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Is this a Bible Code?

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posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 12:19 AM
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Just recently, I found a copy of 777 And Other Qabalistic Writings Of Alester Crowley and sat down for an afternoon of quiet reading. What I found inside was rather startling.

In the portion entitled TABLE OF CORRESPONDENCES on page 4 and continuing on, is a series of tables that designate colors to the letters of the Hebrew Alphabet. They are called the King, Queen, Emporer, and Empress tables. The color designations vary only slightly from table to table. There are in fact, many pages of correspondence tables, but the ones of Text-To-Color really caught my attention.

Now, I'm wondering something. Has anyone taken a copy of the Hebrew Torah and converted its text to colors? I'm trying very hard to find this!

Any help or speculation is welcome.


[edit on 5-11-2004 by Toelint]

[edit on 6-11-2004 by Toelint]




posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 12:22 AM
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Check out the excellent articles debunking this whole theory via:

Debunking Bible Codes



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 01:08 AM
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It's called a bible matrix, you can go here to download a free program to view the converted colored text

www.torahsoft.com...

This same site may offer a link to one that converts the letters to tones for a sort of musical version.

Ignore the pin-heads and make up your own mind on what you believe.

The Kabbalah can be considered old school, the bible codes are merely a high powered computer driven cousin. And it technically hasn't been cracked yet. Let's just say its the tip of the iceberg.

When you see the color conversion, it looks like almost perfect static, but you'll notice it has some interesting wave patterns in it.



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 01:55 AM
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Quick question here... Remember that movie PIE ,about the mathmatician cat that was looking for the perfect number. The Rabbi in that movie mentioned that words in the torah were all equal to a number and that Torah code was in number form. I understand that the movie was fiction but I have always thought that there was some truth to that. Yet all the bible code stuff I see is usually like word finder puzzles,

I am sure I can find a bunch of curse words in the tarah too, and vice versa find prophetic words in a word finder puzzle.

Side note----- say puzzle 10 times and it will become the very strange.

puzzle puzzle puzzle puzzle puzzle puzzle puzzle puzzle puzzle puzzle puzzle



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 02:04 AM
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Theorn again eh? I always wondered why masons were so quick to jump on a thread and try to debunk any speculation as to secret coding in hebrew texts. Perhaps a good explination of this can be found on the last page of this thread. More to masons/hebrew mythologies than meets the eye... Check out my last post on this thread, I will be examining this in more detail on that thread.
www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 06:04 AM
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Originally posted by twitchy
Theorn again eh? I always wondered why masons were so quick to jump on a thread and try to debunk any speculation as to secret coding in hebrew texts. Perhaps a good explination of this can be found on the last page of this thread. More to masons/hebrew mythologies than meets the eye... Check out my last post on this thread, I will be examining this in more detail on that thread.
www.abovetopsecret.com...


Oh, you mean the thread no one but you cares about? The one that's about to die and fall right off the front page? Oh yes . . . THAT one.

What have you done in "real life" about the situation, Twitchy? Have you written to your local MP or Congrssman? Have you started a campaign yet? Or are you just interested in self-promotion on ATS, where you don't have to actually DO anything?

All you've been doing is complaining on these boards.

Start by writing a letter to your local paper - they're always looking for interesting stories that hit home and matter to people. Write them a letter and ask them to do an expose on the "Kosher tax." If it is THAT bad you'll be up and rolling with it in no time. Call your local gov't representative and inform him that we're all being shafted (he/she *might* be Jewish, but I'm sure he/she will understand.) Maybe that can be their next campaign platform - to rid your state/province of the "Kosher tax."

In fact, with enough publicity, YOU could run for public office (even if just local) on this very platform.

I'll be interested in seeing how well you do.

After all, like it says in your sig . . . it only takes a few people to change the world, etc.



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 06:37 AM
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Originally posted by twitchy
Paramount, Disney, ICM and CAA New York, Times, Wall Street Journal Washington Post, Boston Globe, Washington Post Barron's, Dow Jones Village Voice Time, U.S. News & World Report Atlantic Monthly, NY Daily News, AOL-Time Warner, CNN News Group (before you say no that's Ted Turner, look up 'Walter Isaacson'), Time Warner's publishing division, Sports Illustrated, People, Fortune, Walt Disney Company, Touchstone, Buena Vista, Hollywood Pictures, Caravan Pictures, Miramax Films, Capital Cities/ABC, Inc., ESPN, Lifetime Television, A & E Television Networks, ABC Radio Network, Viacom, Inc., Paramount Pictures, CBS's Country Music Television Nashville Network Simon & Schuster, Scribner, The
Free Press, Pocket Books. Showtime, MTV, Nickelodeon, Fox Television Network, 20th Century Fox Films, and Fox 2000, New York Post and TV Guide are all owned or controlled by one religous organization.

