Breaking the illusion of heaven

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by sacgamer25

 

After this life I believe the physical and all things that cause sin become no more. And thus all of us come together in love. What that means exactly I do not know.

What you did was make the afterlife vague, and that's right! For anyone to say they KNOW what the afterlife would be like is just downright lying.

For some its a hope/faith thing, something better than what exists here. Without any reference than dreamscapes you are lost in imagination. I cannot think of anything more cruel than to leave the human left out to hang and dry swinging in the wind, the promise of Jesus that your spirit lives on. No wonder persons of faith are so desparate.

reply to post by vethumanbeing


I am not desperate as you claim. I am perfectly happy in my life. I am in search of nothing, because love has provided me everything that I need.

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

I am not desperate as you claim. I am perfectly happy in my life. I am in search of nothing, because love has provided me everything that I need.

I cannot understand this "love" thing. I know its an energyform (of very HIGH vibration) I am not perfectly happy as I have too many questions unanswered. I am in search of EVERYTHING because I dont own the proceedural Manual that explains the purpose of "Being A Human" and ITS relationship to OUR Creator. Love is for me the blanket taken from me at some point as a child cut into pieces and placed in the trash (because I relied to much upon its physicality). How can anyone be perfect in this life without validation of some kind, or was that your point?

Originally posted by vethumanbeing

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

I am not desperate as you claim. I am perfectly happy in my life. I am in search of nothing, because love has provided me everything that I need.

I cannot understand this "love" thing. I know its an energyform (of very HIGH vibration) I am not perfectly happy as I have too many questions unanswered. I am in search of EVERYTHING because I dont own the proceedural Manual that explains the purpose of "Being A Human" and ITS relationship to OUR Creator. Love is for me the blanket taken from me at some point as a child cut into pieces and placed in the trash (because I relied to much upon its physicality). How can anyone be perfect in this life without validation of some kind, or was that your point?

edit on 23-5-2013 by vethumanbeing because: (no reason given)

If you pursue, I mean truly pursue. Become a servant of others, start by serving your family and friends. Just do more for them, anything, and everything. If you always at least try to keep your emotions in check, and always apologize for your mistakes. If you really put love first than you will find love.

At some point in your pursuit you will realize that you are in total control of your emotions. Simply meaning anytime you are not feeling love, it has been because you listened to the negative emotions and acted on them. Negative emotions build up in a man, and cause him to do all kinds of atrocities.

If you can learn to feel these emotions before they build up, than you can learn to understand why they came to you, before you act on them. Love is an emotion that you can choose, God sends the Spirit of Love to the one who chooses to pursue love.

We are taught that love is primarily a shared emotion. What I mean is when we love someone, they love us back, and then we feel love. This is not true. Jesus taught the truth. Love is only based on what I do; if the emotion is shared it is shared with God alone.

When you understand what Jesus is saying you can open up and start sharing love with everyone. Every time you share love with someone, you feel love. Love is dependent only on what you do, not how others react. If you do something loving, always allow yourself to experience the joy that comes from doing good. If the other person reacts favorably than you know they have felt and accepted your love, and more love will come.

You don't have to allow others to take away from the love you shared by their negative reactions. To be disappointed that your love failed to deliver the loving response you were looking for is fine. But don't let the lack of response diminish the quality of your effort. You did love the other person, so it is good for you to feel love. Since this is all you really have control of.

If you can allow yourself to always feel the joy of doing loving things for others, without needing their reaction for justification, then you will always find love when you pursue it. No one will be able to take the Spirit of Love from you, it will become a part of you, and make its home with you. You will truly become capable of pursing love, even when everyone else is opposed.

Love should be seen as a reward from God for doing kind and loving things. It is ok with God if you are selfish in love. Do as many loving things as you can think of, simply for the sole purpose of love. Then you will feel love.

You don't even have to initially feel love for the one's you help, you can simply love others for the purpose of love alone. When you learn how to love solely for the purpose of love, the Joy that comes from doing loving things for others will become an addiction.

The one thing that keeps us from understanding this is a misunderstanding of the cause and effect relationship of love.

We believe if we show someone love (cause), they will love us in return (effect)
We all know this is not always true, and at times can be a flat out lie.

If I show someone love because I believe that is what God wants, God himself loves me in return.
This I can know is always true.

Now I pursue God's perfect love, I always receive love, and not man's imperfect response to my love.

Now I have become the master of my emotions, because I am not waiting for the effect. God's love comes immediately to the one who pursues love. Stop reacting negatively to others, simply because you believe in love, and God's love will fill you.

The negative reaction itself removes God's love from your heart and you become filled with the disappointment, fear, anger, whatever is against love. Accept God's love apart from man's love and you will learn how to control those negative reactions. Because it is now God and not man that you are attempting to please.

