UN 'No-Fly-Zone' only solution left to end Syrian sufferings?

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posted on May, 9 2013 @ 11:58 AM
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2 years of diplomatic efforts had failed while 70,000 of our fellow humans in Syria gets slaughtered by the beast Assad. When talking becomes impossible, violence becomes inevitable. The continued INDISCRIMINATE pounding of innocent civilians from the air by the beast Assad cannot be allowed any further.

HumanSlayer Assad cares NOTHING for those whom he pound to dust, for they are sunnis. 70% of Syria are Sunnis, so shall mankind allow that animal to claim that they are ALL terrorists and EXTERMINATE the entire population of Sunnis?

Today, Russia and USA had finally agreed to work together to find a solution to the crisis. If they think there is still a diplomatic chance, then by means find it, BUT it must be pragmatic, with datelines and redlines, so that no procastination or intentional delays are created while the syrian citizens get slaughtered with each passing day.

The world is concerned that radical elements exists within the Free Syrian Army, and thus are not willing to armed them with weapons. But this reason is unfounded and without any substance in reality.


1. In this day and age of 3 d printing and massive trade movements, can such tech be stopped? No. The solution is not banning tech, but lays with EDUCATING our young with moral and ethical guidelines, and defined consequences for their irresponsibilities if the choose their free will unwisely.

A stinger missile can bring down a civilian plane. That is what most govts fear if such weapons fall onto radical militants hand. In this day and age of 3 d printing and massive trade movements, can such tech be stopped? No.

But truth is - AA missiles had LONG been in the hands of those radical militants, and yet we DO NOT see civilian planes falling off the skies? Why?

Simply because, for all the insanity that radical militants possessed, they only do such stuff to prove a crucial point. Would bringing down the airliner enhance their power and support from humanity that is necessary for their cause? No, it wouldn't. 911 caused the reverse to happen, as Islam started to reflect seriously on its teachings, and over time, had denounced those attacks and attackers. Militants no longer have the kind of support it needs.


2. Most who joined the radical militants in Syria are mainly untrained and foreigners who speak in foreign tongues, incapable of being absorbed into the FSA, nor does FSA have the time to train them.

Many of these young men in Syria are not seeking for death to jews, or death to USA, or death to anyone EXCEPT death to the beast Assad and his Regime. Their ideologies ranged from simple honest faith to insane extremities by the few. The more simple ones may give up fighting once the war is won and return home in peace.

Most of the radicalisation is done by the older and bitter clerics whom spread their village ignorances and one track education to those young men. Not all of the young men are stupid, and can be taught the true Islamic religion over time.


3. Even if they refuse to change their minds, and somehow manage to overpower the majority of FSA troops and become rulers of Syria, let us all be realistic - their 7th century teachings will not improve Syrians economically AT ALL. With education banned, women kept at home, criminals amputed, etc - they will need HUGE amounts of social welfare that even oil wells cannot afford.

And Arabs are not the kind of people that will lay down quietly and be slaughtered if they complain, as russians and iranians do.

The VERY REASON why the Syrian crisis started was over ECONOMIC woes. There was no or little jobs. The regime were buffoons and knew nuts about economic management, more so when Shias were favoured over the majority sunnis.

If the radical militants come into power, with their idealogy, they will NOT be able to provide for the syrians and will run into trouble like the Muslim Brotherhood ruled Egypt, or be booted out if not sooner, this time by a well armed FSA.


In conclusion, arming the rebels will most certainly help end further suffering in Syria, and if a UN No-Fly-Zone is imposed along with conditions that ALL innocenet civilians - shias and sunnis, be protected and NEVER intentionally targetted as what HumanSlayer Assad had done, this tragedy will end even quicker.

OR, we can turn away, harden our hearts, use other irrelevant situations such as the Benghazi attacks by terrorists, Iraq war,etc, to justify our lack of conscience and indifference to the sufferings of others, say hell to civilisation and lets all from the family building block, go back to jungle laws where the strong survives and the weak must die. .......




posted on May, 9 2013 @ 12:10 PM
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reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 

Thats quite a wall of text you have there.

