Laser Controlled Humans Closer To Reality

Just read this and thought it would be an interesting subject for ATS'ers, both in an innovational and potentially conspiratorial fashion.

Flashes of light may one day be used to control the human brain, and that day just got a lot closer.

Using lasers, researchers at the MIT Media Lab were able to activate a specific set of neurons in a monkey’s brain. Though the technique has been used to control and explore neural circuits in fish, flies and rodents, this is the first time the much-hyped technology has ever been used in primates.

I have mixed feelings on this. One part of me says medical advances for mental illnesses and brain disorders are a good thing. However, my paranoid side, now greatly subsided thanks to our deny ignorance perspectives, wonders about other uses for this tech. I am not talking just about the gubbmnt/military but also marketing tactics and techniques. It seems that if they get this tech dialed in successfully, where does it end?

“Many disorders are associated with changes in specific cell types,” said Boyden. “For therapeutic purposes, you want to affect certain cells, but you want to leave normal cells intact. The ability to use light to turn specific cells on and off with very precise timing could in principle allow new therapies.”

Cool, laser precision(less collateral damage perhaps), but the ability to turn individual cells on and off sounds like a lot of power if it were used for nefarious purposes. Surely they will be able to target a single atom if desired at some point.

Future applications could involve using light-emitting neural prosthetics to replace the electrodes used in deep brain stimulation, which currently activate or silence a broad range of neurons. Deep brain stimulation has shown promise in treatments of Parkinson’s disease, epilepsy and depression, but it has a number of side effects, stemming in part from its lack of specificity.

Yea, side effects could be scary and irreversible maybe. I wonder if it would just be damaged areas or behavioral changes?

“Our ability to remedy problems in the brain may ultimately be limited by how many side effects occur,” said Boyden. “We could find ways to shut down seizures but the side effects might be intolerable. By pinpointing specific cell types, we could craft therapeutic neuromodulators and directly develop therapies, while preserving a high degree of well-being.”

Seizures and Parkinsons relief would be wonderful. What about cancer cells?

Genetically, mice are ideal model organisms — but their behavioral repertoire isn’t very sophisticated. If neuroscientists hope to understand and treat problems like ADHD, schizophrenia, depression and compulsive behaviors like addiction, they can run far-more-powerful experiments using primates.

Breaks my heart to think of the animal subjects, but yea, I know, it is for our own good? Just wonder if we give the affliction to the monkeys or do they develop these ailments naturally?

“There are many limitations with the current way we try to understand neural circuits, primarily the lack of specificity. The hope is that as this sort of research continues in labs around the world, it will become possible to specifically target many different classes of neurons. We can learn how each of them contributes to specific cognitive functions.”

www.wired.com...
Sounds like this an inevitable part of our future and as with so many powerful innovations, I hope more good than harm is done. I see additional uses like crowd control or persuasion for the masses. I just think opening pathways to such intimate areas could be scary. Are these lasers visible? Perhaps the title is misleading, and "controlled" is far fetched, but I personally have a few reservations about the abilities at our forefront these days with quantum computing, human genome mapping/ therapy and pharmaceutical industries' lust for profits beyond viability. A brave new world indeed...

Related info:

A team at Harvard University has built a computerized system to manipulate worms—making them start and stop, giving them the sensation of being touched, and even prompting them to lay eggs

www.scientificamerican.com...

Peace,
spec

Interesting information, speculativeoptomist.

However, though I'm too tired to try to find sources right now (know that's a lousy excuse, but nevertheless true), I'm pretty sure this tech isn't all that new. They have been "researching" for many, many years now many, many (pardon my repetitive illiteration there), different ways of affecting neronic activity in the brain, as well as how to sort of re-wire how those synapses are fired, and what gets lit up in the firing of them. Light, via laser, is just another way......
Great information, however. And I, too, am quite concerned that such things are usually presented in a fashion that says all the good that can be done with it, when that isn't really what will be taking place. Consider if such things are used for "crowd control," how free a country, or a people, are we, reallly?

reply to post by tetra50

Hey tetra, I have heard of light therapy and manipulation by sequencing but not of direct laser application to specific regions of the brain. These days who knows what all is or will be going on with this type of stuff. These advances can bring great relief potentially, but It seems part of our nature to exploit such abilities for some advantage that may not be in everyone's best interest. Guess it comes with the territory. I just wonder if my tin foil hat will still work?

