To Vilify the Ego

reply to post by TheProphetMark


Try taking a leaf from Aristotle's philosophy on the golden mean.

In philosophy, especially that of Aristotle, the golden mean is the desirable middle between two extremes, one of excess and the other of deficiency. For example courage, a virtue, if taken to excess would manifest as recklessness and if deficient as cowardice.

To the Greek mentality, it was an attribute of beauty. Both ancients and moderns realized that there is a close association in mathematics between beauty and truth. The poet John Keats, in his Ode on a Grecian Urn, put it this way:

"Beauty is truth, truth beauty," -- that is all
Ye know on earth, and all ye need to know.

The Greeks believed there to be three 'ingredients' to beauty: symmetry, proportion, and harmony. This triad of principles infused their life. They were very much attuned to beauty as an object of love and something that was to be imitated and reproduced in their lives, architecture, education (Paideia) and politics. They judged life by this mentality.

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by HarryTZ

The term 'ego' is used to refer to our identification with the physical body. It is that which desires, wishes, hates, envies, dreams, regrets, and, in the big picture, hides our true selves. To claim that you are the ego is extremely ignorant, and even nonsensical. The ego, as said in the OP, is just an amalgamation of abstract ideas. It does not truly exist.

What is the ego an abstraction of? The same as everything we call ourselves. It's just another abstraction of the self. When you call yourself "knowingness" or "beingness", and insinuate the untrue-ness of the "physical body", another abstraction of the self, you are still really talking about abstractions of yourself, and choosing one abstraction over another, simply because it sounds cooler or more pious or something.

One does not have a choice in the contents of the ego (thoughts, feelings, etc.). They are all ideas implanted by external sources. The true 'you' is pure, thoughtless, desireless, beliefless consciousness. Pure knowing of What Is. And this knowingness, this beingness, is infinite bliss.

This is simply untrue and make-believe—all ideas implanted from external sources. There is no "true you" but what you already are every waking moment. What you're describing is someone in a coma. Comatose humans are not "true humans".

Those who seek to blame the ego are doing so with the ego, because to blame a thing is to acknowledge that it exists in the first place, and the ego does not exist.

Do you not exist? I exist. I am what the ego, the body, the soul, the mind, "consciousness", "beingness" and other such terminology, are abstractions of.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by HarryTZ

 

What is the ego an abstraction of? The same as everything we call ourselves. It's just another abstraction of the self. When you call yourself "knowingness" or "beingness", and insinuate the untrue-ness of the "physical body", another abstraction of the self, you are still really talking about abstractions of yourself, and choosing one abstraction over another, simply because it sounds cooler or more pious or something.

The delusions that contribute to the feeling that one is separate from existence. That is the ego. It is very abstract because it does not truly exist.
Relativity, by its own definition, is completely abstract. Right cannot be, without left, Hot cannot be, without cold, Good cannot be, without evil. Without its opposite, nothing can exist. This is not the case with Absolute reality. Here, all opposites are one. This is pure consciousness, awareness of awareness of awareness. The term 'consciousness' is, unfortunately, an abstraction we must use to speak of Absolute reality, however what we are speaking of, is the only thing that is not abstract.

This is simply untrue and make-believe—all ideas implanted from external sources.

So your thoughts, ideas, beliefs, values, morals, wants and desires, all originate from within yourself? The external world (and this includes your physical body) has nothing to do with them? That is simply untrue.

There is no "true you" but what you already are every waking moment. What you're describing is someone in a coma. Comatose humans are not "true humans".

Have you not heard of Nirvana?

Do you not exist? I exist. I am what the ego, the body, the soul, the mind, "consciousness", "beingness" and other such terminology, are abstractions of.

I am sure now you can see how this is irrelevant.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope


Another great and well-thought thread mate. People should realize the values that we are trying to trash. Or more accurately, the values that someone tried to trash. S&F !

When people vilify the ego they are attempting to express disdain for the pesky urge us humans have to prop ourselves up even at the expense of others.

Given that this is the common layman's understanding of the ego, I say continue to vilify it.

Originally posted by HarryTZ
The delusions that contribute to the feeling that one is separate from existence. That is the ego. It is very abstract because it does not truly exist.

"Ego" is latin for "Myself". I cannot be separated from existence, because I exist. Thus, if my existence is true, then so is myself - thus so is the Ego. The Ego is not all the bad things. It's also all the good inside of you. It's what makes you want to evolve. Removing, or vilifying that, will result in devolution - the loss of values, of self-esteem - and then one would be no different than animals, which lacks self-recognition.

Selfishness but also selflessness are BOTH present in the Ego. Many animals lack Ego but are still selfish nevertheless. That's because one isn't the other. One is our complete self-image striving for evolution, the other is our primitive side only.

reply to post by HarryTZ


Ego is self-recognition. Without ego, we wouldn't continue to exist for very long because our individualistic existence demands that we live individually. You must be aware of yourself to continue maintaining yourself. If you are not aware of yourself, you will either face crippling difficulties in life...or there will be no life for you at all.

The ego is best defined as being the whole body-mind complex - for the sake of distinguishing oneself from others in order to communicate, etc. This is obviously a useful and necessary function for distinguishing individuals.

