HR 1406 Your tax dollars at work...... making sure you can't make anything extra.

I don't really know what else to say about this. I just want to get the information out there for all of you to read. As if we didn't have enough proof that the American government is more concerned with the almighty dollar than your well being..... here's the icing on the cake.

Here's the link:

www.govtrack.us...

What a bunch of garbage. So the single parent that is lucky enough to have someone to watch their child on a weekly basis and work 60 + hours a week.... just to be able to maintain a home, car, and have dinner on the table..... will have to cut their hours and maybe get a second job. People depend on their overtime pay. Let's face it, nothing is getting cheaper. In fact everything is getting more expensive on a daily basis. By passing this bill, they have effectively punished the middle class for working too much. I cannot emphasis how this enrages me.

They continue to defecate on the working people. You know.... the ones that pay their 6 figure salaries.... even after they leave office.

Your thoughts? Mine aren't very positive when it comes down to it. When are people going to wake up and realize that it is THEIR tax dollars that pay these degenerates. We as a people are allowing this to happen. Until we all stand up together, they will continue to pass "laws" that only benefit the wealthy business owners and the bankers.

‘(B) in the case of employees who are not represented by a labor organization that has been certified or recognized as the representative of such employees under applicable law, an agreement arrived at between the employer and employee before the performance of the work and affirmed by a written or otherwise verifiable record maintained in accordance with section 11(c)-- ‘(i) in which the employer has offered and the employee has chosen to receive compensatory time in lieu of monetary overtime compensation; and ‘(ii) entered into knowingly and voluntarily by such employees and not as a condition of employment.

Seems to me its voluntary by the Employee, so they would get a choice.

The only loop hole I see is in the case of a union shop, where the union may make the choice as the Representative of all the employees.

Could end up getting screwed over in a union deal, could easily see the employer making that a condition of some other dangled carrot.

ETA

Growing up my Father got some 25-30% of his income from overtime pay, it made a big difference monetarily, but than I grew up hardly knowing my Dad as only that dude who only got to sleep at our house and was working the rest of the time.

I can reasonably see the need for this OPTION.

It appears to be up to the employee:

‘(4) PRIVATE EMPLOYER ACTIONS- An employer that provides compensatory time under paragraph (1) to employees shall not directly or indirectly intimidate, threaten, or coerce or attempt to intimidate, threaten, or coerce any employee for the purpose of--
‘(A) interfering with such employee’s rights under this subsection to request or not request compensatory time off in lieu of payment of monetary overtime compensation for overtime hours; or
‘(B) requiring any employee to use such compensatory time.

Originally posted by MilesTeg
I don't really know what else to say about this. I just want to get the information out there for all of you to read. As if we didn't have enough proof that the American government is more concerned with the almighty dollar than your well being..... here's the icing on the cake.

Here's the link:

www.govtrack.us...

What a bunch of garbage. So the single parent that is lucky enough to have someone to watch their child on a weekly basis and work 60 + hours a week.... just to be able to maintain a home, car, and have dinner on the table..... will have to cut their hours and maybe get a second job. People depend on their overtime pay. Let's face it, nothing is getting cheaper. In fact everything is getting more expensive on a daily basis. By passing this bill, they have effectively punished the middle class for working too much. I cannot emphasis how this enrages me.

They continue to defecate on the working people. You know.... the ones that pay their 6 figure salaries.... even after they leave office.

Your thoughts? Mine aren't very positive when it comes down to it. When are people going to wake up and realize that it is THEIR tax dollars that pay these degenerates. We as a people are allowing this to happen. Until we all stand up together, they will continue to pass "laws" that only benefit the wealthy business owners and the bankers.

I've worked this way for years, unofficially. I work in live performing arts. Sometimes you need the extra hours in one week and can deal with a non productive week for the next.

If I work a 60 hour week one week, I can work a 10 hour week the next, and still make two 40 hour pay checks.

A single parent pays for 70 hours of child care (in regards to my example) rather than 80 hours, and has most of a full week to spend with their child at once.

