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First Case Of New Bird Flu Found Outside China

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posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 05:57 PM
I remember when the original bird flu made its appearance. Bad news. The warnings of person to person strains developing...Even worse:

Archived from 2008: are the implications of avian influenza to human health? Two main risks for human health from avian influenza are 1) the risk of direct infection when the virus passes from the infected bird to humans, sometimes resulting in severe disease; and 2) the risk that the virus – if given enough opportunities – will change into a form that is highly infectious for humans and spreads easily from person to person.

I also remember that it was stated this could be on a Global scale like nothing we've ever seen.

From 2005: global influenza pandemic (worldwide spread) may occur if three conditions are met:

A new subtype of influenza A virus is introduced into the human population.

The virus causes serious illness in humans.

The virus can spread easily from person to person in a sustained manner.

Many were expecting this to happen and I also remember the "When...Not if" statements from the CDC.

I guess this is the "When"...


posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 06:12 PM
reply to post by soficrow

Check a little history and you will find the "Spainish Flu" really began in the U S with men in an army training camp.

If this does primarily affect the older "useless eaters", of which I am one, the government wont have to worry about fixxing social security for several more years, even if then.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 06:44 PM
So far the transmission between humans is not occurring. There is some hype about it, but if you read further they say it is still not confirmed... yet.

If people who handle birds get sick and then hospital staff do too, this could be that virus is on the workers clothing. The virus is increasing in the animal populations and that makes more people vulnerable to catching it directly from birds. That could explain the recent upswing in cases.

The dude that brought it to Taiwan travelled there from China with it. He already had it when he arrived.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 06:55 PM
reply to post by teamcommander

I always reference Spanish Flu's origins in a US army camp, been doing it here for years. ...I'm older too - and on the list for culling. The Chronic Disease Pandemic is playing hell with every nations' GDP and every global corporations' bottom line - looks like someone got tired of waiting for nature to do something...

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 06:58 PM
reply to post by jude11

...Do you really think this is the pandemic strain? It's targeting men over 60 (74% or so maybe) - would certainly wipe out a HUGE portion of the retired/dependent population.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 07:04 PM
reply to post by intrptr

They just don't know - could be, maybe not - we can't say either way. But you're right, environmental reservoirs (water, soil, clothing) seem more in play than anything else.

Just found a GREAT site - has solid info. Bottom section has accurate info on your issues.

Ian M. Mackay, PhD., Virology Down Under

Quick numbers…

Total confirmed human cases of influenza A virus H7N9: 110
Total deaths attributed to infection with influenza A virus H7N9: 23**
Number of cases discharge from hospital: 12
Time between illness onset and discharge (days): 16
Current Case Fatality Rate (CFR*): 19%
Average time from illness onset to first confirmation of H7N9 (days): 9
Average age of the H7N9-confirmed cases (including deaths; years): 58
Median age of the H7N9-confirmed cases (including deaths; years): 62
The mode of the ages among confirmed cases (including deaths; years): 54, 56 and 74
Average age of the deceased (years): 61
The mode of the ages among the deceased (years): 64, 74, 77
Males: 67% of cases, 71% of deaths

…..Some things we don't know…
[With thanks to Dr. Katherine Arden for contributing to the questions and thoughts below]

The source of the human infection
The incubation period in humans
The seroprevalence of H7N9 in humans and animals
Whether human-to-human transmission is occurring
The scope of H7N9 genetic change in real-time
The nature, specificity, use and effectiveness of H7N9 assays
The range of signs and symptoms attributable to H7N9
How many are infected without obvious signs of infection

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 07:52 PM
We must keep an eye on this.
China is the worse place for something like this to start as well as being the most obvious.

China ranges from extream overpopulated places in cramped, industrialised areas, sharing cramped houses with other workers or people.
China also have alot of farming, farming for a huge population. Alot of people working with animals, and then trading with the overpopulated areas.
If it does start to spread, it wont be long until it will spread into the lower workers (factorys etc), then other people who travel all over the world (students, businessmen, tourists etc)

This is making me think though back to the Swine flu. Could that of actualy been a drill for incase something like this happens?

