It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Obama Blames U.S. For Gun Violence In Mexico

page: 2
34
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on May, 3 2013 @ 01:40 PM
link   
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 



No, it's a consequence of greed and lack of integrity.


That is called capitalism my friend, or capitalist enterprise.

Globalization of our planet has ensured that we are all interconnected on some level and to say the US is not responsible would be ignorant and naive. It would be equally ignorant and naive to say America alone is to blame for the issues in not only Mexico, but everywhere else.
edit on 3-5-2013 by MDDoxs because: (no reason given)




posted on May, 3 2013 @ 01:42 PM
link   

Originally posted by MDDoxs
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 



No, it's a consequence of greed and lack of integrity.


The is called capitalism my friend, or capitalist enterprise.

Globalization of our planet has ensured that we are all interconnected on some level or not and to say the US is not responsible would ignorant and naive. It would be equally ignorant and naive to say America alone is to blame for the issues in not only Mexico, but everyone else.


Huh? Government and a private entity in bed together is NOT free market Capitalism. That relationship has another name:

Fascism! There hasn't been a free market Capitalist society for 100 years.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 01:43 PM
link   
reply to post by MDDoxs
 


If the war on drugs goes away, what happens to those guns and cartels, your opinion sir.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 01:46 PM
link   
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I will not banter on the definition of capitalism with you as their is always a disconnect between theoretical definitions and pragmatic realities.

But the America, or the west/industrialized countries, would be considered to have adopted capitalist practices.

Cartels live and die by the demand for their product, nuff said.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 01:52 PM
link   

Originally posted by Covertblack
reply to post by MDDoxs
 


If the war on drugs goes away, what happens to those guns and cartels, your opinion sir.


Pretty much as it now except they would get tax breaks, and write offs, and still be mercenaries.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 01:56 PM
link   

Originally posted by Covertblack
reply to post by MDDoxs
 


If the war on drugs goes away, what happens to those guns and cartels, your opinion sir.


That is a very open ended question and I would be hesitant to speculate, but I will touch on several key issues that would come into play if the war on drugs ended.

1. What would the availability of once illicit substances and/or products become in America as a result of domestic producers?
2.Where could Funds no longer used to fuel the fruitless and ineffective attempts to squash drug trafficking/production be diverted to? Drug rehabilitation? New Health Conscious Social Movement?
3. Future Demand for the product.

If the demand for the products is reduced then a natural course would be the downsizing of production and as a result downsizing in violence.

Now this quite far reaching grant it, but its a possibility.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 01:56 PM
link   
How did this thread go from Guns to a subject that ATS has a zero tolerance policy on, to anti-corporatism demagoguery?


edit on 3-5-2013 by neo96 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:03 PM
link   
The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.


This is a tricky topic to discuss within the bounds of our T&C policy, so there may be a need to read between the lines of my post, if you will. Attacking the gun violence in Mexico and blaming the USA for it is akin to treating a symptom but allowing the actual disaease to continue unfettered. There isn't an easy solution here because if the US was to legalize the lower level substances, the cartels would simply convert their smuggling operations to focus on the high level substances which would still be illegal. I believe they'd chase that all the way to mass smuggling of controlled narcotic prescription drugs like Oxycontin and opiates.

The other issue which doesn't get the same coverage as the drugs is the other stuff the cartels smuggle. There is a ridiculous amount of human trafficking going on, everything from illegal immigrants to sex slavery, the cartels run that game, too. From a national point of view, the US needs to secure its borders. By doing so, and I mean REALLY doing so, fences, National Guard, the whole nine yards, this becomes Mexico's problem. Once you make this truly Mexico's problem, and you say to Mexico "What are you going to do about this?" they will be forced to deal with their own issues and resolve their own problems.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:04 PM
link   

Originally posted by neo96
How did this thread go from Guns to a subject that ATS has a zero tolerance policy on, to anti-corporatism demagoguery?


I don't know about the last part, but it is impossible to discuss the topic without aknowledging the root cause, which is the zero tolerance issue.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:05 PM
link   

edit on 3-5-2013 by neo96 because: misread



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:07 PM
link   
reply to post by burdman30ott6
 


The root cause was Obama's and Holders manipulation of a federal agency 'corporations' didn't have a thing to do with it.