Thanks for the reply,
spec

reply to post by speculativeoptimist


Hey Spec: I always laugh at the tinfoil hat thing.....I don't know if it's that people want to put their paranoia on me, if it seems that I am truly that paranoid, or if it's just a common joke. But just a quick note about that whole tinnfoil hat thiing: it actually would increase anything you would be wishing to avoid. Just a warning.

Tetra50

reply to post by tetra50

Maybe I will turn it inside out!
2nd

Originally posted by speculativeoptimist
Cool, laser precision(less collateral damage perhaps), but the ability to turn individual cells on and off sounds like a lot of power if it were used for nefarious purposes. Surely they will be able to target a single atom if desired at some point.

Well, for this thing to work, they have to make a big hole in your head and thread in fiber optics, then you have a big horky LED hockey puck on your head. It's not like they can shine a blue laser at you from across the room and light up some exact place on your brain, and that's assuming they've also made holes in your head to inject the virus. Oh, and you can't target below the surface, so it's sort of not happening for deep brain structures. Other than that, no problem.

And, of course, you'd have to ask "why would you want to target a single atom", in this case, they're toggling genes on and off. Down below cell size, it's of no use. Not that you can target a single atom with a laser anyway. Well, not and want it to be something you'd want to be around. You'd have to have a laser with a wavelength half the size of an atom, and it would be...energetic.

Sounds like this an inevitable part of our future and as with so many powerful innovations, I hope more good than harm is done. I see additional uses like crowd control or persuasion for the masses. I just think opening pathways to such intimate areas could be scary. Are these lasers visible? Perhaps the title is misleading, and "controlled" is far fetched, but I personally have a few reservations about the abilities at our forefront these days with quantum computing, human genome mapping/ therapy and pharmaceutical industries' lust for profits beyond viability. A brave new world indeed...

The article is sort of sparse for info. However, about 10 minutes and you too can read the original papers, where you'll find it's a bit more than shining colored laser pointers at people resulting in them doing the Imhotep two-step going yessss maaaaasster.

Bedlam: en.wikipedia.org...

I am so tired of your "nothing to see here...move on, bullcrap, etc....
so tell me how you are going to save us from the ongoing lies of logic, etc....and save us all, please.....because I am waiting with baited breath and trying to survive while you provide the answers......as you show up on ever thread discussing this topic, and some of are waiting for your alternative explantions. so we can finally move on...or not....


and that's the thing...I have challenged you where it hurts and it true or not .....becaue you cannot provide the proof of life and what it means no more than I can.......and I am downright tired of feeding people like you, who deny theire being fed, and surviving off mistaken science, purposefully, while you benefit and live off the lie......


There will probably, likely, be a day, a time, and a place, where and when the SHTF, and you will NOT be on my shortlist, for all I have read you have wrote and thought and lead us down the road on this website.....for there will be a reckoning, and I pray and hope for you when it comes, but will not fight for you when it is time to fight.....
good luck...
tetra50

Magnetocardiography (MCG) is a technique to measure the magnetic fields produced by electrical activity in the heart using extremely sensitive devices such as the Superconducting Quantum Interference Device (SQUIDs). If the magnetic field is measured using a multichannel device, a map of the magnetic field is obtained over the chest; from such a map, using mathematical algorithms that take into account the conductivity structure of the torso, it is possible to locate the source of the activity. For example, sources of abnormal rhythms or arrhythmia, may be located using MCG.
Contents [hide]
1 History
2 Clinical Implementation
3 See also
4 References
5 External links
History [edit]

The first MCG measurements were made by Baule and McFee[1] using two large coils placed over the chest, connected in opposition to cancel out the relatively large magnetic background. Heart signals were indeed seen, but were very noisy. The next development was by David Cohen,[2] who used a magnetically shielded room to reduce the background, and a smaller coil with better electronics; the heart signals were now less noisy, allowing a magnetic map to be made, verifying the magnetic properties and source of the signal. However, the use of an inherently noisy coil detector discouraged widespread interest in the MCG. The turning point came with the development of the sensitive detector called the SQUID (superconducting quantum interference device) by James Zimmerman.[3] The combination of this detector and Cohen's new shielded room at MIT allowed the MCG signal to be seen as clearly as the conventional electrocardiogram, and the publication of this result[4] marked the real beginning of magnetocardiography (as well as Biomagnetism generally).
Magnetocardiography is now used in various laboratories and clinics around the world, both for research on the normal human heart, and for clinical diagnosis.[5]
Clinical Implementation [edit]