Yeah, I could write a letter, or call a congressman, but as you well know, they'd be real interested in biting the hand that feeds their jah-bul-chit. I thank god for the internet, ltd, the masonic stranglehold on information is comming to an end. To take light for yourself is to leave another in darkness, and thankfully that time is ending. All the accacia gnawing and nods and winks in the world can't stop those who seek answers from finding them. There are no secrets, only the malacious practice of secrecy.



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 06:59 AM
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There are no secrets, only the malacious practice of secrecy.


It's called "privacy." It is protected by the Constitution.

If it is your stated purpose to weaken or obliterate the Masonic "stranglehold" then more power to you. Yes, you will do your part, and you should be proud of that. Not sure how you can mobilize others to do the same and make a real, physical difference, but one person is indeed a "start."

You won't be the first, Twitchy, nor the last. You're dealing with centuries of tradition. We are all deeply entrenched in the beauty and honour that is Masonry - some of us have just started our studies, and others have been doing it for a lifetime.

Look . . . . . it is clear that you wish Masons ill. That's fine. If you perceive a real threat to your freedom and the freedom of those around you, then it is probably your duty to take action. Just don't end up with egg on your face. If you applied your persistence to some other cause that isn't so nebulous and factually ill-supported, you'd go much farther.

Still, we can proceed like we always have.

For myself, I've made friends for a lifetime, on top of those I already have the incredible fortune of knowing. I've met talented, successful people - role models, people for whom personal conduct matters in relationships. I have the opportunity to help . . . and ask for help. I can now be more involved in my community. I can ensure that our older members are given whatever kind of assistance they need, by us younger members. If all of this takes me even further, then . . . wonderful. We do for each other . . . as friends should.





[edit on 5-11-2004 by LTD602]



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 07:44 AM
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I have no intention of becomming the next Captain Morgan, but when toelint asked a simple question, theorn leads him away from the truth. Yes, toelint, there are secrets cleverly concealed in many ancient texts. Ltd, you know that as well as I do. If he finds the keys, then let him, but don't lie to him or make him to feel a fool for seeking knowlege of these things. Theorn has no right to mislead him, and that is exactly why freemasonry has the negative connotations it carries.
Freemasonry was a respectable institution, but it has been subverted and blue lodge, sadly, has become a tool for those with less than honorable intentions. It isn't about light any more, its about power and subjugation. I recently watched a criminal give the distress sign in court, and was absolved of his crimes, while another involved was sentenced, and sadly, that has become a trend.
Wizardry is one thing, Illuminated immunity is another. I think perhaps John Lennon said it best, "We all shine on."



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 08:04 AM
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Twitchy:

Masons are as subject the laws of the land as anyone else.

Criminal activity is not tolerated.

BUT: is there favouritism of some kind, perhaps in employment, etc?

Yes. It is curious, but entirely logical. Masons know Masons. When I meet a Mason, I can be more sure of his character than I can be of someone else's. Not everyone can become a Mason. The safeguards are reasonably effective. I can see the difference between the way they behave, and the way *some* people who are not Masons behave. One of the cornerstones of Masonry is personal conduct. A Mason would rather hire a Mason. It isn't deliberately exclusionary, but rather, value-based.

Although I am ready to help anyone in need, I will step up and help good friends FIRST.

Perhaps a controversial attitude in the eyes of some, but I stand by it completely.

Not much more I can say about this particular topic.

As an aside, if toelint has a prblem, he should certainly voice it. If he feels mistreated then I, or another Mason will CERTAINLY make amends without any hesitation.

[edit on 5-11-2004 by LTD602]



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 11:01 AM
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Here, Here, LTD602,...

You hit the nail on the head. The "favoritism" is nothing more than friends helping friends. If you owned a company and had a job opening a friend could fill nicely, wouldn't you hire that person before a stanger??? Masonry is about extending your friendships to include others who share your values.

The so-called favoritism that Masons show one another is the same thing... I know when I see another man with a Masonic emblem on his car, that he shares the values of being a good and upstanding person in society with me,... that he values God, and wants to leave the world a better place for him being in it... So, if he's trying to merge into traffic, I'll give him the benefit of the the doubt.



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 11:04 AM
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With the right key you can find 'secret messages' in ANY book of a decent size. Wake up and smell the roses.