If you do loving and kind things to serve the purpose of love, you will be filled with love.

Since I know how to find God's love I am no longer searching. There are only two choices to be guided by the Spirit of Love and find God's love, or be guided by the world and be separate from God's Love.

Pursue love and you find love. God's Love, It is the Spirit of Love, Christ Jesus that fills me. When I follow Christ's teaching, to love one another, I find God's Love.

No one can stop me from doing loving things for others, so no one can take love away from me. I can choose to react, and thus join them apart from love. Or I can choose to stay in love and allow them to be apart from love, simply by controlling my reaction to them. The choice is always yours, even if it seems impossible at times.

Remember Jesus said we are son's of God, we were born to overcome this life and to find God's love.

Originally posted by sacgamer25

Originally posted by vethumanbeing

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

I am not desperate as you claim. I am perfectly happy in my life. I am in search of nothing, because love has provided me everything that I need.

I cannot understand this "love" thing. I know its an energyform (of very HIGH vibration) I am not perfectly happy as I have too many questions unanswered. I am in search of EVERYTHING because I dont own the proceedural Manual that explains the purpose of "Being A Human" and ITS relationship to OUR Creator. Love is for me the blanket taken from me at some point as a child cut into pieces and placed in the trash (because I relied to much upon its physicality). How can anyone be perfect in this life without validation of some kind, or was that your point?

If you pursue, I mean truly pursue. Become a servant of others, start by serving your family and friends. Just do more for them, anything, and everything. If you always at least try to keep your emotions in check, and always apologize for your mistakes. If you really put love first than you will find love. If you can learn to feel these emotions before they build up, than you can learn to understand why they came to you, before you act on them. Love is an emotion that you can choose, God sends the Spirit of Love to the one who chooses to pursue love.

When you understand what Jesus is saying you can open up and start sharing love with everyone. Every time you share love with someone, you feel love. Love is dependent only on what you do, not how others react. If you do something loving, always allow yourself to experience the joy that comes from doing good. If the other person reacts favorably than you know they have felt and accepted your love, and more love will come.
We believe if we show someone love (cause), they will love us in return (effect)
We all know this is not always true, and at times can be a flat out lie.

No, I will not attest to something I do not resonate/vibrate to. I will never serve others and believe it is not a flaw in my nature, I expect the human to step up and by its innate goodness will serve others as an example to themselves (slave to outcome). I refuse to give more of myself than that I would automatically give myself. I am in charge of my health and happiness and if so being will resonate it outward (this is the nature of resonance). Love is an emotion, as you know it, and would be hormonal, Love is also an energyform misidentified (stronger than hate), it is tangible and can be mined just as gold or precious gems. If I were to state the case, I am God, and do not advocate service to others because it may bring in corruptive forces, instead the service needs to become an advocate for those in need, HELP THEM TO HELP THEMSELVES. Christ showed patience and love toward his accusers/jailers prosecuters, the return verdict was a pagent style brutal death that we have to remember; why (set up the human) for the pain of itself its sins, forgiveness. Its just sick thinking, this entire badly written play is about dishonoring the human and guilting IT into self sacrafice by a diabolical means the driving force of all of this is learned (a manipulated) self hatred.

reply to post by vethumanbeing


You don't have to believe anything I say about Jesus.

Why would you choose any mental state apart from love, if you truly believe you have the ability to choose your mental state? What other mental state is more rewarding than love. Sex is an addiction, love is an outcome.

They could not be more different in nature.

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

You don't have to believe anything I say about Jesus.
Why would you choose any mental state apart from love, if you truly believe you have the ability to choose your mental state? What other mental state is more rewarding than love. Sex is an addiction, love is an outcome.They could not be more different in nature.

I dont have a problem in recognising the lifeform 'Jesus'. I cannot choose a mental state anymore than you can choose to be or not to be angry. These are the adrenals talking (hormones). I cannot choose to love anything anymore than I can choose to hate something; as this would imply LOGIC/REASONING is part of the determining, these things you speak of are emotional, driven by the adrenal glands. I agree, but if love is a mental state, how do I achieve it, some tell me you must love to experience love. I do know the mechanism driving Sexual contact/intimacy involves lust the idea of procreation; thats different. I do not understand the ideaform of "love" other than "LOOSH" a tangible energyform that can be consumed by others, (not of this world but consumed by our manipulators none the less).

Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

You don't have to believe anything I say about Jesus.

Why would you choose any mental state apart from love, if you truly believe you have the ability to choose your mental state? What other mental state is more rewarding than love. Sex is an addiction, love is an outcome.

They could not be more different in nature.

LOL I love how people can assign 'nature' to all things EXCEPT man. Humans do not and cannot choose a mental state. Slight correction: Those that can choose a mental state are called psychopaths, like Ted Bundy.

