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Simple question re: homosexuality

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posted on May, 29 2013 @ 08:16 PM
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reply to post by OpenEars123
 



So many sad ignorant/brainwashed/bigoted people in this thread, it's good to see the nice/caring/open minded/loving people coming out on top.


You must be talking about stars or something.

Meh….I've got plenty!

Nobody is going to come out on top in US with abortions, gay marriage, legalized drugs, etc.

We all lose!

Enjoy the stars!




posted on May, 29 2013 @ 08:28 PM
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reply to post by b14warrior
 



In your opinion, what is the reason they aren't against other non religious marriages?
I am married and I was married in a non religious ceremony in a non religious setting.
My Father is a Registrar for the Local Council and only performs non religious ceremonies, in fact our government employed Registrars ONLY master non religious ceremonies so why is there not protests outside his work?


Because your father isn’t marrying 2 men…or 2 women….or a man and a goat…etc.

It only becomes an issue when it goes against the basic principle of ONE MAN - ONE WOMAN. It’s not an affront to the sanctity of marriage if a man and woman chose to get married; their age doesn’t matter (as long as it’s legal); their race doesn’t matter; their religion doesn’t matter; their lack of religion doesn’t matter.

It’s about ONE MAN and ONE WOMAN with regard to MARRIAGE. Civil unions with full married benefits are fine with the majority of the country so this isn’t about equality.



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 08:39 PM
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Originally posted by ANOK

I'd like to see where the law states a marriage has to be sealed with an act of procreation?



Marriage has to be consummated to be valid.

Consummation means that the male and female genetic organs must be united at least once, otherwise the marriage is invalid. Until the male and female unite, the marriage is not "certified". So, even if a heterosexual couple got the marriage ceremony, signed all the papers and documents, and did all of the "outer" things that are required of the union, they still are not married until the sex act.

Since men do not have female genetic organs, they can never consummate the marriage. So, even if they do all the same things the heterosexual couples do, sign all the documents, have people bless them and give speeches, etc..they are not married until they join their male and female parts together. Since they have no female parts, they are never married.

All they got is some paper from the government with a stamp of "marriage" on it, which is a fake document.

In the same way that you can't change a person's gender, just by changing the words, calling male a woman, or calling the female a man, you can't change a gay union into a marriage.




Consummation or consummation of a marriage, in many traditions and statutes of civil or religious law, is the first (or first officially credited) act of sexual intercourse between two people, either following their marriage to each other or after a prolonged sexual attraction. Its legal significance arises from theories of marriage as having the purpose of producing legally recognized descendants of the partners, or of providing sanction to their sexual acts together, or both, and amounts to treating a marriage ceremony as falling short of completing the creation of the state of being married. Thus in some Western traditions,

a marriage is not considered a binding contract until and unless it has been consummated.

These formal and literal usages support the informal and less precise usage of the word "consummation" to refer to a sexual landmark in relationships of varying intensity and duration.

Within the Roman Catholic Church, a marriage that has not yet been consummated, regardless of the reason for non-consummation, can be dissolved by the pope.[1] Additionally, an inability or an intentional refusal to consummate the marriage is probable grounds for an annulment. Catholic canon law defines a marriage as consummated when the "spouses have performed between themselves in a human fashion a conjugal act which is suitable in itself for the procreation of offspring, to which marriage is ordered by its nature and by which the spouses become one flesh."[2] Thus some theologians, such as Fr. John A. Hardon, S.J., state that intercourse with contraception does not consummate a marriage.[3]


en.wikipedia.org...



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posted on May, 29 2013 @ 08:43 PM
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If the religious folk don't like the new legal definition of marriage that is quickly spreading, they always have the option to not get legally married. I mean, you know, since it's all just about what the Bible says, and all.

If your religion says marriage is only One Man and One Woman, then certainly the legal definition isn't marriage anymore. You should probably get legally divorced to save your marriages, but God will understand as long as you don't get religiously divorced.

Just tear up your legal marriage certificate and keep your religious marriage certificate. That's the one that is important anyway, right?



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 08:45 PM
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Most normal people would be perfectly happy if the gay behaviour was eradicated completely. That is the truth,



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 08:48 PM
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Originally posted by WilliamOckham
Most normal people would be perfectly happy if the gay behaviour was eradicated completely. That is the truth,


And then there's this guy.



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 08:48 PM
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Originally posted by WilliamOckham
Most normal people would be perfectly happy if the gay behaviour was eradicated completely. That is the truth,
Actually, Thats Bigotry.

You cant see the difference, kinda like .... a stupid person is too stupid to know, that their stupid...
Just an example.