But it would seem that there are plenty of actual citizens who support the Syrian government as opposed to the US backed al-CIAeda "rebels".

www.abovetopsecret.com...





edit on 9-5-2013 by gladtobehere because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 12:13 PM
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Too bad the JCS have come out and said a no-fly zone over Syria would be extremely difficult to pull off. The defenses over Syria are the most advanced the US would be up against in a long time, so it would hurt, and it would be expensive as well as taking a long time to destroy them (which would have to happen to establish a no-fly zone).



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 12:13 PM
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can i ask where you pull you information from? Also agian can i have some of what your taking?



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 12:21 PM
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reply to post by gladtobehere
 


If mankind is to still foolishly believe that there can be a peaceful solution, then perhaps US, Russia and World convince both paties and organized a free and fair REFERENDUM vote on who should rule Syria - Assad or a Transitional democratic govt to form a constitution that guarantees protection and minority rights to all faiths.

BUT...in all honesty...will the 70% majority of Syrians whom are Sunnis even allow the existance of HumanSlayer Assad to preside in any talks at all, after 70,000 syrians dead without ANY accountability?

The slaughters must end....



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 12:26 PM
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reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 

I think that most would agree with you.

If the Western governments would put an end to their invasion of Syria via their Al-CIAeda backed rebels, the fighting would stop almost immediately.



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 12:27 PM
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reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 


see this is were the issue lies half calls assad human slayer and that hes such an evil person. The other half see the terrorists that are "rebelling" agienst him. Then throw into the picture the Isrealies want to destroy anyone they think is with hezbollah and call it defense and theres syria in a nut shell



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 12:27 PM
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reply to post by Zaphod58
 


Agreed on that for defenses. If Syria doesn't want to allow that, we'd have a mighty problem and lose a lot of aircraft, IMO. Iran *MAY* have the S-300. The Syrians absolutely do have it as open fact. Comparable to the Patriot and actually...better in some respects (worse in others...it's Russian made after all ... Made to be operated by anyone, with any skill level, almost). it would do some real damage I think.

As I recall the spec sheets, the most devestating thing about them is that they can go from driving highway speeds to parked, erected to launch and clearing missiles into the air in just over 5 minutes. I gathered that was what made them especially lethal and worrisome. Most GOOD A.A. systems are somewhat fixed or take time to calibrate and set up for firing. Err... I think this is a battle we need to stay out of.



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 12:47 PM
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The joint chiefs of staff have already said they don’t think a no fly zone would work. I am currently working on a thread about American Foreign policy in Syria to try to dispel some of the myths.

Anyway apparently only something like 10% of casualties in the Syrian Civil war have been caused by Assads air force so the effectiveness of a no fly zone is highly questionable aswell as that Syrain defenses are much better than say Libyas. In addition to this Russia may also block any move to enforce any no fly zone as this would be at odds with their current foreign policy towards Syria. There are a number of reports that the Syrian rebels already have MANPADS, how effective these have been I don’t know but I have read a few press reports of Syrian Air Force aircraft having been shot down (link.)

this is what the Joint Chiefs of staff have to say about a no fly zone


WASHINGTON -- The chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Gen. Martin Dempsey, said Tuesday he is "cautious" about U.S. military intervention in Syria because of doubts that it would halt the violence or achieve political reconciliation.

He cast doubt on the effectiveness of establishing a no-fly zone, saying that only about 10 percent of the casualties suffered by anti-regime forces are caused by air strikes. He said 90 percent are caused by small arms and artillery, which would be unaffected by a no-fly zone.


link

I really don’t think there are any good options left in Syria either Assad wins, the West invades or the country ends up in the hands of a bunk of Al-Qa’ida types because the FSA can’t keep them in check and end up with chemical weapons.
edit on 9-5-2013 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 12:55 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


Those SAM sites and mobiles are a genuine concern, but are not invincible.

They are already long known - their locations, paths and even the caves they are hiding in .

Before any no fly zone is imposed, ground and air troops can take them out.

I also do share the concerns of not getting involve. But we share this world, and those in Syria are not starving africans whom had been given aid by us through our taxes. Those in Syria, even in this moment, some may not live past the next minute......

