Former US Senate Majority Leader calls Mathematics And Science - A "Waste Of Time"

reply to post by Cabin


The senate majority leader isn't in charge of the educational system, he's just giving his opinion.

I think what he said is right. Hell, how many times do we really use 80% of the info we learn in school. I've got a business degree and have taken many math and statistics classes and I can say with all honesty that I never use it in my day to day operation.

With a 50% drop out rate in high school today maybe he has a good point. Schools should prepare kids for the real world not for a career in academia.

Originally posted by Cabin

Originally posted by Nephalim

Then those art schools are wasting their time and their students time, not to mention tuition money. They can teach those particulars in art class because they're integral to an art students specialization and art itself.

Lessons can be combined and focused into a concentration as they pertain to that field.
I believe your noteworthy mentions only help to prove my point.

Here is no tuition money... Universities are free of charge, as they should be.

If only these terms were covered it would give nothing. A deeper understanding needs to be in order for the change to happen, it has to be part of thinking, in order to understand these well, one needs to learn quite complex mathemathics.

Many famous artists were also mathemathicians, engineers, scientists.

Da Vinci is probably the best example. Salvador Dali, Pablo Picasso.

From Music, Bartok, Debussy, Satie come to mind.

Most classics used mathemathics, whether consciously or subconciously in their works, which mean their thinking skills were strong enough. They did not even need to learn mathemathics in order to use it in their fields. It came naturally -genius-level.

Who knows maybe we would not have all this amazing art, if some had not learned such thinking through math...

Here let me show you something.
To some, or rather a great majority of people, this is worth more than any of the work those very exceptional people did. Its all over kitchens across the world.

That has no math in it. Micheal Angelo Simoni and Leonardo Da'vinci, Titian! undone and destroyed by children I tell you! and in ten minutes before naptime! What does that say about your math and list of exceptionals sir?

When I became a draftsman, I used all the Trigonometry and Geometry I had desperately tried to sleep through in school. Luckily some of it stuck.

Originally posted by BoogieMan911
Any person who needs maths for their job now-days can now type in the numbers on their mobile phone, so the "pencil and paper" or "mind-calculating" days are over.

As for science, so much is suppressed, and some science can even lead to death - Water Powered Cars ect.

So I agree with this guy.

People need simple math skills. Badly. The "now we have phone calculators" argument is invalid.

How many times a bill totals $16.50 (or similar) and I give a cashier $21.50 and he/she hands me back the dollar bill, saying "Oh $20 is enough" even with the machine in front of them! Ugh! Do the Math!

Other than that, ya, Science and Math are so yesterday. And deadly. People have brain aneurisms from simple problem solving these days, so we definitely need to phase them out. It's for the safety of the population, of course.

Originally posted by groingrinder
When I became a draftsman, I used all the Trigonometry and Geometry I had desperately tried to sleep through in school. Luckily some of it stuck.

Yea, you also need plane trig for machining. You get into all that industrial tech and math, boy make sure you dont sleep through class.

Originally posted by StarsInDust
reply to post by rickymouse

 

Most of the math and science we learn in school is useless in a real world scenario unless you are in that field.

I used to believe that too ( about math, always loved science) when I was younger, but I no longer feel that is true. That is because math makes you think, it exercises the brain and make us more critical thinkers. I wouldn't be so fast to dismiss this as a worthwhile subject, just because it might be hard to figure out. It's designed to be that way.

My mechanical aptitude was exceptionally high on the intelligence tests and I did real good in Math. I had an interest in fixing things, I took them apart and put them back together just to see what made them work. You do not need math to excel in critical thinking, you need interest and curiosity and also access to information to help you learn.

You are right about building our ability to think though. Math is one way to do it. Every subject teaches us something. The trouble now is that they are omitting the complex thinking and teaching people knowledge. Knowledge can blind us because what you know can influence how you perceive things.

Even most of the kids can see how messed up they have made education. It is not the teachers fault either, they are being required to get the kids to pass a test made by a bunch of nuts up high in management. No kid left behind is working well, they are all getting left behind now so behind is the new norm.

reply to post by Cabin


Why are there 15,000 political science students.......do we really need that many????

Originally posted by pavil
reply to post by Cabin

 

Why are there 15,000 political science students.......do we really need that many????

Should we (schools, government) institute a policy that dictates how many people are allowed to study a certain (undergraduate) disciple for a degree?

(Advanced degrees are a bit different).

Can only hope he didn't multiply! What are people going to do in an emergency when their devices are not available? Math is a building block for learning other things.

