Thousands of Muslims gather in London to condemn murder of soldier Lee Rigby

reply to post by buster2010


what I don't understand...if Islam is a religion of peace...how come a few extremists are holding the entire religion a hostage?

entire peace loving religion has it's name destroyed by some isolated extremists groups. I don't get that.

Now, I don't defend any religion, but let's clear this up...how come extremist Christians are way down on a food chain. Extreme Christianity doesn't even figure. Nobody talks about them, actually most people mock them, even "normal" Christians. They have no real power nor do they spread influence other than a few local retards. We don't give them any power, except to exist.

So how come these "few Islamic extremist" are making such a fuss...to the point of almost warring with the entire world ?

You know why? because their ways are ingrained in the ideology of Islam. They are loosely supported by their communities, and even their "holy book", according to interpretations of certain Imams, can be used to justify extremism. They are known about and covered up. Protected by their muslim community. Have you ever heard that some muslim community arrested or wistleblown on any of their extremists?

I believe that most defenders of Islam are deluding yourselves simply because of too much "political correctness" being thrown around these days. And you fell for it. Somehow you deluded yourself in to thinking...that it's just a few isolated extremist that make a bad name out of Islam.

I'm not proposing murder or anything of the sorts...I'm just proposing that if a country wants to keep it's traditional values, it's system and it's freedom....they should introduce some kind of law that makes immigrant minorities adapt to the system (if one is already in place) and not grant them rights they don't even have in the country of their origin and than make changes to the system to accomodate the minority.

I'm sorry to say this, and just keep in mind that i am NOT a racist. I have friends of different races, backgrounds and cultures. But i'm bored and quite frankly sick of hearing "ohh... but it's not just Muslims who do these things" No, it's not. And nobody i know has ever said that.

To me, it seems an effort to dumb down what is happening in the UK. The burning of the Poppies, the defacing of War memorials with the word "ISLAM" over it, to name a few. It's not about condemning a whole society of Muslims, it's really not. I as well as pretty much everyone else is aware that not ALL Muslims are to blame. And anyone who blames ALL Muslims is very, very wrong. But it's about high time that people start to see a recurring theme. That the Muslims who want to show no respect to our country, how we live and our history should perhaps consider relocating. The country shouldn't have to change to other people's rules. You live in a country and accept their laws and more notably their customs and way of life.

Multiculturalism, in many ways, is a great thing. And like i said before, i'm not a racist. I don't judge people on their colour, race, religion or anything. I judge people on their actions. And i'm sorry if i get a little annoyed when it's the majority out of control Muslims that seem to show no respect for the UK and it's history. I think it's ridiculous to expect people to sit back and accept it. When the word "ISLAM" is written in spray paint over our war memorials. Excuse us for being a little riled up.

And once again, as i know this is a touchy subject, I am WELL aware that there are Christians, Hindus, Jews etc that do terrible things. But when i listen to the news and all i hear is what "Muslim groups" have done (in regards to showing NO respect to our heritage) excuse me for thinking a certain way.

If i've upset anyone, i'm sorry. I don't hate Muslims, i just hate the pussyfooting people do just because they are a certain religion. Like i said when they spray paint "ISLAM" over war memorials, or even display what happened to the poor soldier recently (i've tried not mentioning it, its not nice to think about) i struggle to see how people EXPECT people to react.

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


Ok lets just add this to the list of possible causes of violent death then and move on.

A small number of EDL folks seem to have found at least an ounce of compassion and common sense between them at last.



Perhaps the keyboard warriors on ATS could find it within themselves to stop spreading hate, and take the same steps towards bringing peace to their towns.

Originally posted by MrConspiracy
I'm sorry to say this, and just keep in mind that i am NOT a racist. I have friends of different races, backgrounds and cultures. But i'm bored and quite frankly sick of hearing "ohh... but it's not just Muslims who do these things" No, it's not. And nobody i know has ever said that.