However, the process of ego is also typically creating the illusion that one is actually separate from the field in which we all arise - and thus one believes that s/he actually exists as a separate ego-I or point-of-view in each and every moment. This is just a process in response to objects and others arising in our awareness - nothing more than that.

When one goes beyond this ego-defining point-of-view making process of mind, then the body-mind's inherent unity with all is recognized, enjoyed, and fully participated in. Until this illusion, created by identifying with this point-of-view making process, is noticed and released in any given moment (and ultimately, in each and every moment), we feel separate from others and things, and thus falsely live with a sense of separate self - not as the whole body-mind participating fully in Reality itself.

Originally posted by swanne

"Ego" is latin for "Myself". I cannot be separated from existence, because I exist. Thus, if my existence is true, then so is myself - thus so is the Ego. The Ego is not all the bad things. It's also all the good inside of you. It's what makes you want to evolve. Removing, or vilifying that, will result in devolution - the loss of values, of self-esteem - and then one would be no different than animals, which lacks self-recognition.

Selfishness but also selflessness are BOTH present in the Ego. Many animals lack Ego but are still selfish nevertheless. That's because one isn't the other. One is our complete self-image striving for evolution, the other is our primitive side only.

Of course you cannot be separate from existence. You ARE existence. We have just to remember this.

Without ego, there would be no need for evolution. Without ego, there would only be compassion for all living beings, true selflessness (literally, without the illusion of self).
Animals are unconscious, in a sort of deep sleep. They may not have ego, however they are only aware of their senses and their instincts.

-------------

Unconscious being: "I am hungry."
Realized being: "The body requires food."

This site explains how to let go of your ego. Its most fascinating.

reply to post by HarryTZ


So you are not your body? How does rejecting the individual nature of your existence improve your existential experience? Suddenly, everything you need to continue existing becomes an absolute pain. Suddenly, you are no longer satisfied with being inside your own head and you suffer chronic depression as a result of your individualized awareness.

That's if you don't just stop functioning period.

It's taken me a very long time to be at peace with my ego.

Yes, I am selfish and care what people think of me. It's not an abstraction; it's emotion and recognition of my soul.

Without ego somewhere; I doubt if this thread would have been created.

Anyone that strives to understand anything is exercising their ego. Freud misunderstood the "ego" Jung didn't.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope


Thanks for the thread, but IMO you are making it too complex. The ego IS the root of all our problems, or at least many.

But the ego is never wrong.

It is just unconscious.

Don't fight the ego in yourself or others, you will just make it stronger.

Just be aware when it is operating in yourself and others.

When you are aware of it in others, and recognize it as ego, you cannot help but NOT take it personally; just be the witnessing presence - this will not strengthen the ego in others and may actually help deflate it. Practice awareness and forgiveness - if you have experienced this you will be aware of their sublime power.

When you observe the ego in yourself, it is by definition no longer ego, as ego is the UNOBSERVED mind, now when it occurs it is just an old conditioned thought pattern, and you will laugh how for so long you were taken in by this imposter.

Take personal responsibility to recognize the ego in yourself.

Simple. Profound. Achieveable instantaneously.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity

So you are not your body? How does rejecting the individual nature of your existence improve your existential experience? Suddenly, everything you need to continue existing becomes an absolute pain. Suddenly, you are no longer satisfied with being inside your own head and you suffer chronic depression as a result of your individualized awareness.

That's if you don't just stop functioning period.

Was the Buddha in 'absolute pain'? Was Jesus 'chronically depressed'? Are you suggesting that the enlightened Masters that walk the planet are anything less than blissful? Sure, they still must feed the body, take care of the body. But they chose to stay with it, so that they may teach others how to liberate themselves from theirs. They are not 'bound' to the body. They may leave it whenever they wish. Their consciousness expands far beyond the physical, even as they go about their days.

reply to post by HarryTZ

Was the Buddha in 'absolute pain'? Was Jesus 'chronically depressed'? Are you suggesting that the enlightened Masters that walk the planet are anything less than blissful? Sure, they still must feed the body, take care of the body. But they chose to stay with it, so that they may teach others how to liberate themselves from theirs. They are not 'bound' to the body. They may leave it whenever they wish. Their consciousness expands far beyond the physical, even as they go about their days.

They did not spend their lives rejecting their individual nature. They simply improved their understanding of it. Like it or not, you can't do anything about your individualized existence unless you die. There's no point agonizing over something you can't change. As long as you are an individual, as long as you are in possession of the chemical vessel you call your body, your body will hold a foremost priority as the capsule of your essence. Being aware of yourself - having an ego - is essential for maintaining your physical and emotional health.

Jesus never rejected his physical condition. While he depreciated it in light of the future, he never sought to cast it off. He did the best he could with what he had until it was time to let go. Why can't you do the same?

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Having a body does not make you individual. You simply have a body, as well as the rest of existence. You are one with existence. You are not a 'part' of it, you are it.

*double post*

reply to post by HarryTZ

Having a body does not make you individual. You simply have a body, as well as the rest of existence. You are one with existence. You are not a 'part' of it, you are it.

So the tree in my backyard represents the entirety of the botanical kingdom? To look at the tree is to know every botanical organism in existence?

You really should work on your logic. It's a little rusty.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


The physical organism can be said to be individual. You are not the physical organism.