You seem to be so off base from the reality I have experienced.

Problem: Govt. penalizing and grabbing every penny they can when they see people not doing anything about it.

Solution: Start paying cash/trade goods/services between the people in order to eliminate paper trails for the Govt. to steal from.

Receipt? What's a receipt?

Are you speaking Spanish Sir?

Peace

reply to post by randomtangentsrme


Okay...... so it works for you. Performing arts, huh? Wow...... so that gives you the right to speak for the other 99.999999999999999% of the working class that have to work a 50 or 60 hour work week because "The Boss" demands it. Either that or you lose your job. It's not off base to the vast majority of people who didn't choose an abstract profession.

If you have never worked at a normal get your hands dirty job, then no offense, but you have no basis for comparison.

I'm thoroughly confused....

I just read the bill, and all it does is formalize the idea of compensatory overtime. It actually changes one thing form the hours I have worked that way: instead of getting an hour off for each hour worked over, I would get an hour and a half off after this bill.

I'm just curious exactly where the problem is here?

TheRedneck

Originally posted by MilesTeg
reply to post by randomtangentsrme

 

Okay...... so it works for you. Performing arts, huh? Wow...... so that gives you the right to speak for the other 99.999999999999999% of the working class that have to work a 50 or 60 hour work week because "The Boss" demands it. Either that or you lose your job. It's not off base to the vast majority of people who didn't choose an abstract profession.

If you have never worked at a normal get your hands dirty job, then no offense, but you have no basis for comparison.

There's more to performing arts than performing. I have skills as an electrician, a carpenter, a plumber, a sculptor, an engineer, a painter and designer. And I've been a supervisor for the last decade that actually helps the staff finish projects and get's their hands dirty. I prefer working with my hands to paperwork.
So wow! I work in the trades. Oh I also learned from General contractors who let me work around my theater jobs.
Tell me about working classes, when you do 137 hours in two weeks, or 312 hours in 25 days straight.
What was your point again?

ETA: There is no deadline like an opening night. It has to be done on time.

Originally posted by TheRedneck
I'm thoroughly confused....

I just read the bill, and all it does is formalize the idea of compensatory overtime. It actually changes one thing form the hours I have worked that way: instead of getting an hour off for each hour worked over, I would get an hour and a half off after this bill.

I'm just curious exactly where the problem is here?

TheRedneck

Really?

You seem to think/believe this is a good thing for the masses.

But I guess we all have our own agendas and misguided beliefs right?

As you are a MOD, I hope I'm wrong but....

Peace

reply to post by jude11

No, I'm asking for an explanation.

Under what circumstances is this a bad thing for an employee?

TheRedneck

reply to post by MilesTeg


The other day I stopped by this thrifty store and I can't believe I paid 3 dollars for a gallon of milk and 3 dollars for a loaf of bread and both was generic brand "Best Value." I spent a better part of a 10 dollar bill on 2 items. If that's the best value then you better get out the chest waders, because we're in deep sh*t. This place is going down fast.

reply to post by randomtangentsrme


You have to read the fine print. From what I understand of this bill..... it completely abolishes overtime. No matter what..... your paycheck is going to be the same whether you work a 40 hour week or a 60. I want my money this week, not next week. Beyond that..... if you have a death in the family or a sick kid etc. your employer can tell you
NO. You can't leave or you will lose your job. So there will be no attending gramma's funeral or sitting home with little Johnny or Jane when they are sick. They can tell you that you have to stay at work or your fired. How exactly is that a good thing?

Originally posted by MilesTeg
Beyond that..... if you have a death in the family or a sick kid etc. your employer can tell you
NO. You can't leave or you will lose your job. So there will be no attending gramma's funeral or sitting home with little Johnny or Jane when they are sick. They can tell you that you have to stay at work or your fired. How exactly is that a good thing?

If you think that they cannot already tell you “no” then you are sadly mistaken already. There is no law that says they have to allow you to have any vacation, sick, bereavement, personal leave, or even holiday time.