To me, it seems an effort to dumb down what is happening in the UK. The burning of the Poppies, the defacing of War memorials with the word "ISLAM" over it, to name a few. It's not about condemning a whole society of Muslims, it's really not. I as well as pretty much everyone else is aware that not ALL Muslims are to blame. And anyone who blames ALL Muslims is very, very wrong. But it's about high time that people start to see a recurring theme. That the Muslims who want to show no respect to our country, how we live and our history should perhaps consider relocating. The country shouldn't have to change to other people's rules. You live in a country and accept their laws and more notably their customs and way of life.

And this is how it started in Germany. The defacing of Jewish shrines and property by a small group of radical nut jobs that eventually took control.

Originally posted by johngrissom
Hey, look here, no one group of people are perfect. The United States have the KKK, Black Panthers, White Panthers, Protestants, I would like to consider some government groups to be just as bad. Especially when it comes down the government secret projects like MKUltra and drugging people with '___' without telling them.

Muslims just have their sub-group of extremists as well. So, nothing to see here.

And yet the KKK, Black Panthers, etc., aren't spreading themselves around the world randomly shooting people, chopping off heads, and blowing up marketplaces. In fact, they're hardly very active here in the US.

And yes, I do condemn their actions and beliefs.

reply to post by MarioOnTheFly

what I don't understand...if Islam is a religion of peace...how come a few extremists are holding the entire religion a hostage?

Fundamentalists and extremists work pretty much the same way in every country - in every culture. They keep everyone busy trying to stave off or undo the damage done by the constant barrage of nonsense they expect everyone to live by and under

The peaceful Muslims - which is most of them - are never going to attract the kind of attention the extremists do. It takes just two young idiots (for example) to plant some bombs and rock the entire world

Many will never even consider the millions of Muslims that are just going to work, raising their families and living their lives - same as everybody else

Let me ask you something - did Timothy McVeigh make you fear white Americans?

reply to post by buster2010


there is an ongoing program where mosques work with authorities to deliver an anti extremism message. Quite a few mosques regularly teach anti extremism arguments. We appreciate that very much. It might stop some radicalization but it hasn't stopped anywhere near it all.

So yes condemning extremism in this mosque is normal.

The Baitul Futuh Mosque has acted as the centre for the 'Loyalty, Freedom and Peace Campaign',[8][9] which seeks to promote Islam as a peaceful religion, and to improve the integration of Muslims and non-Muslims.[10]

Originally posted by MarioOnTheFly


You know why? because their ways are ingrained in the ideology of Islam. They are loosely supported by their communities, and even their "holy book", according to interpretations of certain Imams, can be used to justify extremism. They are known about and covered up. Protected by their muslim community. Have you ever heard that some muslim community arrested or wistleblown on any of their extremists?

An interesting aspect of this type of violent action in the name of Islam is that it lacks the nationalistic or sectarian complications so often associated with it in the parts of the world most afflicted with Islamic violence. Rigby was clearly the victim of a world view certain Muslims have. A world view that has its ties directly connected with Muslims worldwide and their relationship with the non Islamic world. Rigbys death speaks to the pan Islamic mentality. A mentality that seeks to unify all of Islam with Rigby as microcosm to the macrocosm.

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


Forgive me if i'm wrong, because i very well could be. But his actions, although terrible, weren't in any direct link to religion? When you hear "for Allah" or see "Islam" scrawled across war memorials your first thought would be to think it was to do with their religion, Islam.... right? And that their actions were perhaps fueled by their religion? Which of course, doesn't put Islam in a great light, unfortunately. As i'm well aware that Islam is a religion of peace.

Originally posted by Spiramirabilis


Let me ask you something - did Timothy McVeigh make you fear white Americans?

Tim McVeigh is still used where they can get away with it, to smear the whole lot. Yes indeed. many would have him the poster boy of pro-constitutional types. Oh yes indeedy. And Most of those are the same calling for tolerance for the Muslims in the face of radical outbreaks.

reply to post by Spiramirabilis

The peaceful Muslims - which is most of them - are never going to attract the kind of attention the extremists do. It takes just two young idiots (for example) to plant some bombs and rock the entire world

but how come young people of the western world are not that in to extremism or fundamentalism ? Can you and a friend take a couple of bombs...blow up the parliament and get support from anyone? the only attention you would be getting by this...is from a cell mate if you get to the prison.