Recent MCG technology has been implemented to hospitals in Germany. The MCG system, CS MAG II of Biomagnetik Park GmbH was installed in Asklepios Hospital, Hamburg in 2011.

Originally posted by tetra50
Bedlam: en.wikipedia.org...

I can't WAIT for you to explain how this relates in any way to the topic. It's like you spun the wheel of fortune and picked the first link you came to.

I am so tired of your "nothing to see here...move on, bullcrap, etc....
so tell me how you are going to save us from the ongoing lies of logic, etc....and save us all, please.....

Ok, my first act to save you is to suggest you go do some remedial general science. Oh, and algebra, it's the 'gateway drug' to calculus.

because I am waiting with baited breath...

Did you eat a minnow, or maybe some crickets?

eta: Did you hear about the cat that ate cheese before settling down by the mouse hole? He was waiting with baited breath...

and that's the thing...I have challenged you where it hurts and it true or not .....becaue you cannot provide the proof of life and what it means no more than I can.......and I am downright tired of feeding people like you, who deny theire being fed, and surviving off mistaken science, purposefully, while you benefit and live off the lie......

The lie that I'm typing this on...oh, wait, science DOES work. Never mind.

eta: Does cognitive dissonance hurt? I mean, you're whinging about 'mistaken science' but you're foaming because I could actually READ a science article about photogenetic manipulation of brain tissue, a very out-there application of science. If you believe this is true (and it is, it's just not what you thought it said), how can you with the other side of your mouth whinge on about science, whilst typing on a very advanced scientifically derived piece of engineering, about an advanced scientific topic you're defending? Hard to sort out. Is it that you think science is "mistaken" only when it doesn't agree with your ideation?

There will probably, likely, be a day, a time, and a place, where and when the SHTF, and you will NOT be on my shortlist...

I can't actually imagine a time where you could do anything in a SHTF experience except get in my way. However, if I need a mystic afterwards to influence the commoners, you'll be the first one I come to.

reply to post by Bedlam

Yes, I can comprehend and realize the title(not mine) implication may be a bit reaching,yet accurate for now, at least in a therapeutic setting for specific disabilities/injuries. The slippery slope, as in any nefarious uses, may occur in the near future as they dial this in more. Yes I know "may" is speculation, but that is as far as I wanted to present it as, not " oh my they are out to control us." I just think as this tech is further developed a laser could be used from a distance to target specific brain regions for desired reaction. Sci-fi? Maybe but you know how that could be, today's fantasy is tomorrows reality sometimes.

Originally posted by speculativeoptimist
reply to post by Bedlam

 

Yes, I can comprehend and realize the title(not mine) implication may be a bit reaching,yet accurate for now, at least in a therapeutic setting for specific disabilities/injuries.

It requires infection of a specific area of the brain with a virus, then illumination of that area with a specific wavelength of light. One that does not penetrate the skull.

The slippery slope, as in any nefarious uses, may occur in the near future as they dial this in more. Yes I know "may" is speculation, but that is as far as I wanted to present it as, not " oh my they are out to control us." I just think as this tech is further developed a laser could be used from a distance to target specific brain regions for desired reaction. Sci-fi? Maybe but you know how that could be, today's fantasy is tomorrows reality sometimes.

Given that it requires a setup that requires a burrhole at the least, and then for stimulation requires another, it seems pretty damned unlikely. Consider - you have a skull in the way. You also might need a non-surface brain area stimulated - that gets even tougher.

Consider the diffusion you'll get even with IR, and of course as you get down to IR you're fringing on self stimulation by internal emission. You aren't going to be targeting specific brain regions unless you replace the guy's skull with a nice glass one and cut off his scalp.

It sounds all ominous but it's a medical tool for rat study.