If you are getting these things, its because your employer has granted them as benefits, they are not legally protected, and unless you can prove discrimination, they can take them away from you at their whim.

Originally posted by TheRedneck
reply to post by jude11

No, I'm asking for an explanation.

Under what circumstances is this a bad thing for an employee?

TheRedneck

I don't have any answers, but like yourself some questions.
Namely, would the time off be equal to the over time hours worked; or would there be 1-1/2 hours off for each hour worked. If it is to be straight time off, I see very little advantage for an employee to work much overtime.

reply to post by defcon5


You're right, defcon. It was always up to the employer. Before this they would can you with an excuse that it's something else. Now they can just tell you straight up if you go to your gramma's funeral, you will be fired and no legal action can be taken by the person terminated.

My point with all of this is..... TPTB are giving more power to the employer and taking it out of your hands as the employee.

I apologize. I know I was a bit gruff towards one person replying in particular. I'm not angry at anyone that has something to say here. I'm angry because our country is bought and paid for by the banksters and our government is corporate sponsored an ONLY interested in those that generate more wealth for TPTB to manufacture more and better killing machines. To me....... this is all working in their favor and I don't see a change occuring until we all stand up together, for ourselves and our fellow men and women, and take the power that they have away from them.

Originally posted by MilesTeg
You're right, defcon. It was always up to the employer. Before this they would can you with an excuse that it's something else. Now they can just tell you straight up if you go to your gramma's funeral, you will be fired and no legal action can be taken by the person terminated.

They could still straight out fire you for going to your grandmas funeral and tell you so. There is nothing you could legally do about it if they did. This law has no affect on that at all. No time off is guaranteed by any laws with the exception of FLMA.

Originally posted by MilesTeg
My point with all of this is..... TPTB are giving more power to the employer and taking it out of your hands as the employee.

They have always had it. Especially in “right to work” states.

Originally posted by MilesTeg
this is all working in their favor and I don't see a change occuring until we all stand up together, for ourselves and our fellow men and women, and take the power that they have away from them.

And the power will just again fall into another small groups hands. It seems to be the natural way of the world.

reply to post by MilesTeg


I am a littler lost here, for what I have been researching on this bill it doesn't look like a bad idea at all.

For many Americans, balancing the demands of family and the workplace can be difficult. State and local government employees have long been able to choose paid time off as compensation for working overtime hours, allowing these public-sector employees greater flexibility to meet family obligations. However, the federal government prohibits private-sector workers from enjoying this same benefit. An outdated federal law has become an impediment to employers who want to help employees manage work and family responsibilities.

THE SOLUTION:

To remove this obstacle in federal law, Representative Martha Roby (R-AL) introduced the Working Families Flexibility Act of 2013. The legislation would amend the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938 to allow employers to offer private-sector employees the choice of paid time off in lieu of cash wages for overtime hours worked. It is pro-family, pro-worker legislation that gives workers the flexibility to spend time with family, attend teacher conferences, care for aging parents, stay home with a newborn, or attend to other family needs that may arise.

Is this the same HR 1406 That we are talking about? because this sounds like a fix to the Fair labor Standards act of 1938 that was out dated and no fair within the employees in the private sector.



edworkforce.house.gov...

But then again the NATIONAL PARTNERSHIP FOR WOMEN AND FAMILIES' OPPOSITION TO HR 1406. explain the bill in a different way and shows that it actually is nothing but an unfair practice.

We, the undersigned organizations, urge you to oppose the so-called Working Families Flexibility Act of 2013 (H.R. 1406), a smoke-and-mirrors bill that offers a pay cut for workers without any guaranteed flexibility or time off to care for their families or themselves. As members of Congress on both sides of the aisle have acknowledged, people today are struggling to meet the demands of job and family, as well as to make ends meet. Americans urgently need lawmakers to take the next step on the road to a family friendly nation. But H.R. 1406 is not what the nation needs. It is, at best, an empty promise and it would cause considerably more harm than good.