I don't think the powers that be would actualy use a virus on the people because it's so hard to control.
They would be risking themselves, their family, their friends, their workers and the people that do everything for them. The world would stop and they would inherit nothing, because they would even be dead or too tired tring to survive an apocalypse.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 08:07 PM

Originally posted by soficrow
reply to post by jude11

...Do you really think this is the pandemic strain? It's targeting men over 60 (74% or so maybe) - would certainly wipe out a HUGE portion of the retired/dependent population.

Not sure but I do remember the Human to Human warnings. If it emerges that this is indeed what we are seeing, we could be in serious trouble.

Too early to tell tho. No one is talking it seems.


posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 08:19 PM
Now this is very disturbing, this new bird flu just became air born.

3 hospital staff show symptoms after H7N9 contact

Three hospital personnel have developed respiratory symptoms after coming into contact with Taiwan's first confirmed case of H7N9 avian flu, the Central Epidemic Command Center said Wednesday.

A survey of the epidemic situation showed that 139 local people had come into contact with the man, a Taiwanese businessman based in Jiangsu's Suzhou area, the center said.

So has the bird flu finally became something very deadly?

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 09:21 PM
reply to post by jude11

Yes, they're really being cautious - the human-to-human warnings are/were a bit sensationalist, override the very real danger that the virus is loose in the environment, and we STILL don't know the actual reservoir (clearly not poultry (only 0.0005% have it) - not pigs or dogs - maybe rats? flies? who knows?.

It's definitely concentrated in live markets, but they don't know how it's getting there - not enough poultry have it, farm chickens test negative -
....Flies are a likely vector ...H5N1 was found in flies as well as water and soil (like prions
) - routes of mechanical transmission - vectors but still no reservoir.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 09:31 PM
reply to post by soficrow

Men over 60? Just men? And I thought that older people have some immunity to many forms of the flu, and if this is a new one why does it just "go after" the older population, wouldn't that be unusual in flu outbreaks (the 1918 flu, if I recall the data, hit younger people very hard). So if this is a "designer" variant, what could 'they' have done to make it age specific? Thanks for all of your good work, and keeping an eye out for what many of us would have missed if it wasn't for your reports.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 09:33 PM
reply to post by Trolloks

China is the worse place for something like this to start as well as being the most obvious.

H7N9 bird flu first appeared in the USA in 1988, although the first human cases tested for and found were in China.

Organism Influenza A virus (A/turkey/Minnesota/38429/1988(H7N9)) EMBL ACZ48625.1

Similarly, the 1918 Spanish Flu did not start in Spain - but in an army camp in the USA. The 2009 H1N1 swine flu pandemic did not start in Mexico - the first human cases of H1N1 triple assortment flu appeared in 1998 in the USA.

IMHO - The most obvious place for pandemic disease strains to start is factory farms - industrial agri-business operations. ...You're right that large human populations close to animals provide more opportunities for cross-infection but ... that's not the real problem imho.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 09:37 PM
reply to post by MidnightTide

Now this is very disturbing, this new bird flu just became air born.

No it hasn't. Because symptoms first appear in the respiratory tract only shows that virus particles were inhaled. That could more likely have come from the infected persons clothing. Thats different than airborne transmission from human to human.

Like if you work in a chicken breeding company and you handle birds all day you will breathe in a lot of dust that might have particles of this virus on it. That is also not "airborne transmission". Likewise once you have it, you cannot breathe it into another person. People can not "catch it" from others.... yet.

Since virus are multiplying at millions of times a second though, eventually one mutation will result in a strain that is passable. Thats the threat. It would then have to also mutate into an airborne strain while in a human so that others can catch it like the "common" cold.

