It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Originally posted by dontreally
You want a good book on this subject, read Robert Reilly's "the closing of the Muslim Mind: How intellectual suicide created the modern Islamist crisis".
Originally posted by Zatox
why are people so threatened by Islam?
This is what makes it truly the right religion, because the world is against us. Allah akbar!
Originally posted by Misbah
How about Algebra? Did that make man devolve? After all it came from an Arab Muslim and it's the reason computers exist today.
The roots of algebra can be traced to the ancient Babylonians, who developed an advanced arithmetical system with which they were able to do calculations in an algorithmic fashion. The Babylonians developed formulas to calculate solutions for problems typically solved today by using linear equations, quadratic equations, and indeterminate linear equations. By contrast, most Egyptians of this era, as well as Greek and Chinese mathematics in the 1st millennium BC, usually solved such equations by geometric methods, such as those described in the Rhind Mathematical Papyrus, Euclid's Elements, and The Nine Chapters on the Mathematical Art. The geometric work of the Greeks, typified in the Elements, provided the framework for generalizing formulae beyond the solution of particular problems into more general systems of stating and solving equations, although this would not be realized until mathematics developed in medieval Islam.
By the time of Plato, Greek mathematics had undergone a drastic change. The Greeks created a geometric algebra where terms were represented by sides of geometric objects, usually lines, that had letters associated with them. Diophantus (3rd century AD), sometimes called "the father of algebra", was an Alexandrian Greek mathematician and the author of a series of books called Arithmetica. These texts deal with solving algebraic equations.
Originally posted by freedomSlave
I would say all religion devolves us , look at the crusades , look at the witch hunting , the inquisition, look at the people who look like they are having seizures on the floor while talking in tongues , to the acceptance of pedophilia in the catholic churches from it's members who still follow it . islam is no better than nazism , catholics , christians , jews , ladder saints .
ETA they have seemed to all have brought out the worst of humanity through out timeedit on 20/4/13 by freedomSlave because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by LadyGreenEyes
reply to post by charles1952
I believe he makes quite valid points. Considering the deplorable conditions in many Islamic countries today, it would be difficult in the extreme to call them "advanced". One place my husband deployed, he told me the locals were doing their laundry in a nasty, muddy water hole that literally had sewage in it.
I think the author was examining Islam compared to other religions as opposed to religion versus non-religion. But your point is still a good one. It seems the essay focused entirely on Islam v. Christianity and Judaism, leaving out everything else. It might have been because of space limitations. But I think a better reason is size and scope of the religion. The categories of Non-religious, Islamic, and Christian, account for 70% of the world's population. Add in Hinduism and you reach 84%. www.adherents.com... There really aren't many large players. Note that Judaism, at less than 1%, has had a relatively huge impact on the world of science. Bluesma, properly wonders, however, whether that's a plus.
it seems to me that religion in general has shown itself to be a scientific and technology limiting factor in societies throughout the world and history.
Maybe some more than others, or maybe some more at different points in it's history
(there were times when Christianity was more powerful, and much more restrictive also).
It's absolutely correct that a culture that values nothing but science has lost it's heart, it's passion, it's humanity. But isn't it also true that a society which runs from science has lost it's mind? Shouldn't there be a blend of the two? We can have both sewing circles and string theory, coming of age rituals and Iridium cell phones. Individuals may then choose how to create their lives. But I believe the author's position is that Islam does not offer that choice, that Science is limited and not encouraged, something to be warily approached.
What calls my attention is the assumed judgement here, that scientific and technological progress is always "good",and any influence which slows or hinders it is "bad".
Perhaps we have become dependent on modern conveniences, but I'm relatively sure the "people living in squalor in third world countries" would grin and laugh even more if they had electricity, clean water, functioning sewers, dentistry, and life expectancies longer than 50 years. Again, the correct path involves both valuing particles and people.
I'd like to look closer, zooming in on this assumption made... Are the most technologically advanced societies filled with happier people? Perhaps we need to establish what we mean by happy. Some might call it physical comfort, some might call it an inner emotional fulfillment. Some might be physically comfortable, and trying to stuff an inner emptiness that is emotional based consumption, instead of physical need.
I am not so sure anymore that we are correct in the assumption. When I see people living in squalor in third world countries, and yet they grin, they laugh, they gather together and sing and support each other.
Christianity and Judaism seem to encourage technological progress. Perhaps we're biased, but I think most weterners and ATSers would prefer science to non-science.
Just my opinion. Islam might be a religion which slows technological progress, just as many other religons are.
As I was told earlier in the thread, Islam is a set of laws governing every aspect of a believer's life. You can't turn to it, you're surrounded by it. In other societies, science does it's job and religion does it's job.
But people do not turn to religions for that kind of fulfilment anyway.
And the cause of the darkness? That period is usually measured from the destruction of the Roman empire. The world's leading civilization collapsed just before 500 A.D. That had a very disruptive effect on the world. Then the conquests of the Muslim armies began and extended as far as Spain. Trade from parts of Europe to the East was cut off. These things did not occur because the Roman religion was opposed to science.
I think we overcook this notion that Europe at a certain time was "dark"< while the Islamic world was a beacon of light- far from that straightforward
These are the Islamic Laws according to the Fatawa of Ayatullah al Uzama Syed Ali al-Husaini Seestani. This is the English Version of Taudhihul Masae'l, translated by the World Federation of KSI Muslim Communities, P.O. Box 60, Stanmore, U.K. HA7 4LQ. See also a downloadable version of this book in HTML Help format.
I'm not entirely sure I understand you. By radical Islam, I assume you mean something believed by a very small percentage of Muslims. If so, then the the vast majority of Muslims welcome and appreciate Science. How then does a group of over a billion people, with vast wealth, produce so little in the Scientific fields?
I would understand this way of thinking if we were talking about radical Islam, but you can say the same for radical christianity. . . . why not just condemn the root of all human advancement, religious dogma. Knowing scientifically how the universe expanded, then accreted into form, or knowing genetically we didn’t evolve from one man and one woman, or understanding the weather is dictated predominantly by Sol, why in 2013 do people still believe in these religious fallacies.
Oh, goodness. Do you mean to say that people who are atheists have genetically superior brains? I hadn't heard that one. I'd like to know more about that.
Mass amounts of genetically inferior intellect are now pulling down our global society with it.
I believe the point of the essay was dealing with Islamic scientific advancements over long periods of time. Of course, being bombed doesn't do your infrastructure any good, but even before the fighting were there Apple stores, cell phone towers, community colleges, and sewage treatment plants all over the countryside? I don't think Afghanistan was a thriving, modern nation before the US, or even the Soviets, arrived.
And what is the main reason behind a lot of the deplorable conditions? It couldn't be because many of these places have been bombed to death over the last few decades?
Originally posted by freedomSlave
I think we are getting there slowly as technology advances.
Originally posted by charles1952
I think the author was examining Islam compared to other religions as opposed to religion versus non-religion.
It's absolutely correct that a culture that values nothing but science has lost it's heart, it's passion, it's humanity. But isn't it also true that a society which runs from science has lost it's mind? Shouldn't there be a blend of the two?
In other societies, science does it's job and religion does it's job.