foreign activists and rich leaders seeking to impose values ​​that are not natural to our society."
"These totalitarian and manipulative methods must stop," the statement said, requesting the return of the two heads of Ukraine FEMEN France, from that country, stopping subsidies to their movement and the end of immunity for their actions.

antigones.fr...

They are interesting in that Antigone is an icon of a form feminism;

In Greek mythology, Antigone is the daughter of Oedipus and Jocasta, Oedipus' mother. The name has been suggested to mean "opposed to motherhood", "in place of a mother".[1] It may also mean "against men" since men were dominant in the Ancient Greek family structure, and Antigone clearly defied masculine authority, or "anti-generative", from the root gonē, "that which generates"

en.wikipedia.org...


They adopt then this position derived from Classicism of independent maidenhood, protective of it's own integrity, as opposed to the Marxist position rooted in Jewish Masculine Absolutism, were the system is everything and power is always right, and were the ideal woman is as the man.

edit on 28-5-2013 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)

Feminism is a female supremacist hate movement. They can rebrand it, relabel it, but in the end it just proves that feminists are psychopathic monsters.Granted since this is France, local history may color things in a different evolutionary way then in America.

Still though, the argument is that the Radical Feminist's are control freaks and disrupting the good little gendered setup in France. They still have no problem with their bigotry. This conflict is about a difference of methods, not of ideology or intent. They realize that the particular type of female supremacy being advocated by the foreign feminists is disadvantageous to them and their type of female supremacy. In the end that is all they are, female supremacists.

reply to post by Kantzveldt


not sure why there should be division between men and women. I have never understood that at all. Feminism causes division in the sexes.

Feminism is garbage and it wrecks women so bad. It has done nothing be objectify and demean a woman. which is funny cuz it was out to do the opposite of that.

You all do realize that there are multiple types of feminism, and that they don't all seek to demonize men or place women higher than men right? Radical feminists give all the groups a bad name, but not every feminist is a radical one.

Originally posted by votan
reply to post by Kantzveldt

 

not sure why there should be division between men and women.

Dude. (Beavis and Butthead moment .....) Because they are not the same, man. For which we are all eternally grateful.

Feminism is garbage and it wrecks women so bad. It has done nothing be objectify and demean a woman. which is funny cuz it was out to do the opposite of that.

Yeah, our lexicon needs a term for when a social movement or culture imposes its conformist iron will on individuals in the name of getting them to express themselves.

Feminism. Emo. Goth. Hipster.

Using google translate on this page:

translate.google.com...://www.polemia.com/les-antigones-contre-les-femen-instruments-de-creon/&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dles %2Bantigones%26start%3D10%26sa%3DN%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D1366%26bih%3D667

I got this:

The Antigones are not just another movement. It is a simple gathering of women. Far from any religious or political consideration, we demand our basic right and our fundamental duty to be women in their own right.

The woman's dignity, it does not pass through exhibitionism and hysteria. It goes through our wisdom, calm and determination to build our future. Daughters of our fathers, our husbands, wives, mothers of our son, we do not reject men. Instead, we are persuaded that it is with them, complementarity, we will build our future.

Remind us of the Antigone of Sophocles. This young woman has choices, preferring to follow its values ​​and the legitimacy of the law of nature rather than obey unjust orders. Thus we oppose Femen, which act as watchdogs, are the orders of an ideology that undermines the foundations of our society and violates our values. The FEMEN pushed feminism into its most squalid corner, it's time to stop.

For this Iseul, the Antigones was into the heart of FEMEN to understand and know. Inflitrée for two months, she saw a total lack of training, camouflaged by a unity of action. And young French women, pawns, trapped and recruited by foreign activists and wealthy executives seeking to impose values ​​that are not natural to our society.

FEMEN is a draconian move. Because it violates the freedom of expression by prohibiting the dialogue. Because it violates the freedom of religion, which is nevertheless a fundamental right in our country. FEMEN also undermines the dignity of women wanting to believe that it is stripped we best express.

These totalitarian and manipulative methods to stop.

150 women, dressed in white robes, smiling and grouped under the banner of Antigone, visited Saturday, May 25 in front of the local FEMEN in the eighteenth arrondissement of Paris. They have requested the return of Inna and Oksana Ukraine, stopping direct or indirect subsidies to their movement and the end of immunity for those women who claim to be "terrorists" but our Justice country has never even placed in the custody of all their actions. The Antigones Paris (Source: AFP dispatch) 25/05/2013

Modern feminism Translation: Hello, I am a very self centered,selfish and egotistical woman.You will have to date me for one week to find out if I am outright hostile, or ultra passive aggressive. I am never wrong...ever. Do you like my dreadlocks, if not your a fascist.