We can close our eyes.....but how long do we want to remain blind?........Without our help, the tragedy will never end....



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 01:00 PM
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reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 


Oh I see, so syria can go down the same hole as libya did, that went a bit askew dontchathink???
I have a better idea, how about the US and israeli terrorists stay out of foreign affairs and stop financing terrorists to go to a foreign land??
Win / win!!!
But I guess that won't work for you as it seems you are the UN cheerleader.
Bought the t-shirt and drank the Kool-Aid too...



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 01:08 PM
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Russia plans to sell advanced S-300 missile batteries to Syria • Leak comes one day after Kerry leaves Moscow • Anti-aircraft missiles would make no-fly zone impossible.

www.israelhayom.com...



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 01:09 PM
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reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 


Dude that is really big over simplification

You are presuming they know the exact location of every anti-air asset that Assad forces have, something that is probably not true. Assad is probably moving them about daily and has a stash hiding out somewhere for a rainy day. In addition to this you have to remember that there is a Syrian air force and it’s not exactly going to be a walk in the part to take out the 100’s of migs they have kicking about.

Then you say just send in ground forces to do the take out all this anti-air, even assuming you know where it all is to do that you would probably need to deploy a rather large ground assault.

And above all of that you would need to get a UN resolution passed to legally enforce any no fly zone something that could be very difficult to get.



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 01:25 PM
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reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 


So what you are saying is that you know better than the Joint Chiefs of Staff?

Source



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 02:48 PM
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reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin
 


Martin Dempsey should RESIGN from the JCS if he has no confidence of air power, which is the most effectiive and only PURE COMMON KNOWLEDGE even to village idiots except total fools.

The only reason why the effectives of air power is minimal in Syria by the HumanSlayer Assad is simply because he already have a wide array of weapons against the lightly armed rebel forces. His tanks and animals in human clothing is doing a great job in slaughtering men, women and babies.

Should the UN No-Fly-Zone be enforced, it means an assualt upon those same sites immediately. 2 years are not a short period of time to determine where those Syrian air defences are, more so with the kind of tech and photo intelligence the West have.

No war is a walk in the park, and NO ONE should be deluded to think it is. It takes a huge lot of human effort and MUST be aprreciated in the end, just as US involvement in WW2 should be.

The purpose of intervening into Syria is not for the purpose of conquest, as the apostate Khameni, his lapdogs even here, hizbollahs will attempt to make it out to be. It will only be to end the genocidal horror in Syria today - a responsible humanitarian effort, whereby a hundred innocent men, women and babies are slaughtered by the Regime and its beasts on an average daily basis.

Russia can sell what it wants. Who truly trust Russia? At the end of the day, we all share our world.

Russia will pay the price for its belligerences and support for the human killer Assad whom had slaughtered thousands, and so too will the persian apostate khamenei along with his terrorist dogs hizbollahs, but may the other innocent shia muslims be spared. They seek not for conquest or domination, only to live in peace, to achieve common goals of all mankind just like the rest of us all. Khamenei, his brainwashed and his dogs can be stewed for all they want.

When the impetous Caliph Bakr seized power and invaded Persia even before prophet Muhammad's body turned cold, the persian masses readily converted to Islam as through Zorastrianism, they already long were civilised and understood the concept of One God. The persian masses were not like the barbaric arabs that Allah had to send a Divine Messenger to teach them civilisation.

But as for the persian nobles and gentry, they never forgotten their glory days, divine rights of monarchial ruler and passed it on to their future generations, and thus the conflict between persia and Arabia had never ended even today, as the pysche remained. It proved that prophet Muhammad had been wise and right to seek change in persia through hearts and minds and not might as the foolish impetous Caliph Bakr had done, the same Abu Bakr who once almost led a mutiny against the prophet over the disarmment beseeched by the prophet to enter the holy city Mecca to win over the land.
edit on 9-5-2013 by SeekerofTruth101 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 02:54 PM
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Originally posted by SeekerofTruth101

OR, we can turn away, harden our hearts, use other irrelevant situations such as the Benghazi attacks by terrorists, Iraq war,etc, to justify our lack of conscience and indifference to the sufferings of others, say hell to civilisation and lets all from the family building block, go back to jungle laws where the strong survives and the weak must die. .......