Originally posted by jiggerj
Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by vethumanbeing

sacgamer25
You don't have to believe anything I say about Jesus.
Why would you choose any mental state apart from love, if you truly believe you have the ability to choose your mental state? What other mental state is more rewarding than love. Sex is an addiction, love is an outcome.
They could not be more different in nature.

jigger
LOL I love how people can assign 'nature' to all things EXCEPT man. Humans do not and cannot choose a mental state. Slight correction: Those that can choose a mental state are called psychopaths, like Ted Bundy.

Natural instinct will prevail over logic and reasoning, regarding emotional states of being especially the hightened ones, (fight/flight--resulting in something called murder/death or cowardace, the saving of ones own skin to the detriment of? unless lions, your platoon?). Its never good. Heightened awareness, Bundy had it as a preditor, and very logically and reasonably stalked and killed his victims. Sex Can be an addiction, and combined with murderous intent deadly. I have this idea that all of the Bundy's existing over the centuries world go to the same place/ planet and have to figure out how to victimize each other (as they become the prey themselves).

reply to post by vethumanbeing

I have this idea that all of the Bundy's existing over the centuries world go to the same place/ planet and have to figure out how to victimize each other (as they become the prey themselves).

LOL How would that work?

Bundy One: Hey, wanna go for a ride in my Volkswagon?

Bundy Two: No, but do you want to go for a ride in MY Volkswagon?

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

I have this idea that all of the Bundy's existing over the centuries world go to the same place/ planet and have to figure out how to victimize each other (as they become the prey themselves).

LOL How would that work?
Bundy One: Hey, wanna go for a ride in my Volkswagon?
Bundy Two: No, but do you want to go for a ride in MY Volkswagon?

One of them has to have more than one fake cast, a full body would not work, maybe the removable cast on one arm, a pullaway whiplash neckbrace with a convicing 'HALO' attached; an exaggerated limp, and a clown costume character "Strawberry Delight" ala John Wayne Gacy. Theyd have to start getting really tricky here with the disguises. Maybe they would ALL have to drive '63 Beetles to level the playing field.

reply to post by jiggerj

So, I have NO idea what heaven would be like. You?

I don't think anybody does, if you are a Christian.
I don't think that the Bible describes anyone going to heaven except for in Revelation which is metaphorical to mean that people who die in Christ will somehow have their souls stored there for safe keeping.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by jiggerj

 

So, I have NO idea what heaven would be like. You?

I don't think anybody does, if you are a Christian.
I don't think that the Bible describes anyone going to heaven except for in Revelation which is metaphorical to mean that people who die in Christ will somehow have their souls stored there for safe keeping.

It's been a while since I started this thread, but what I meant to get across is that every believer wants so badly to go to heaven, yet they haven't put their minds to exactly what that means. Though we have no idea what heaven would be like, we should have a pretty good idea of what heaven WOULDN'T be like.

For me, paradise wouldn't have megatons of poop and pee. So, that means we would have no bladder or colon. If no bladder or colon, then no stomach. If no stomach, then no throat. If no throat, then no mouth or nose. No lungs.

By our HUMAN nature we become discontent and always need something more, something new, something different. This human nature would turn an eternity into a living hell after a hundred years, never mind a million-billion-trillion years. We'd go insane. So, no emotions in heaven.

reply to post by jiggerj


I think that your arguments make a good point, that we don't belong anywhere other than something like we already live in.
People take something metaphorical, that Jesus serves as our representative in heaven, so in a way, we are in heaven, and take it literally, thinking we personally are all going to be there, with Jesus putting a crown on the head of every one of the "saved".

What will actually happen, as far as I can tell right now, people will be resurrected, once the world ever gets to a place where people coming back from the dead would be an acceptable thing and would actually be seen as a good thing.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by jiggerj

 

I think that your arguments make a good point, that we don't belong anywhere other than something like we already live in.
People take something metaphorical, that Jesus serves as our representative in heaven, so in a way, we are in heaven, and take it literally, thinking we personally are all going to be there, with Jesus putting a crown on the head of every one of the "saved".

What will actually happen, as far as I can tell right now, people will be resurrected, once the world ever gets to a place where people coming back from the dead would be an acceptable thing and would actually be seen as a good thing.

How about we are in charge of that destiny, if you want a palace to live in, or work in a soup kitchen to help others its all up to your choosing? My interpretation of the Kingdom of Heaven is exactly what you desire to see/recieve; and its all about a "belief in the possibility of it true". Its up to the individual. If you have no belief, no actionary event planned, I would suggest you start. If you do start 'fine tuning it" (your afterlife) while you still have time. That will be short lived as well, as you have to do the movie thing "Defending Your Life". Why it works this way is beyond me, its all part of the boomerang of understanding your existance in the first place, and why you incarned here on Earth 3D.