A well-rounded education is best. You are preparing for life, not just to succeed (whatever that is)
but to gain knowledge about the environment you are surrounded by.

Science has real world applications. You will encounter many obstacles in your life
that deal with science--from the basic to the complex. Understanding basic science will make your
life easier.

Math, on the other hand, has few real world applications beyond simple arithmetic. While it is
quite handy to have the ability to add and subtract and multiply in your head, sadly, almost
no-one (especially the coming generation) does this anymore.

In my case I never finished ninth grade and refused to learn algebra. In my life I have never had
a need to apply algebra in any situation. What I can do is calculate percents and do basic math
in my head and that has made my life easier to a large degree...

My point about math is this: Some people seem to be hard-wired for math excellence. These people
generally go on to become engineers, CPA's and rocket scientists. For this reason math is an important
subject, if only to allow these people access so that they may realize their potential excellence.
But for most of us, I would say concentrate on the basics. It is quite disheartening when you
hand a teller two dollars and a penny to pay for a bill of $1.51....and they cannot make that
calculation without help---It's even worse when you know that person graduated high school and
passed algebra...

I bet he can add up the numbers when checking his payslip

He qualified it by saying "if you want to become a lawyer"...but I feel that a grounding in mathematics and science can help anyone by a) learning to think in terms of mathematical relationships, b) learning to solve problems (eqauations, esp word problems), c) learning the scientific method and d) learning the "study of" anything (science being the "study of" of the structure and behavior of the natural world). That doesn't mean that you need an advanced knowledge of differential equations but everyone should know mathematical derivatives.

"Just don't see no need in all this science stuff", he said.
In a tweet to one of his facebook friends, while watching a porn movie on his 50" flat screen computer moniter.
"All this education has been a total waste".

reply to post by CosmicCitizen

"I'm not very good at math." I.R.S. official

Mild electric shocks to brain may help students solve maths problems

www.guardian.co.uk...

I just remembered reading this article last Friday and thought I would mention it here. I guess a cattle prod to the head would be needed for some one like a politician though.

Originally posted by pavil
reply to post by Cabin

 

Why are there 15,000 political science students.......do we really need that many????

Now you know why a lot of these kids can't find work after leaving school.

reply to post by Liquesence


It is done like that here. Although still there are too many people making pointless degrees... and afterwards whining about not finding a job. "I have masters degree and no job". Most social sciences do not provide any real life skills, like engineering, IT and most sciences provide. In my opinion these should be secondary fields, so that the primary field is some kind of science and you choose the secondary - philosophy for example.

The government works hard on getting more people to learn the best degrees out there. There are also far too many lawyers and economists, while there is huge deficiency in good engineers and IT-guys. So the system has been built so that nearly anybody who wants to learn engineering or some "useful" degree, gets government-tuitoned place, while there is huge competition for same places in less-needed fields. For example 10 tuitoned place in economy and social sciences per class, while 100s in engineering fields. I do not know anybody round who has paid for their engineering/IT education, while most people studying social sciences/economy/law have to pay for it. Although not as much as in US, around 2000- 3000 euros a semester. These have been made more costly. One credit point in engineering subjects costs around 20-30 euros, while economy and social sciences have to pay twice/three times as much for a credit point.

+ there are huge campaigns on promoting engineering education.

reply to post by Cabin

The magic, ironic words here:

-- if your goal is to become a lawyer.

What line of work were the majority of our Senate and Congress members in before they entered politics? They were mostly lawyers of course! No wonder these idiots can't balance our Federal budget!

Originally posted by iunlimited491
After elementary school, kids should begin learning about some of the issues plaguing society, and condition them to 'want' to try and solve them. Whatever skill-set that requires will come after the fact. Motivate them to become free thinkers, and act accordingly for the benefit of the planet.

Expose them to something awe inspiring.

It's been shown that experiencing true awe can transform our thinking; making time seem to slow down, giving us more patience, less materialistic, willing to volunteer to help others, and an appreciation for all life.
source

Originally posted by Liquesence

Originally posted by pavil
reply to post by Cabin

 

Why are there 15,000 political science students.......do we really need that many????

Should we (schools, government) institute a policy that dictates how many people are allowed to study a certain (undergraduate) disciple for a degree?

(Advanced degrees are a bit different).

No but parents or those backing the loans for these students should... It astounds me the amount of people with college degrees I know who are employed in fields not even closely related to their degree. Spend $100,000 to $200,000 on a college education that you never use in your work. Doesn't make much sense to me, that's all I am saying.