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 11:32 AM
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Yes, I've heard about "Lincoln Assassinated" being found in Moby Dick and other such finds. It seems to me that scrambling messages and making the surrounding text fit is actually pretty darn simple.

That messages are found should be an indication that somebody is playing a very elaborate mind game. Who knows...maybe Herman Melville was a Southern sympathizer passing messages.

Ya just never know the whole truth..



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 11:33 AM
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Originally posted by twitchy
I have no intention of becomming the next Captain Morgan, but when toelint asked a simple question, theorn leads him away from the truth. Yes, toelint, there are secrets cleverly concealed in many ancient texts.


Oh, please... give it a rest and use your brain. I do not believe in this whole nonsensical search for hidden meaning. that is MY opinion, and I am as entitled to it as you are to your... opinion. Mine is slightly more educated, and not based on wishful thinking, but hey, everyone is entitled to their own opinions, that is what this forum is about.

Now, based on educated studies, and NOT on wishful thinking, or the brains ability to find patterns where none exist (ever stared at static on the tv and seen patterns?) I posted my opinion. Folks, an experiment was performed, following the smae standards set forth in the "Bible Codes" theory, and found warning messages in Moby Dick!

So, you can believe it, or not. I offered an alternative to the original suggesting, with no other comment. Twitchy, you really need to get a handle on your emotions, there, old son. Besides, I thought you had me on Ignore... how is it that you are seeing my commentaries?


Ltd, you know that as well as I do. If he finds the keys, then let him, but don't lie to him or make him to feel a fool for seeking knowlege of these things. Theorn has no right to mislead him, and that is exactly why freemasonry has the negative connotations it carries.


No one has lied to anyone. What I have offered is debunking of the myth of Bible Codes and such. If you WANT to see them, hey, that's fine... no harm in reading the astrology page in the papers, either... this has NOTHING to do with Masonry, though I find it extremely revealing that you would automatically think it does. Why is that, do you suppose, given that Masonry has no position on Kaballah, astrology, numerology, eschatology or any religion that you would assume that MY PERSONAL position on the thoroughly debunked "secret messages" would speak for any mason but ME?


Freemasonry was a respectable institution, but it has been subverted and blue lodge, sadly, has become a tool for those with less than honorable intentions.


IN YOUR OPINION. Interesting, that not even being a mason, you feel somehow qualified to offer an opinion on what you are totally ignorant on? Why is that? I understand the whole secret message cult and WHY folks think it works, as well as the underlying psychology that creates the NEED to find esoteric meanings where there aren't any...


It isn't about light any more, its about power and subjugation. I recently watched a criminal give the distress sign in court, and was absolved of his crimes, while another involved was sentenced, and sadly, that has become a trend.


Really? Where, when? Specifics here, ESPECIALLY when you are making accusations.


Wizardry is one thing, Illuminated immunity is another. I think perhaps John Lennon said it best, "We all shine on."


Masonry is about the personal search for more light. Your position that one person finding light somehow takes it away from someone else is a little... warped. Light is not a limited quantity, any more than the economy. It is not a zero sum game. I received light and search for more light. LTD has received light, and is searching for more, and we are both finding it.

You are turning off the light switches and demanding that WE stop looking for light and truth, while shoveling darkness at the world and bleating that we are somehow holding you back from light because we won't share our secrets... use your HEAD for a change. Masonry is about the search and struggle to be a better man... it presumes that you are a good man to start with, which I guess is what is so troubling for so many folks these days, amid the ever growing sea of moral relativism, masonry stands as a beacon, a LIGHTHOUSE of morality, a rock, standing firm against the encroachment of immoral and libertine society.

I guess that could be seen as a little challenging to folks that just want to hate and spit at anyone that holds to a higher standard of behavior and life.



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 11:43 AM
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Well, you do have a point, toelint. One tries to be reasonably sure in most circumstances, but you can't be sure 100% of the time.

The other day one of my profs was telling me about a Canadian spy working for the Russians back in the 60's. Hehe, who would suspect a Canadian of anything? Of all people . . .
But, he was indeed a spy, and lived a very normal family life, had what by all outward appearances seemed a very normal social life. Didn't get away with it for too long, though.

These, however, are rare cases. Eventually he was caught and charged with some form of High Treason, as far as I can remember.



posted on Nov, 5 2004 @ 11:59 AM
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Originally posted by Toelint
Yes, I've heard about "Lincoln Assassinated" being found in Moby Dick and other such finds. It seems to me that scrambling messages and making the surrounding text fit is actually pretty darn simple.

That messages are found should be an indication that somebody is playing a very elaborate mind game. Who knows...maybe Herman Melville was a Southern sympathizer passing messages.

