If your city is on "lock-down", do NOT look outside.

Reminds me of an mtv commercial. Think I can pull it up somewhere.

www.youtube.com...

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


So how much did this cost again? Around 300 million? Well, the terrorists know now how to fight America. After a few more events like Boston / Waterdown the US will be broke in no time (well, they are already broke but that is another topic altogether)

Originally posted by Char-Lee

Originally posted by captaintyinknots

Originally posted by gladtobehere
reply to post by Danbones

 

Pssht, you cant even refuse entry into your own home...

Yes, yes you can. If they have no warrant, you have every right to refuse.

Did you want the videos? I would be like those people shaking, scared and no way have the courage to say..where is the warrant?

But you are missing the point. As I said, I dont agree with intimidation tactics. Doesnt change the FACT, though, that from a legal standpoint, they were not outside the law, so long as permission was asked.

Originally posted by gladtobehere

Originally posted by jacobe001
If I was there, I would be more afraid of them than the terrorist.

If I could build on this point.

I couldnt agree with you more.

I find that most people now fear police more than they do the common criminal.

Yes again like Nazi germany. There is so much similarity it seems only very young would not notice.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

I just want to really emphasize here....while people argue this like a generic 'this reaction could happen any time' event, that's simply not true and this WAS a very hot and anxious situation.

What about the mass shootings by gangbangers is Chicago, or LA?

Did LA lock down the city when they were after Dorner?? This is all the more reason to believe that the Boston bombing is a conspiracy!!!!!!

We can find "excuses" and "reasons" for everything that happens in this world, but look outside the box at what is happening!!!!!

What did we here about non stop before Boston?????? North Korea??????? Then, after Boston died down, it is a mix between chemical weapons in Syria, and a teeny teeny bit of North Korea! See the pattern Wrabbit????

I know you are smart enough to not get caught up and defend this nonsense! It has been a proven pattern by the MSM that we are easily manipulated.......

Originally posted by MuzzleBreak
Using your scope to identify possible targets when civilians are 1000 times as prevavlent as potential targets is shear idiocy. That's even taught in Hunter Safety courses regarding hunting game. If you're being fired upon actively, then it's a different story.

My 12 year old learned that in hunter safety. It doesn't matter if you are a "pro" accidents happen. What a moron.



please see update here:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by seeker1963

What about the mass shootings by gangbangers is Chicago, or LA?

Different situations require different tactics. You are comparing 'specific target' events to 'events of oppurtunity'.

Did LA lock down the city when they were after Dorner?? This is all the more reason to believe that the Boston bombing is a conspiracy!!!!!!

They locked down Big Bear, the area where they were focusing their search. They also locked down neighborhoods immediately after each on of his shootings. So yes, they did.

We can find "excuses" and "reasons" for everything that happens in this world, but look outside the box at what is happening!!!!!

And we can sit and point out hypotheticals and use them as examples of injustices. Doesnt make it so. I ask again: Can someone please provide sources for what rights were violated?

What did we here about non stop before Boston?????? North Korea??????? Then, after Boston died down, it is a mix between chemical weapons in Syria, and a teeny teeny bit of North Korea! See the pattern Wrabbit????

News is cyclical, and the media is a whole other problem. Before NK it was Dorner. Before Dorner it was Syria. Before that it was Sandy Hook. Before that it was Iran. There is always a story for the media whore to latch onto.

I know you are smart enough to not get caught up and defend this nonsense! It has been a proven pattern by the MSM that we are easily manipulated.......

See, and there you go once again, advocating an 'us vs. them' mentality. "If you dont agree with me, you are one of them, and not smart'. Again, these attitudes are a major part of the problem.

Originally posted by superman2012

Originally posted by MuzzleBreak
Using your scope to identify possible targets when civilians are 1000 times as prevavlent as potential targets is shear idiocy. That's even taught in Hunter Safety courses regarding hunting game. If you're being fired upon actively, then it's a different story.

My 12 year old learned that in hunter safety. It doesn't matter if you are a "pro" accidents happen. What a moron.

Comparing hunters safety to active shooter scenarios (which is what this was) is a stretch at best, and downright dishonest at worst.

Originally posted by kudegras

This is not protection of the people, this is control by force. And this is a show of strength by a government agency using the military as its tool. Total overkill and sadly the shape of things to come.

This bears repeating.
How did the government and agencies handle past events similar in nature like the Unabomber, Mcveigh, and the serial killers in the past?

They were handled by police work and investigations. Not by locking down parts of a city and infringing on the rights of others.