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 08:51 PM
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Except, sexual preference has nothing to do with ethnicity, religion or nationality. There's nothing bigoted about completely disagreeing and discouraging the behavior/fetish. Stop pretending the gays are victims or anything other than people who make a choice to have relations with the same sex, instead of behaving normally.
edit on 29-5-2013 by WilliamOckham because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 08:54 PM
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Originally posted by WilliamOckham
Most normal people would be perfectly happy if the gay behaviour was eradicated completely. That is the truth,


Perhaps that is because your typical "gay behavior" isn't one of just asking for equality, it is one of DEMANDING acceptance regardless of personal or organizational religious beliefs.

Speaking honestly, and technically.... Freedom of sexual orientation doesn't negate freedom of religion or the basic freedom to practice speech when they don't agree with what is fast becoming an all out war on specific groups and the integrity of their faiths, belief systems and way of life.

A word of caution though, America is waking up fast to the events surrounding it. A day will come when the liberal media and administration isn't there to champion the cause and there could be backlash for the actions currently being taken.

It's important to measure growth of a cause with wisdom. When it gets too far out of whack, the rubberband has a tendency to snap back. Such is the way of the world.
edit on 29-5-2013 by Helious because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 09:08 PM
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Originally posted by SoulReaper


Christianity never claimed to "originate" marriage, rather it only built its understanding of marriage from a foundation laid long ago in the ancient world.


That's the point though. They adopted it and are trying to keep their 'version' of marriage as the only recognized standard in the country.



Secondly, your definition of Marriage is far removed from my own. I am not required to conform to your perception and I am not asking you to conform to mine. For me the word marriage carries a distinct and deep religious meaning, you have no right to force me to forsake what it means to me. Sure, you are free to disagree with me and perceive it with what ever meaning you like, but that freedom is a two way street.


I don't even understand why you felt the need to say this. As I said, gays getting married is not changing your marriage at all, it's not taking away any meaning or making it anything less.



Get Government out of it and let people fashion their own lives and relationships as they see fit. Make society more free with less regulation.


The problem is - those who are always preaching for less regulation are oftentimes the same ones actively trying to stop gays from getting married, and that's typically because of their religious beliefs and backwards morals.



unless of course you wish to continue on with your "crusade" to bash Christianity.

Would you demand that Muslims conform to your definition of Marriage and attempt to force Islamic groups to recognize same sex relationships? Just curious....

Soul


I'm not on a crusade to bash Christianity. I simply pointed out facts regarding the Bible, and in doing so pointed out the hypocrisy of those who pick and choose the rules they follow - viewing some as unimportant while holding others in high regard.

This has nothing to do with Muslims or Christians. However, the Christians are the ones actively trying to force their definition of marriage upon the entire country, which is why they are being mentioned specifically in the thread. I don't care what someone does in their Church, Mosque, or Synagogue. If they are getting married in this country, they need a marriage license. All the gays want is to be granted a marriage license and have their marriage recognized by the government, which is a right the rest of us enjoy. And since we are supposed to have a secular government, there should be no reason why that shouldn't be possible between two consenting adults just because a religious group throws a fit about it.



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 09:26 PM
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reply to post by Morgenstern89
 



That's the point though. They adopted it and are trying to keep their 'version' of marriage as the only recognized standard in the country.

YUP!!

I thought gays wanted to be legally recognized by their government and collect the SAME AND EQUAL benefits as a married couple? If that’s the case, I present to you the new and improved…CIVIL UNION!




I don't even understand why you felt the need to say this. As I said, gays getting married is not changing your marriage at all, it's not taking away any meaning or making it anything less.

Sanctity of marriage….the institution of marriage.

Gay marriage MOST CERTAINLY takes away from the meaning of marriage.




The problem is - those who are always preaching for less regulation are oftentimes the same ones actively trying to stop gays from getting married, and that's typically because of their religious beliefs and backwards morals.

Backwards morals? Pot meet kettle!


Nobody is denying anyone the right to form a union recognized by the government and equal to marriage….but it isn’t MARRIAGE.



edit on 29-5-2013 by seabag because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 09:33 PM
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Originally posted by seabag

Gay marriage MOST CERTAINLY takes away from the meaning of marriage.
How bout you try a fresh approach?
If you stop putting the word GAY before the word Marriage, then there is no Taking Away.

Marriage is just Marriage.

Simple.



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 09:35 PM
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Originally posted by Cosmology

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
Very simple question here. It is simple logic that gay marriage cannot and will not effect any person outside of that particular relationship. It cannot effect my marriage. It cannot effect yours.

With that in mind, I have to ask:

What is so scary about gay marriage? Fear is literally the only reason that people are against it (whether it be religious fear, social fear, etc). There is no other logical reason.

So, again, I ask: What is so scary about gay marriage?


I have not read the whole thread, but my simple answer is that accepting homosexual behavior openly is part of the demoralization of society, where homosexual sex, group sex, violence, depravity, drugs, is all accepted. The moral standards of society today are so low.

Morale can be the fuel that drives an organization forward or the fuel that feeds the fires of employee discontent, poor performance, and absenteeism (Ewton, 2007). With low morale comes a high price tag.