The Working Families Flexibility Act offers a false choice between time and pay. The bill's supporters claim H.R. 1406 would give hourly workers more flexibility and time with their loved ones by allowing them to choose paid time off, rather than time-and-a-half wages, as compensation for working more than 40 hours in one week ("comp time"). But the irony is that workers will only get more time with their families after they've spent long hours away at work. And there is nothing in H.R. 1406 that guarantees that workers will be able to use the comp time they have earned when they need it.

www.highbeam.com...

The site is explained in this article it actually raised some concern for the workers.

I am still trying to find out who is to benefit from such a bill, obviously is not the workers as usual at the end no matter how nice they are sugar coating it.

reply to post by MilesTeg

From what I understand of this bill..... it completely abolishes overtime. No matter what.....

No it doesn't. Nowhere in this bill does it say regular overtime cannot be worked. It's talking about an alternative to overtime that is already being used.

Many companies who cannot pay overtime for financial reasons allow "comp time"... you can work over this week to be off next week when you need to be without loosing income. I have never heard of comp time being mandatory, and some companies don't even allow comp time. The ones I have known who do allow comp time reimburse the time on a one-to-one basis. In other words, if I work 48 hours instead of 40 this week, then I can work 32 hours next week instead of 40. I don't ever get paid money for comp time... I just get time off.

Under this bill, if I work 48 hours this week, then I only have to work 28 next week... I get time and a half for those overtime hours. Also, if I don't take off next week, I can eventually get paid in cash for those extra hours I worked. Both these are good things.

May I suggest you worry a little less about any "fine print" (that doesn't exist; there is no fine print in legislation) and a little more about the bill itself.

At least I finally got an answer to my question....

TheRedneck

reply to post by TheRedneck


Time and a half pay. That's what I'm talking about. No more time and a half pay for working more hours. It completely removes time and a half pay.

The problem with legislation in our country is who is behind the bill and whom is lobbying for the bill, those lobbying groups and their masters are the ones to benefit.

Now before I go into details on that lets see what another anti bill group have to say.

This very interesting, as we know when congress passes bills or acts it does affect more the people that supposedly trying to help because the wording of the bills brings loopholes

UFCW Statement on House Bill Attacking Hourly Workers,

“Anytime House Republicans talk about flexibility, working families should reach for their wallets. H.R. 1406 is just the latest scheme in the war on workers. It would have employees working unpaid overtime hours in exchange for accruing time off that can only be used when an employer sees fit. That is not flexibility—it is just unfair. This bill is an affront to the basic concept that a day’s work deserves a day’s wages paid in currency. It gives employers a clear incentive to push workers toward comp time instead of overtime pay. This creates a scenario where workers will find themselves in the awkward position of choosing between their employer’s wishes and their own need for a higher paycheck. If House Republicans are truly interested in improving the lives of hourly workers, they should start with raising the minimum wage, guaranteeing paid sick days, and passing the Part-Time Worker Bill of Rights.”

www.ufcw.org...

It looks like another reason why the bill will be unfair to certain groups of workers.

Now, Republicans were all for the bill and their argument was that the bill will give workers a chance to earn extra income

Then the Democrats opposing the bill argument is that the bill undermine the 40-hour workweek. Depending which site you are on this it may work for you while no for others, but is matter of opinion and interpretations.

Another group opposing the bill is the International Brotherhood of Teamsters (IBT), they argue that this bill will indeed erode the 40 hour work week.

www.popvox.com...

This is the biggest loophole on the bill that should concern any workers in the private sector, Corporations can pressure workers into taking compensations and no overtime, they gives the companies the chance to profit from those compensations when they can deny up to a year time off, the wage earner for the extra time worked will be on hold by the employee collecting interest that will not go into the hands of the workers, then what happen if the company goes bankcrupted before the time the wage is to go into the hands of the earners? they will lose all the money

With the state of the economy this days when it comes to small busisness you can pretty much see who is to benefit from such scenario of practice.