Do Words Hurt?

galadofwarthethird
reply to post by vethumanbeing

Vethumanbeing
Wow we are really off topic here, not at the end of thread anymore apparently?! Alright, include the universe as well; not just this planet that vibrates in the 3rd dimension; but thats the point, its this planet only that does this (its not frozen gas or hot gas observable). Its a living thing with lifeforms existing and vibrating to it; otherwise we would not be here. We dont have the capacity to externalize to the higher realms; used to to but that ability was taken from us (nuetralized confinement from our God sourse).

Galadof3
A bit off topic I suppose. But then again the topic is words, and we are using words. So! And I suppose I did not explain that all that well. But yes this place may be a focus point, but its like that one level in videogames were once you reach the end of the level, you somehow end back were you started at. The planet is kind of just here and in all vibrations, were the ones who trap ourselfs and project this whole thing outward. And yes it can be done, its not easy a real real pain in the ass but you can externalize to higher realms. Its kind of the modus operandi, most have only two directions to go. Up or Down. Higher or Lower.

Id never thought of video games being an OBVIOUS metaphor for enlightenment, youre climbing (Jacobs ladder over and over again having missed one of the rungs) and fall back to 2nd tier again having to start all over again. Up is the only path higher (nice observation as it fits with the younger generations not SEEING IT AT ALL).

Vethumanbeing
It has been making clear those attempts lately. I think the earth is rising in fequency (YES) and those that cannot rise with it are dieing. The persons born of late, the last 30 years are more attune to this process than say my parents. I do believe there have been many civilizations living upon earth much more advanced that our worldwide cultures existing now. They destroyed themselves/

VHB
I couldnt agree with you more; we are captive audiences of our own dilemas shown to us (the hilarious part is we PAY MONEY to watch our shennanigans demonstrated to us) as an ENTERTAINMENT source FOR US humans!

Galadof3
Ya I know! Once you start to step outside of it. First it becomes a bit surreal, then a myriad of things from ridiculous funny to just sad and depressing and sick. Yes! You all pay money to watch shenanigans that you will do anyways. So in a way its like paying twice and constantly for them.

Its all of that combined times 5. Its diabolical and infectious in its combined hilarity/confusion of a strange sadness (drawn to it like moths to a flame) (plus the popcorn buckets with extra butter are too expensive, throw in a free 24 OZ coke at least) to watch ourselves being foolish.

VeteranHumanCompass
The dollar part of it is what seems to me to be so incidious, no wonder the eastern religions view the west as tainted (unpure) gratification seekers; although if I were being given 'oil money' doles to the point I didnt have work for a living I could build that 10 story high soapbox (hypocrites). Its as you say the pushme pullyou llama of Dr. Doolittle fame, there must be friction to cause change (sometimes a little destruction helps the process along even more so).

Galadof3
What can I say this world is full of love. Its all love, and many people love money, some love thrills, others love being worshiped, and yet other love being feared and impressing there fellow men with there possessions and impressing there will upon them. Some love life, and other love death, and everything between. Its all love you see. Its all just what there putting out, there main vibrations, it expands and moves throughout this world and eventually cements itself. Its also a majority connection and concession. Insanity and unsanity, it is and can be very much so prevalent. The world to a great degree is what you all make of it.

Love is an energyform, not the "hallmark greeting card type" emotion thing. Its turned into a brand new form of greed, acquisition, adrenalin seeking bargain hunters, as you say a worship of something intangible but "within reach" or 'by itself willed' that enough persons thinking this "pattern" in tandum will actually manifest it/into what? I wonder/contemplate the conglomeration of thoughtforms that can potencially cement itself into something BIG/tangible Solid that I cant control or manage and have to eventually destroy (who am I to be so concerned). Architypes must be severed from the human psyche, they are false constructs and holding us in a lower form of fear/confinement. Get thee to thy prison planet, your rubber shower shoes (squires) await in attendance of/for you.

LesMisanthrope
reply to post by BDBinc

 

I agree with you and the person you quoted. The mind, the senses and the body are the same thing. But no words are in the body or in the senses. If there was, we'd be able to find it.