IMO.

ETA:

Seems to me if they don't have anything to shoot people with problem should solve itself.
edit on 3-5-2013 by neo96 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:09 PM
link   
reply to post by burdman30ott6
 


Pt 2 of your post wouldn't work because of what you pointed out in Pt 1. They are very ingenious. Shut off the boarders and they would just find another way in. Cut off the demand and they are screwed. That means putting money into treatment and education, not incarceration.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:09 PM
link   
reply to post by neo96
 




Obama Blames U.S. For Gun Violence In Mexico


Kind of sad that we ended up with a president that hates this country as much as so many do in other nations.

But, yes, a confession is due: toenail fungus, male pattern baldness and tooth decay are also the fault of America.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:09 PM
link   
reply to post by neo96
 


I apologize, I may have veered off on a bit of a tangent to go more in-depth to my perceived root causes of this issues surrounding your OP.

I will cease and desist beyond stating the root cause as per my initial post.

The Mexican-American relationship is a interesting and complex one. In the context of the OP, Guns should not be a as relevant as Obama is making it out to be and I agree with your conclusions.

regards



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:13 PM
link   
reply to post by neo96
 


Yea, cause America's insatiable drug habits aren't funding the drug cartels at all are they?

Na, must ONLY be fast and furious, before then, drug cartels had no weapons at all.

Oh no, it must all be Obama's fault, (even though it was Eric Holder who authorized Fast and Furious to begin with, it's Obama's fault) Even though without America's desire for the drug cartels products they wouldn't be so wealthy or so dangerous.

Nope, all Obama's fault.

Ever think that if Americans didn't buy the drug cartel's products that they wouldn't have as much money to spend on guns?



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:15 PM
link   
reply to post by MDDoxs
 


Don't I misread.

It is capitalism in it's truest sense unbridled,unregulated dog eat dog.

Survival of the fittest.

Government got a hold of it

It would implode, and be just like any other business in America struggling to stay afloat.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:19 PM
link   
reply to post by neo96
 
Everybody knows Obama has been the driving force behind the gun violence in Mexico and yet people still pretend he is such a good guy. He's in bed with the Mexican Cartels and the violence isn't going to stop until there isn't a demand for the "imports" they bring across the border. Stop the "War on Drugs" and there will be no need to import from the Mexican Cartels anymore- and drive them out of business. More American jobs, more tax revenues instead of expenditures- it's a win/win for us and a loss for them! Problem is Obama doesn't want the American people to win- he only wants to keep the Democratic Party in power.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:20 PM
link   
reply to post by HauntWok
 





Na, must ONLY be fast and furious, before then, drug cartels had no weapons at all.


What that excuse doesn't work for Cartels?

Then why are they trying to say it is going to work here?

Hmmmmm.




Oh no, it must all be Obama's fault, (even though it was Eric Holder who authorized Fast and Furious to begin with, it's Obama's fault) Even though without America's desire for the drug cartels products they wouldn't be so wealthy or so dangerous.


Obama hired Holder yes?




Nope, all Obama's fault.


Sure is.




Ever think that if Americans didn't buy the drug cartel's products that they wouldn't have as much money to spend on guns?


Dunno how anyone has dispoable income these days after the healthcare debacle,and lousy economy.

Curious is Obama accountable for anything ever?

Obama in Mexico pushing for immigration, and more gun control just pay no attention to fast, and furious.

Gun owners are the only ones that are to be held accountable for their actions?

Clearly not the drug cartels.not Obama, and not Holder.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:23 PM
link   
reply to post by neo96
 


This is not a partisan issue. This has been going on for a LONG time. If one points at Obama one also has to acknowledge the culpability of Bush, Clinton, Bush Sr and Reagan. Probably Reagan foremost as he started all this crap.



posted on May, 3 2013 @ 02:29 PM
link   
reply to post by intrepid
 


Fast and Furious happened under his watch where the violence in Mexico was the result of putting politics first instead of government's function, and the BATFE's function.

For the record the past few thousand years there has been violence surrounding that thing not just 'started with Reagon'.

edit on 3-5-2013 by neo96 because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
34
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in

join