The pressure cooker bombers are real, but various agencies have used this latest atrocity to further expand how they respond using military tactics and to see how citizens react.

reply to post by seeker1963

What about the mass shootings by gangbangers is Chicago, or LA?

Did LA lock down the city when they were after Dorner?? This is all the more reason to believe that the Boston bombing is a conspiracy!!!!!!

No, they didn't lock-down in this same way and you're making the case for me. They didn't have any good reason to respond this way. The LAPD got extreme with their rogue cop and I think that was overkill but it was personal and that makes a whole different kind of serious problem to address. LAPD probably should have been held OUT of that whole thing and let feds or other local agencies pursue it for that very reason.

Still, gang bangers aren't politicos. They don't murder innocents for idealism. They kill for grudges, profit, or just plain "good business". It doesn't make it any less a crime or terrible thing ..but it radically changes the response because ambushing cops and killing them isn't something gang bangers are ever likely to do (That defines BAD business). If that changes, responses will change too, IMO.

Oh.. and check into how the domestic militant groups were fought in a couple notable cases in the 60's. Some of those did culminate in near street battles and ongoing firefights as if this had become a South Vietnamese scene. It's very rare in our nation, Thank God, but it does happen and has happened before.

@ An additional thought on this.... During the Rodney King riots, they had Main Battle Tanks parked at the Ramada Inn off the 91 freeway, just south of the Riot perimeter. Atop that building, they had armed teams on the building corners and people saw gunships in the air above L.A at different points. On the last day of the riots, United States Marines at Camp Pendleton were being prepared to go north on buses to hit the streets of Los Angeles to restore order. That almost DID become an outright use of combat troops on U.S. streets. It didn't lead to more ..it was no slippery slope. It had no comparison before or since. (There was a warehouse on the edge of the riot zone ..no one in the public knew then... which held a major arms shipment to an Asian nation. Nothing nefarious... Just routine arms shipments but heavy weapons and rockets among other things)

reply to post by captaintyinknots

The thing is, it is a situational question. If I felt there was no reason they needed to search it, you're darn right I would refuse a search.

Please think, after watching the videos, imagine this is your family. They didn't "search voluntarily the homes' they screamed at the top of their lungs at your elderly Mom, HANDS UP HANDS UP< HANDS ON YOUR HEAD!

She is quivering and her hands are up then down then up as they scream, shaking not sure what is happening...they march her with the rest of the family a block down where men are searching HER BODY! Yes they did watch it! they searched those people who are NOT SUSPECTS!!!

Did they calmly ask the lady to come outside so they could search her home..thank you..NO.

SS officers in the making practicing, I would not doubt there are people missing from Boston never to be found.

Originally posted by Char-Lee


SS officers in the making practicing, I would not doubt there are people missing from Boston never to be found.

And once again, here we are. What good does making unsubstantiated, sensationalistic accusations like this do? It certainly doesnt help your argument any. If anything, all it does is show, once again, what I have been saying. Many of YOU are just as bad as the cops you claim to be against.

Many of YOU are creating the 'us vs. them' mentality, same as the overzealous cops.

And whats worst, is, that most of you dont even see that you are being used.

Please think, after watching the videos, imagine this is your family. They didn't "search voluntarily the homes' they screamed at the top of their lungs at your elderly Mom, HANDS UP HANDS UP< HANDS ON YOUR HEAD!
She is quivering and her hands are up then down then up as they scream, shaking not sure what is happening...they march her with the rest of the family a block down where men are searching HER BODY! Yes they did watch it! they searched those people who are NOT SUSPECTS!!!

You can tell all of that from the video? You can hear the conversation that is had? You know what lead them to that house? You know that they had no intel that lead them to believe the suspect may be in this house? You know that these people didnt agree to the search? Come on now. You're assuming a whole lot.

I do see a militarized police force in that photo.
Can someone explain to me why their outfits are different?
Is the one in the darker clothes the battalion, er, LEO commander?
The majority of them are in grey outfits that appear to be patternless, but the one pointing the gun is in grey camo, which I'm assuming is the proper urban warfare fashion. Why would he be dressed differently than his buddies who are hoofing it?
Why is camo still used anyways? He's in a tank for goodness sakes! Does he think his clothes make him invisible?
I've never found urban warfare camo to be as effective as the green jungle camo, which probably does actually work to camouflage the soldier.
"I'm walking down the middle of the street in grey splotchy clothing! You can't see me!"

I also don't understand the need for rolling out tanks. How is a tank going to help them anyways? Tanks are slow, bulky, and a waste of fuel for the situation. Were they thinking that the bombers planted land mines under the streets?

