Measles vaccination plan in England targets 1m children Q- was Swansea a beta test?

reply to post by Florasaurus

That's a very odd coincidence to get both diseases you were vaccinated against and the doctor's excuse......well, defies all logic! Cognitive Dissonace if ever I heard of a case!

Originally posted by Elliot

But something is not right at present with measles becoming epidemic around the world, not just the UK which begs the question, does the measles vaccine even work?

Because a certain DR Wakefield claimed there was a link between autism and the MMR vaccine based on a sample size of 12. 12 !!!!! for freaks sake. I could prove moon dust makes you eat apple pie with that ridiculously low sample size. Then the press jumped on the bandwagon and over hyped the report causing a lot of parents to not vaccinate their children. Wakefield was completely discredited but that wasn't as widely reported as the initial scare. Hey presto we are now seeing the result.

It's not the vaccine that doesn't work it's the lack of vaccination allowing the measles to take hold.

Plus all of the people coming down with measles in Wales are kids whose parents put them in danger by not vaccinating them.

I did read something once that the rate of non vaccination for measles was a grave concern to the authorities though because the more people who caught it in an outbreak gave the virus more space to mutate, and they were concerned that the people who refused the vaccine might turn into a breeding ground for a measles virus that might gain enough oompf to start affecting those who had been vaccinated, in which case we'd start to see hundreds and possibly thousands of people dying as it jumped to the vaccinated.

Long story short, for heavens sake people, get vaccinated. There's a reason we have mass vaccination for these diseases that used to kill thousands and then stopped because of mass vaccination programs.

reply to post by yorkshirelad

Explain the outbreak in India mainly in people who have been vaccinated.

hisz.rsoe.hu...

Outbreak of measles in US schools.

So, considering that mealses vaccination is compulsory for school in the usa, what does this say about whether the MMR vaccine works as well as the older measles vaccine?

Originally posted by stumason
reply to post by spooky1973

 

It is bollocks - millions have had this jab, but how many got Autism? While the figures suggest a 12 fold increase in Autism over the last 40 years, this is largely down to an expanding definition and better diagnosis. Seeing as MMR only started being used in 1988, there cannot be a correlation between it and the increase in Autism diagnosis, as the latter began long before the former.

And it wasn't just the BMJ who discredited Wakefield, but also the CDC, the GMC, the Lancet, the Institute of Medicine of the National Academy of Sciences, the UK National Health Service and the Cochrane Library. Pretty much everyone of the most respected medical institutes and journals has panned his research.

EDIT to add: Even the National Autistic Society dismisses any link...

edit on 28/4/13 by stumason because: (no reason given)

What do you say about this from Dr Peter Fletcher, www.dailymail.co.uk... He suggests the government has underplayed the risks and is a person who ought to know.

The National Autistic Society is a highly respected organisation, but might well be afraid of damage to its reputation if it does anything other than dismiss any link, because of the way anyone open-minded about it is put through the mill. It might be right, but I remain unconvinced.

reply to post by Anthony2

People might trust the government more on vaccines if it didn't poo poo the risks that always exist and should not be denied.
I understand that this september they plan to vaccinate two year olds against flu so that they don't pass their germs onto adults, so not for their own welfare. However, narcolepsy has been an awful side effect affecting many children who had the swine flu vaccine. Honesty all round would help people trust and decide for themselves.

reply to post by FurvusRexCaeli


Not everyone falls for the vaccination con.
Measles isn't that bad.

Besides only two people....if that, have died from the disease in the past ten years.

reply to post by lambros56
I agaree. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

I have regerets myself over having vaccinated. I realised that FEAR is the weapon used to manipulate the parents and as you say, measles though very unpleasant sometimes, is rarely fatal.