Let me ask you something - did Timothy McVeigh make you fear white Americans?

my point exactly. Did he win any support with it?

No, it didn't made me afraid of white Americans...because his deed was aimed at the Gov if I'm not mistaken. It wasn't a movement, a group of extremists...it was a single man that had a grudge. Hardly comparable to religious extremist groups that have a continuing agenda.

Originally posted by buster2010


There are very few religions on this planet that aren't up to it's neck in blood. How many Christians do you hear or see on tv condemning the way America has been bombing Muslim nations for over 60 years? As the FBI has stated Jews commit more acts of terrorism in the states than the Muslims do but when was the last time you heard about one? People are being led to think Islam is such a threat by the media.

Yep. Just put a little heat on the thing and it will show its face. Word to the wise.

True story

Growing up as a child in the 70's and 80's in the UK, up to m early teens I was scared of Irish people.

Irish people were bad. They shot each other. Kneecappings and sectarian killings were rife. They blew people up with car bombs, nail bombs. And pipe bombs. They blew up town and city centres. I used to flinch at Irish accents and actively avoid anyone that had one. Omagh and Londonderry were the pits of hell.

Hell, they even came close to killing me twice..

And then I grew up, and realised that not all Irish people were to blame. Just a few. A very small minority.

According to some posters here - applying their logic - all Irish people are evil and always will be.

Think about it.

reply to post by Logarock

Tim McVeigh is still used where they can get away with it, to smear the whole lot. Yes indeed. many would have him the poster boy of pro-constitutional types. Oh yes indeedy. And Most of those are the same calling for tolerance for the Muslims in the face of radical outbreaks.

Got a point?

Don't be so vague (always so vague) - speak up if you've got something real to say

:-)

reply to post by xavi1000

They are pretending and lying !
Muslims are allowed to lie to unbelievers in order to defeat them
www.thereligionofpeace.com...

Please explain to all of us.... why you have the image of a MUSLIM actor, Shah Rukh Kahn.... as your avatar.

reply to post by neformore


are you insane? your comparing Irish republicanism to a worldwide jihad which draws direct inspiration from the Quran.

your heads gone.

Originally posted by neformore


And then I grew up, and realised that not all Irish people were to blame. Just a few. A very small minority.

According to some posters here - applying their logic - all Irish people are evil and always will be.

Think about it.

edit on 27/5/13 by neformore because: (no reason given)

I haven't seen anyone here demonstrate an encompassing misunderstanding of all of Muslims. But some sects of Islam are violent and always will be.

So this defense of Islam is sort of cathartic for you then considering the fear of Irish in your youth. Its normal to swing back to far the other way once we understand we have misunderstood. Then later we learn to sort it out.

Originally posted by Spiramirabilis
reply to post by Logarock

 

Tim McVeigh is still used where they can get away with it, to smear the whole lot. Yes indeed. many would have him the poster boy of pro-constitutional types. Oh yes indeedy. And Most of those are the same calling for tolerance for the Muslims in the face of radical outbreaks.

Got a point?

Don't be so vague (always so vague) - speak up if you've got something real to say

:-)

My comments could only be considered vague by someone locked on to their position to the point of cognitive dissidence. Like a heat seeking missile set to lock on to a set temperature.

reply to post by MrConspiracy

Forgive me if i'm wrong, because i very well could be. But his actions, although terrible, weren't in any direct link to religion? When you hear "for Allah" or see "Islam" scrawled across war memorials your first thought would be to think it was to do with their religion, Islam.... right? And that their actions were perhaps fueled by their religion? Which of course, doesn't put Islam in a great light, unfortunately. As i'm well aware that Islam is a religion of peace.

Fundamentalists - and extremists

Does it matter if they're religious, political - or some other kind of crazy?

Watch and see how it's all being sold - we're naturally inclined to fear 'other'

There are people around that will use that - they've got no problem lumping everyone in one group together and hoping nobody will bother to think: it's this entire group - it's everybody

I'm not saying there isn't an issue here - the fundamentalists want what they want. What I am saying is - the propaganda is working on our worst fears. It requires a certain amount of thinking to not just see them as an invading horde

Many, many innocent people are going to be targeted - because of a few

Because people aren't thinking

:-)