Ya just never know the whole truth..


Actually, if you read how the experiment was conducted, they followed the SAME rules designed and laid out in Bible Codes and found that line in the text of Moby Dick.

Look, the bible was written by men, not the very hand of god. The human mind as an organic computer that is very good at finding patterns... ask ANYONE that does the daily crossword or accrostic puzzles, or cipher puzzles, or... you follow me? So, within chaos, the mind tries to impose order, its simply natural, a result of evolutionary pressures to see foes and enemies and treats in the evironment, as well as to find prey in the environment.

So, it is not surprising that folks can create artificail rules to find in text "clues' or messages... they WANT to find them, and the mind insists of "seeing" them. Its really ok, and harmless... sort of like reading the astrology in the daily paper, and, in MY OPINION, about as useful.

But, again, its a harmless hobby. But the same type of messages can be found in ANY tome, which is what the Mby Dick experiment proved.

Facts... civilization is built ON them. Wishful thinking should be the vacation of the rational mind, NOT the living space.



posted on Nov, 6 2004 @ 01:09 PM
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Originally posted by CAPT PROTON
It's called a bible matrix, you can go here to download a free program to view the converted colored text

www.torahsoft.com...



I went to the site and was impressed! Still, I wonder why the Aleister Crowley book has four color scales instead of just one. Then it occured to me..aren't most maps four colors? I'm going to make a proposal:

How about if someone combines the original skip code with the Text-to-Color application? Not so much to find "hidden colored bit" strings, but rather to get the correct format. I found the following on a website discussing Micheal Drosnin's book, The Bible Code:


Drosnin soon discovered that the Bible code was a computer program containing Hebrew letters in five different colours in a grid much like a crossword puzzle. Rips had removed the spaces between the Hebrew words creating a string of 304,805 letters in 64 rows of 4772 letters. According to legend, it was the way Moses received the Bible from God - "contiguous, without break of words".


From there, I suppose you can begin skipping and stringing together bits until something comes up that looks interesting. But the whole excercise will have to be done four times...once for each color scale.

Any computer programmers in the house?


P.S.

4,772 X 64 = 305,408....NOT 304,805 as the quote says...I HAD to throw that in!


[edit on 6-11-2004 by Toelint]



posted on Nov, 6 2004 @ 05:12 PM
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Originally posted by farhyde
Quick question here... Remember that movie PIE ,about the mathmatician cat that was looking for the perfect number. The Rabbi in that movie mentioned that words in the torah were all equal to a number and that Torah code was in number form. I understand that the movie was fiction but I have always thought that there was some truth to that. Yet all the bible code stuff I see is usually like word finder puzzles,



I remember that scene very well. What the Rabbi in the movie is describing is called Gematra.

This is the Rabbi's example: Take the numberical value of the Hebrew word for "Man". Then add the numerical value for the Hebrew word for "Woman". The combined values equal the numerical value for the Hebrew word for "Marriage".

Now, add the Hebrew word for "Child". The value now equals the numerical value for the Hebrew word for "Family".

Pretty cool, eh?


[edit on 6-11-2004 by Toelint]



posted on Nov, 6 2004 @ 05:59 PM
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I remember that scene very well. What the Rabbi was describing was something called Gematra.

A perfect example is this: Take the numberical value of the Hebrew word for Man. Then add the numerical value for the Hebrew word for Woman. The combined values equal the numerical value for the Hebrew word for Marriage.

Now, add the Hebrew word for Child. The value now equals the numerical value for the Hebrew word for Family.

Pretty cool, eh?


Yeah it really is. Now that you mentioned that, I think the Rabbi was trying to find the numeric value of God's name. Crazy concept....

On-topic, you can find code in almost any text I would imagine- it's just a matter of interpretation and dash of maddness.


Poo, you ho's r no money in my purse.

--Prophetic translation:
Bush leaves hunt for Bin Laden to Afghan warlords then launches attack to disarm Iraq.

I will admit though, the idea of codes in the bible is very interesting to me. If we look at the hebrew text and consider it's numerical value's and such, there HAS to be an underlying message somewhere in it. At least in the old testiment that is. What was the original language the bible was written in? Aremaic? Did it have a numerical value like todays hebrew? I may be way off base with this number thing, if so, I am sorry.



posted on Nov, 6 2004 @ 06:05 PM
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Well, I'm not sure, but I think the Old Testament was written in Hebrew, while the New Testament was written in Aramaic, Hebrew, Latin, and Greek.I think that's right.


[edit on 7-11-2004 by Toelint]



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