I wonder how many people die of complications from the common cold?
Could it be more?

reply to post by Elliot


It was very odd, I didn't even realise you could get both measles + German measles at the same time... I didn't believe the doctor at all either, it makes no sense at all. I do have an extremely rubbish immune system (probably due to the fact that I spend all my time inside on my computer ) but if I've been vaccinated then it shouldn't matter, I should be protected

The problem is that once the doctor has dismissed it as the jab causing it, I can't really go anywhere else to ask what the cause was =/

reply to post by Florasaurus
I mentioned earlier that my son caught mumps a few years after his MMR vaccine.
And I have heard many similar tales.
I'd wonder if this wonder vaccine works.

Originally posted by lambros56
Not everyone falls for the vaccination con.
Measles isn't that bad.

Besides only two people....if that, have died from the disease in the past ten years.

I'm sorry, but it is totally disingenuous of you to even say that. The reason only 2 people have died (in the UK - Globally it is worse) in the last 10 years is because of vaccination!!

Prior to any vaccination program, Measles was a killer. Outbreaks in the 19th and early 20th century could kill a third of a population, such as in Fiji in 1875. An outbreak in Bulgaria in 2009 led to 24,000 infections and 24 deaths. Even if it doesn't kill you, it can lead to life changing complications.

We can see from the below graph that with the invention of the measles vaccination (MMR aside) cases dropped of dramatically - how anyone can claim it is a con is beyond me. In fact, anyone doing so is a moron at best and downright evil at worst.

I have to agree with Stumason here, if you get measles when you've already had the jab it's a far less severe strain of it than if you hadn't had the jab.

The MMR was never supposed to stop you getting it altogether, the idea is that if you've already been exposed to measles or whatever through the jab then when you actually get the disease you're body knows how to handle it. And although hardly anyone's died from it, there's an alarming number of people going blind because they don't follow doctors orders. I had to wander round my house with sunglasses on for about 3 weeks

reply to post by Florasaurus


Quite - As a youngster before the MMR days I had all my jabs, but still ended up with a case of mumps and measles, but I shrugged them both off with only a couple of days bedrest, nothing like the full blown disease. Measles can blind you or cause brain damage, while mumps can do the same with the added bonus of making you infertile - so far I have produced three children!

You're right though, a vaccine just makes you body familiar with the virus in an inert form, so it knows how to respond if you do get it, without giving the virus a chance to take hold before your body produces the necessary antibodies. Kind of like a bullet proof vest - it will still sting if you get shot but the impact is markedly reduced.

My son caught mumps despite his MMR vaccination and had the complication of viral meningitis, which he recoverd from in nearly three weeks. But the GP pointed out that if you have had the jab, the chances are that you will react worse to the virus than if you had not had the jab.
Now, we could never go back and find out how he would have reacted without MMR, but my suspicion is that the measles single jab we used to have may have been far too successful for the drugs companies to make a big enough profit from. However, MMR seems to require regular updates which means more profits.
Follow the Money!!!

reply to post by Elliot


There is a condition known as a Cytokine storm, which is essentially the bodies immune system being too aggressive - it's what killed people who had Bird Flu, which is why it was the young and healthy people dying, not the infants or elderly.

Maybe that is what happened, or something similiar. Your sons body was already reacting to the vaccine and went overboard with the other infections.

reply to post by stumason


Son had his vaccination when he was about four. But he had mumps when he was in year eight at school so that would make him about 13.

How many times does someone need to have mmr for it to 'work'?

reply to post by Elliot


Usually, it is 2 jabs. One at age 1 and a booster at age 4/5 as it is not 100% effective at generating an immunity. Around 2-5% of people will not get an immunity from the first jab - I would assume the same figures probably apply for the booster, so in theory you could have a very small number of people who fail to get an immunity after the two jabs, something like 0.0025% if my maths is sound. They may seem small, but out of 100,000 people that is 250 people that, potentially, would fail to become immune after two jabs.

As also said, having an immunity doesn't mean you won't get the disease - most of the time when you do you won't notice as your body fights it off, sometimes you may get a milder infection.

It just seems you were unlucky.