And you continue to think speech exists outside the mind and yet you cannot tell me how and by whom these "outside the mind words" are perceived or where they exist if you have no perception of them.
You mistake has been you separate words from meanings and the mind ( jibberish) and then make claims about things that do not exist outside the mind.

Yes, humans speak words and think about words. I have never argued the opposite.

Just like you could never find me a mind, you could never find me a word that exists in it. You are simply confessing your imagination, being unable to point to anything that verifies the presence of words in minds.

Perception is an ability, not a place where things exist. Things do not exist in abilities; things perform abilities.

To perceive is an action, not a place where things exist.

You say you agree AND then disagree with Hermes, with his wisdom.

When words are perceived with your mind is that not “finding them”.
You now say you cannot perceive (sense) words, how or why then are you writing about them with such exuberance ?
Do thoughts not verify the presence of words arising in the mind?
Or did you just just say you are mindless ( or empty of thought)?

To quote Itsnowagain who answered you (as always)very succinctly
“ The perceiver and the perceived are not separate - they arise as one.”

I would say you are alive and maybe you would say “no because I can’t find it” . Then argue with me that life does not exist because you “can’t find it”.
To see you need eyes that are open.

reply to post by BDBinc

You say you agree AND then disagree with Hermes, with his wisdom.

Yes. I agree the mind and the body are one in the same.

When words are perceived with your mind is that not “finding them”.
You now say you cannot perceive (sense) words, how or why then are you writing about them with such exuberance ?

I never said we do not perceive words, only that they do not enter a place called "mind" or "perception". You must understand, to think and to perceive are actions, not places where things exist. Actions require an agent to perform the action. Actions themselves are not agents.

Do thoughts not verify the presence of words arising in the mind?
Or did you just just say you are mindless ( or empty of thought)?

To quote Itsnowagain who answered you (as always)very succinctly
“ The perceiver and the perceived are not separate - they arise as one.”

I would say you are alive and maybe you would say “no because I can’t find it” . Then argue with me that life does not exist because you “can’t find it”.
To see you need eyes that are open.

Thinking verifies nothing except that we think.

To say the perceiver and the perceived are not separate is the same as saying it takes a perceiver to perceive. It is like saying it takes a runner to run or it takes a swimmer to swim. It is meaninglessness dressed in verbal profundity. It proves nothing except that shallow is deep to some people.

I am fairly certain I am alive and would never say the opposite. I am considered an instance of "life". Can you find me an instance of mind?

reply to post by BO XIAN

Again . . . you seem to have a problem with WORDS.

And you seem to have a problem with punctuation.

What's puzzling . . . is why.

Verbally &/or otherwise abused as a child? Seems at least moderately to very likely.

Abusive verbally and wants to rationalize it? Plausible.

Anyway--here's some interesting links on the brain and language . . .

The best part is how you just finished telling me about my obsession with words, and then you go galavanting though studies about language to try to prove me wrong. Maybe you're obsessed with me a little bit?

You do realize every study you posted dealt with the representation (color for emphasis) of language and lexicons in the brain.

Maybe it's time you opened up that dictionary of yours. Turn it to the word "representation".

reply to post by LesMisanthrope


YUP . . . representation of words . . . just the things you've been insisting were NOT in the brain.

Just as the letters on the screen are representations of words on the screen . . .

and ink in the dictionary are representations of words in the dictionary.

and phonemes are representations of words in sound.

So hotshot, . . . how do words exist apart from the representations of the words?

There are no words apart from their representations.

Sigh.

I didn't figure you'd be reasonable or logical about the facts of words.

You seem to get your jollies blathering on convolutedly and illogically . . . for some mystifying reason . . . perhaps it's a fantasy that you're trying to sell to the world to demonstrate that you really have some shred of substance somewhere. Or perhaps it's an odd way of living up to your screen name.

reply to post by BO XIAN


You think a thought is a word? Representations of words are not words. Just like representations of flowers are not actual flowers. This is getting out of control.