Fine with me.

It's not my war, though my country is chomping at the bit to get involved.



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 02:57 PM
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reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 


A no fly zone alone will not work, I think the term “human slayer” is very appropriate for Assad but I totally disagree with the idea that a no-fly zone in the answer. The JCS have more information about the military contingencies for Syria than either you or I do so when they say a no-fly zone wouldn’t work I am inclined to believe them.

The truth is however for Syria there are no good options left, Obama’s dithering foreign policy has failed entirely either there has to be some intervention, Assad kills everyone or the rebels all join up and kill Assad, only problem with the third option is that would likely now lead to a terrorist takeover of Syria something America is trying to avoid. It’s a no win situation right now, all they have are bad options.

I suppose there is a change that just so they can be seen to be doing something the might try to enforce some kind of no-fly zone, I know last year there was talk of creating a safe zone inside Syria to protect civilians that may still be an option.

The idea of a no-fly zone though, I don’t think a total no fly zone over Syria is going to work, I agree with you that something needs to be done to stop the killing, on both sides, but I don’t think a few F-22’s and a bunch of D’boys on the ground is the solution.



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 03:03 PM
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reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin
 


Well, there might be a fourth option, though you're right in saying it may be too late for it, too. We could withdraw 100% of our support for the FSA terrorists and strongly pressure other nations to do the same. The FSA have all but begged and screamed for help, lest they be defeated and destroyed, at least twice in a public way. That's since this all began in the start with the "Peaceful Protests".

I do wonder though....is it really too late for even that? Perhaps. They may have grown too strong now. If so, I don't know what a good answer is. Assad won't likely go down without a hard hard fight ..since Gadaffi and others have shown, running is worthless. Surrender doesn't work. Essentially, it's stand and fight or die. The world, today, leaves someone in his position no third way out ..which is short sighted and foolish to an extreme, IMO.



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 03:07 PM
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reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 


Air power is extremely effective, but with only 10% of casualties coming from Syrian air power, are you really willing to risk B-2s and F-22s, along with all the support crews to go against the Syrian air defenses, to stop one or two air attacks every few weeks? Where does it stop? Classify missiles as aircraft next, so we can take out their launchers? Why not troops? After all they fire bullets that fly.

Something needs to be done, but not at the risk of American pilots, for almost zero effect.



posted on May, 9 2013 @ 03:14 PM
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reply to post by Wrabbit2000
 


I take great issue with the idea that the FSA are terrorists, I would say they are “freedom fighters” or "nationalist terrorists" in the eyes of assad, they are seeking out political freedom from a despot leader.

That said, Syria is a mess, there are a number of groups that are terrorist groups, such as Al-Nusra but they do not actually form part of the FSA they are out with its command. It’s very difficult, in the eyes of the Syrian government the FSA are terrorists, they have committed acts that we could call “terrorist acts”. But if they are terrorists they are “nationalist terrorists” they are like Assad’s IRA if you like. The problem facing the west is that we want those “terrorists” to win, not the other guys the “Islamic terrorists” of the Al-Nusra Front and other such groups who will turn Syria into the next Afghanistan. That is what American foreign policy has been turned towards offsetting an anti-western Islamic takeover of Syria and creating an even bigger crisis in the region.

What you are saying though is that we withdraw all support to the rebel groups particularly the FSA (the nationalist terrorists so to speak) and hope that Assad wins and Syria turns back into what it was before. I would agree that it is to late for that, we are all to committed it would be political suicide and it probably wouldn’t work, Turkey and Saudi-Arabia are still going to be providing guns to the rebels, most of which seem to be going to the terrorists.

It rules that option pretty much out as well.

Like I say no good options left, just bad ones, the trick for the international community and in particularly America is picking out the best of a bad bunch.

I don’t think a no fly zone is the solution.

I think they should do what they were talking about doing before, setting up a safe zone inside Syria for civilians that is defended by NATO forces.
edit on 9-5-2013 by OtherSideOfTheCoin because: (no reason given)





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