Without a proper foundation of morals, things can be completely destroyed and washed away.


you are saying i demoralize society?

i as have many others have been victims, of hate and discrimination, of physical abuse and verbal abuse, that is not 'Demoralizing'?

America is so pure that WE are the cause of demoralizing this nation? that WE want to be treated equal because we are as Human as you



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 09:44 PM
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reply to post by Morgenstern89
 


So, your really not talking about equality are you? What your talking about is a religious witch hunt. You want to violate and invalidate the beliefs of others, to, in point of fact, belittle there existence to justify your own.

What you are suggesting is the highest order of hypocrisy and that seems to be a problem with the divide between the two groups. I don't agree with the Christians openly decrying homsexuals as being of the devil and claiming they will burn in hell for their sins but I also don't agree with the homosexuals insisting that religion is an outdated concept and demanding that people relinquish their faith and accept freely whatever you are currently peddling in the way of agenda.

There needs to be acceptance on both sides but there HAS to be some lines that are not crossed. Gay people can not expect everyone to accept them, they can only ask that people respect them as people, with the same human rights as everyone else has.

Religious people need to accept that practicing and honoring their own faith and retaining their core values is their right and they are free to do so and understand that doesn't mean they should be on a crusade to cleanse the "evil" from the world.

Is that possible?



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 09:48 PM
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Originally posted by Tw0Sides

Originally posted by seabag

Gay marriage MOST CERTAINLY takes away from the meaning of marriage.
How bout you try a fresh approach?
If you stop putting the word GAY before the word Marriage, then there is no Taking Away.

Marriage is just Marriage.

Simple.


Is it though? Are you being honest with yourself about that statement?

How long has "marriage" been between a man and woman? How many hundreds of years of tradition are we talking about? In those hundreds of years, how many marriages could or were performed by the state? How many were performed by the Catholic Church?

We have had the gay marriage discussion for about a decade or two at most right? Put your thinking cap on, pull it down real tight and think hard about why some people may have an issue with it and stop pretending like we live on the moon. Thanks.



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 09:59 PM
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reply to post by Tw0Sides
 



How bout you try a fresh approach?
If you stop putting the word GAY before the word Marriage, then there is no Taking Away.

Marriage is just Marriage.

Simple.


Why didn’t I think of that???????


Why don’t we just stop putting words we don’t like before words we do like in every instance? That way we get what we want!! How about we remove illegal before the word drugs ? Or better yet, how about we remove the word criminal before the word activity? Man, we could really create utopia then, huh?


Drugs are just drugs.

Activity is just activity.

Is that the logic we should follow?




edit on 29-5-2013 by seabag because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 10:01 PM
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Originally posted by Helious
reply to post by Morgenstern89
 




Religious people need to accept that practicing and honoring their own faith and retaining their core values is their right and they are free to do so and understand that doesn't mean they should be on a crusade to cleanse the "evil" from the world.

Is that possible?


Quite so, it's when it becomes discrimination that it crosses the line, and when people of any religion sexuality gender decide that they can control the life of another based on Religion or personal belief

Christianity should not run America, Judaism should not run America, Etc, no Religious dogma should be the 'Rules' or 'Law' of America, so even if you don't 'Believe' in me, and believe that i am 'Immoral' it shouldn't have any cause to how i am treated and my rights privileges Etc

this is for any side and both sides of a same sided coin not just the 'Religious'

if i didn't invite you into my house because i had nothing in common with you, that is not discrimination, if i didn't invite you into my house Because a certain reason, it has crossed into discrimination based of of 'Sexuality' religion' gender etc'

even if you want to 'discriminate' against me personally i can't change you, but i should still be treated equally as in rights, privileges etc

Do What thou Wilt Shall be the whole of the law'



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 10:07 PM
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reply to post by Helious
 


How is it a religious witch hunt to point out that Christians are the main voice in trying to keep the gays from getting married?

All I'm saying is we live in a country where there is a separation of church and state, and that the opinions of religious groups shouldn't influence whether or not someone can get a marriage license. Don't want to let them have a ceremony in a church? Fine. They can get married elsewhere. It in no way affects them, or invalidates their own beliefs. There are people of many faiths, and no faith in this country - Christian (or any other religion) beliefs and traditions should not dictate those of others.

"Gay people can not expect everyone to accept them, they can only ask that people respect them as people, with the same human rights as everyone else has."

Every other consenting adult in this country can get married. Gays have sketchy civil unions, and only in what, 9 states? They don't have the same rights in those regards.



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 10:08 PM
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Originally posted by Darth_Prime


Do What thou Wilt Shall be the whole of the law'



Are you aware of the origin of this little statement of yours?

Soul



posted on May, 29 2013 @ 10:11 PM
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Originally posted by seabag

Is that the logic we should follow?



All that hatred within you must keep your heating bills almost non-existent.
We will chat later bud, I wont give up on you.



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