You seem to get your jollies blathering on convolutedly and illogically . . . for some mystifying reason . . . perhaps it's a fantasy that you're trying to sell to the world to demonstrate that you really have some shred of substance somewhere. Or perhaps it's an odd way of living up to your screen name.

There's that obsession again.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope


More silliness.

You cannot, as in CANNOT, conceive of, much less think of or use a word without it's representation.

It's representation IS THE WORD.

I didn't realize THAT would be sooooooooooooo hard for some to fathom.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope


Hey, your fantasies struck me as out of control from virtually their first post.

AT least I haven't noticed them ever coming down to earth and reality.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

Words happen, speech mind happens. When language starts, language then takes on the ability to dialogue - it happens and then the dialogue continues regardless of whether there is anyone around to talk to or not. The wording is usually named thinking when the mouth is not moving.

Except words are not used to dialogue, thoughts are used. Words contain letters and compose sentences. Thoughts do not contain letters nor compose sentences.

The mind being referred to is 'speech mind' - there is no such 'thing' as mind but there is wording - dialogue going on without the mouth moving.

I agree language extends into the thought process. But no words are uttered or written when one thinks.

reply to post by BO XIAN

You cannot, as in CANNOT, conceive of, much less think of or use a word without it's representation.

It's representation IS THE WORD.

The word is letters and utterances. It is used to compose sentences. Because the word is used to represent does not actually mean that it is what it represents. The word chicken is not a chicken. You don't have actual words in your head no matter how hard you try to force it.

LesMisanthrope
Words contain letters and compose sentences.

Would you consider the above an aphorism?

reply to post by Itisnowagain

Would you consider the above an aphorism?

I would consider it a fact.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope

This thread seems to have turned into this thread - www.abovetopsecret.com...
See if you can spot the similarities.

reply to post by Itisnowagain


I'll read it if I find the time. You must be a fan.

LesMisanthrope
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

I'll read it if I find the time. You must be a fan.

I think that thread will be right up your street.

There seems to be an obsession with words.
Words are what divide that which is whole - conflict, battling with words, battling over words - it is the human condition.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

I think that thread will be right up your street.

There seems to be an obsession with words.
Words are what divide that which is whole - conflict, battling with words, battling over words - it is the human condition.

Says the man who speaks with words. I remember someone saying silence was golden, that it was the natural state of being. If only we practiced what we preached.

LesMisanthrope
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

I think that thread will be right up your street.

There seems to be an obsession with words.
Words are what divide that which is whole - conflict, battling with words, battling over words - it is the human condition.

Says the man who speaks with words. I remember someone saying silence was golden, that it was the natural state of being. If only we practiced what we preached.

There are a few on ATS who can never see past the words - they are confused by them - lost in concepts.
The non conceptual is where the peace lies and once this is found, concepts are seen for what they are and there is no confusion or conflict remaining.
The silence will not be known until the fighting words stop battling. And then the words are seen to be just wording.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope


If your mind is overly attached to thought, concept and imagery, words will hurt if presented with the intention to hurt instantly or cause pain in any other way. Some are so obsessed with what their minds are attached to, they can go and feel pain from words for years.

It´s called interdependant origination. You should study it closer.

reply to post by Itisnowagain

There are a few on ATS who can never see past the words - they are confused by them - lost in concepts.
The non conceptual is where the peace lies and once this is found, concepts are seen for what they are and there is no confusion or conflict remaining.
The silence will not be known until the fighting words stop battling. And then the words are seen to be just wording.

We can get lost in the woods but we should never blame the forest. We only achieve safety by going around it. But peace is learning to walk through it without fear.

reply to post by johncarter

If your mind is overly attached to thought, concept and imagery, words will hurt if presented with the intention to hurt instantly or cause pain in any other way. Some are so obsessed with what their minds are attached to, they can go and feel pain from words for years.

It´s called interdependant origination. You should study it closer.

I'll look into it. I would imagine that it is their imagery, concepts and thoughts that cause them harm, and the words merely serve as the reminder.