The odds against that are astronomical... but dropping.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 09:39 PM
reply to post by MidnightTide

That's a link I put in my OP - and it says the 3 staff people "show symptoms", NOT test positive. ...This is a fairly lethal flu, and already is much worse than H5N1 bird flu. ...We need to find out how it's spreading and right now the spread obviously is not from airborne particles (given the huge geographical area and sporadic cases).

....If insects like flies are a vector and it does become airborne - it will threaten older men all over the world, as well as a smaller percentage of older women like me. Most people under the age 60 will survive - many may learn they have chronic disease as a result of mild infection, and become debilitated after a decade or so. 'Tis the way these things seem to work.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 09:43 PM
reply to post by Aleister

You're welcome.
...Not just men, just mostly older men. Older women too just more older men. Sucks, no? Looks like the young and healthy should be fine - til they start getting debilitated by chronic disease. We live in a complex interconnected world. I do find it fascinating.

Is it a designer flu? Nah, it's just convenient coincidence - wipes out the useless eaters AND China's mom-and-pop meat industry too. Ya gotta laugh.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 09:46 PM
reply to post by intrptr

Informative great post. Thanks


posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 10:01 PM
I don't mind saying, this one scares the poo outta this Rabbit. I spent some time really looking at outbreak reports and numbers earlier today during a slow class and just about cussed out loud when I saw the reported cases to reported death figures in multiple areas of China over this one. 100 infected to see 22 die isn't a bad flu, it's a nightmare in the making. Some other reports had slightly higher mortality rates suggested from different facilities treating people

It's not surprising..and it shouldn't be. These have come before. They *WILL* come again and the most likely vector has always been a combination of avian/swine mix for the mutation to jump to humans. Especially where close regular contact with one or both aside humans is the norm. I hope this isn't "the next one". I'd be really really happy if it comes in about 30 years. Time enough for me to live out my days and expire in peace somewhere.....not hacking up my insides and dying from a stupid virus. What a way to go.....

I'd say this is one to watch though. Many previous seasons have had little boys crying wolf like it's great amusement or something. This one appears to be carrying the death tolls to sit up and take notice. MAYBE it'll mutate back out of this nasty form before it makes the seasonal jump to other regions.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 10:38 PM
Anyone wanting to read a good book on viruses that will help them understand them should look at this on line PDF: "The Hot Zone" by Richard Preston. As scary as you want it to be. This is not a download file, just a link...

THE EMERGENCE OF AIDS, Ebola, and any number of other rainforest agents appears to be a natural consequence of the ruin of tropical biosphere.

The emerging viruses are surfacing from ecologically damaged parts of the earth. Many of them come from tatered edges of tropical rain forest, or they come from tropical savanna that is being settled rapidly by people.

The tropical rain forests are the deep reservoirs of life on the planet, containing most of the world's plant and animal species. The rain forests are also its largest reservoirs of viruses, since all living things carry viruses. When viruses come out of an ecosystem, they tend to spread in wave through the human population, like echoes from the dying biosphere.


In a sense, the earth is mounting an immune response against the human species. It is beginning to react to the human parasite, the flooding infection of people, the dead spots of concrete all over the planet, the cancerous rot-outs in Europe, Japan and the United States, thick with replicating primates, the colonies enlarging and spreading and threatening to shock the biosphere with mass extinctions. Perhaps the biosphere does not 'like' the idea of five billion humans. Or it could also be said that the extreme amplification of human race, which has occurred only in the past hundred years or so, has suddenly produced a very large quantity of meat, which is sitting everywhere in the biosphere and may not be able to defend itself against a life form that might want to consume it. Nature has interesting ways of balance itself. The rain forest has its own defenses. The earth's immune system, so to speak, has recognized the presence of the human species and is starting to kick in.

The earth is attempting to rid itself of an infection by human parasite.

The Hot Zone… on line

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 10:54 PM
Very informative thread..Thanks OP..
I have nothing to add, but now I am aware and will be watching this thread to learn more.

posted on Apr, 24 2013 @ 11:03 PM
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

Then there is the "disobey a quarenteen order or zone and we shoot you aspect" of this too

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