Originally posted by captaintyinknots

Originally posted by superman2012

Originally posted by MuzzleBreak
Using your scope to identify possible targets when civilians are 1000 times as prevavlent as potential targets is shear idiocy. That's even taught in Hunter Safety courses regarding hunting game. If you're being fired upon actively, then it's a different story.

My 12 year old learned that in hunter safety. It doesn't matter if you are a "pro" accidents happen. What a moron.

Comparing hunters safety to active shooter scenarios (which is what this was) is a stretch at best, and downright dishonest at worst.

Not really.
Loaded deer rifles kill people when rules of safety are not followed.... just the same as loaded assault weapons wielded by police.

BTW... news reports indicated that National Guard units were on the streets during the lockdown. Are they by any chance considered military? Or does that only count when they get sent to fight in Afghanistan?

reply to post by Afterthought

I do see a militarized police force in that photo. Can someone explain to me why their outfits are different? Is the one in the darker clothes the battalion, er, LEO commander?

See, the people making the claims are the ones that need to answer those questions. Since it is being claimed that they are military, someone needs to back that up.

Truth be told, they are likely national guard. It is not illegal for national guard to be there.

Originally posted by butcherguy

Originally posted by captaintyinknots

Originally posted by superman2012

Originally posted by MuzzleBreak
Using your scope to identify possible targets when civilians are 1000 times as prevavlent as potential targets is shear idiocy. That's even taught in Hunter Safety courses regarding hunting game. If you're being fired upon actively, then it's a different story.

My 12 year old learned that in hunter safety. It doesn't matter if you are a "pro" accidents happen. What a moron.

Comparing hunters safety to active shooter scenarios (which is what this was) is a stretch at best, and downright dishonest at worst.

Not really.
Loaded deer rifles kill people when rules of safety are not followed.... just the same as loaded assault weapons wielded by police.

BTW... news reports indicated that National Guard units were on the streets during the lockdown. Are they by any chance considered military? Or does that only count when they get sent to fight in Afghanistan?

You are professing your ignorance here. There are different guidelines and tactics used in different situations. The tactics used by a hunter are not in any way the same as those used in tactical situations.

Like I said, they ARE likely National Guard. And what, exactly, is the problem with that?

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Speaking about Dorner, remind me again who exactly fired on innocent civilians in their own vehicles?
I'm pretty sure it was the loose canon police, right?

I'm glad you do see the pattern emerging here. The thing with Dorner is that he specifically stated that his targets were the officers and others who had wronged him and had no intention of hurting civilians.
Alas, they probably should've put LA on lock down, too. Maybe the cops wouldn't have been so trigger happy if everyone was in their homes too scared to look out their windows.
Anyways, how come they didn't go door to door during the hunt for this man who did have friends and family? No, they wait until there's a terrorist in Boston and act like the citizens of Boston are hiding a man they're told just bombed their city street. If I were a Bostonian, I'd be extremely offended that my police force thought I or my neighbors were harboring a terrorist and treated as such.

reply to post by captaintyinknots


Police activity... looking for a single 19 year old male suspect. Using military force in that situation was completely overboard. Let me remind you that he was completely unarmed and they fired a whole lot of rounds into the boat in that situation. Think they were a little too edgy? Using these dopes as as yardstick is not a good move.

As far as my ignorance, what was the need for all of the storm troopers with their fingers on the triggers pointed at completely innocent citizens? You don't think rules of safety should be followed when they are 'protecting' the public?

Although it can be intimidating you are within your rights to refuse a search at any time, when asked for permission. If you voluntarily allow them to search, and they find anything, it's on you. If you refuse and they find your 20 marijuana plants in the basement, the evidence becomes fruit of the poisonous tree. Thus in court it will be thrown out, unless the officers could say they would have found the evidence eventually through legal means.

Originally posted by Afterthought
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

Speaking about Dorner, remind me again who exactly fired on innocent civilians in their own vehicles?
I'm pretty sure it was the loose canon police, right?

I'm glad you do see the pattern emerging here. The thing with Dorner is that he specifically stated that his targets were the officers and others who had wronged him and had no intention of hurting civilians.
Alas, they probably should've put LA on lock down, too. Maybe the cops wouldn't have been so trigger happy if everyone was in their homes too scared to look out their windows.
Anyways, how come they didn't go door to door during the hunt for this man who did have friends and family? No, they wait until there's a terrorist in Boston and act like the citizens of Boston are hiding a man they're told just bombed their city street. If I were a Bostonian, I'd be extremely offended that my police force thought I or my neighbors were harboring a terrorist and treated as such.

Didn't he kill a police officers daughter, and fiance?