**Civil War Watch**

Centurion 1211
I was not aware that defending freedom and liberty at home from creeping fascism was a partisan exercise.

As to gun ownership, perhaps you’ve never been to Vermont. There is currently a movement in Vermont led by Thomas Naylor to secede from the union. Vermont is one of the most liberal states in the union and does not adhere well to the idea that liberals do not own guns because they are afraid of them.

The following are excerpts from an article by Christopher Ketcham titled Long Live Secession!

Snip

“It has no death penalty and virtually no gun-control laws, yet remains one of the least violent jurisdictions in America. It has no military bases, no strategic resources, few military contractors. All three members of its congressional delegation voted against the Iraq war resolution.”

“Vermont is rural and wild, with the highest percentage of unpaved roads in the nation, the highest percentage of residents living in the countryside; it was the first state to ban billboards alongside highways. It is rebellious: It fathered Ethan Allen and his Green Mountain Boys and 200 years later elected Howard Dean. With its vigorous environmental-impact laws, Vermont fended off the depredations of Wal-Mart superstores longer than any other state; Montpelier is the only state capital in America without a McDonald's restaurant. Following mock secession debates in seven Vermont towns in 1990, all seven voted for secession.”

Snip

“Naylor is a pacifist and will not take up arms, though he admits that Vermont, with its mountains and forests, and high gun ownership among an historically contrarian people, is ideal ground for a guerrilla insurgency." This is a call for nonviolent revolt against the world's global superpower by 608,000 people," he says. "What will the superpower do? Will it burn off the sugar maple trees? Will it destroy all the black-and-white Holstein cows? Just imagine trying to enslave independent-minded Vermonters."

You can find the article here but you will have to click through an advertisement:

www.salon.com...

It is probably not very significant that there is a secession movement in Vermont (and elsewhere) for the purpose of this watch, but I think it is significant that Salon.com published this article. They must have felt it was timely.

Originally posted by infinite

Originally posted by nwo vs me
After this country gets torn apart and money is worth nothing then the E.U. (european union) will come in and finish us off or ask us if we would like to join there currency and then prepare for the end of the world.

How the hell would the EU finish off America? secondly how can you join the currency when your not even a European state??

really, enlighten me on this on....

They might wanna finish us off because well be greatly out numbered with more nations joining as years pass and there future prospects are in the middle east. Saddam was swicthing his reserves to the euro he just didnt have enough time. lol.
The euro dollar is going to become the worlds currency, doesnt matter if your european or not as for now yes they prefer only european countries to join but what makes you think once they have enough people with them that they wont push it one step futher or what makes you think that if our money here in the usa isnt worth jack that we wont have a choice but to use there currency look at projections for the end of 2005 its looking at around $1.50 for one euro

Originally posted by Alexodin
Centurion 1211
I was not aware that defending freedom and liberty at home from creeping fascism was a partisan exercise.

As to gun ownership, perhaps you’ve never been to Vermont. There is currently a movement in Vermont led by Thomas Naylor to secede from the union.

..... This is a call for nonviolent revolt against the world's global superpower by 608,000 people," he says. "What will the superpower do? Will it burn off the sugar maple trees? Will it destroy all the black-and-white Holstein cows? Just imagine trying to enslave independent-minded Vermonters."

Delightful. Thanks for the heads up and the link.


.

The electoral divide? Not nearly enough passion on that divide to cause revolt. And the 1 million women's march did make headlines. I was aware of it anyway because I live just outside of DC and I noticced "1 MILLION WOMEN" crowding the commuter train! But it wasn't a "protest" AGAINST anything. It was a show of support FOR women's issues. These women weren't PROTESTING women's rights! Protests in this country are never that large. And another argument against civil war in this country is that Americans are generally to lazy to get up and fight. I mean, more than half of the people who live in my city (baltimore) are to lazy to get up and go to work!

Alpha and Omega: Remember these words.
Worry too much as the paranoia consumes those who fear what if. Phrophecies will be full filled and we can not keep it from coming. Lose your faith, you lose everything you stand for of true faith, unless you did not have one in the first place. There is no time to worry about things to come, ifs, or what sources who creat panic and let the public run with it.

I think they are already prepared for the Civil War

Watch out Americans

www.detailshere.com...

I guess Titor might have been for real after all

Remind me to stay away from Jacksonville was it ????

I hope for America's sake that list isn't real

I think that Civil War is a bad idea. I think it would destroy the country and tear it apart. I think a study needs to be done about "suggestion". I think that John Titor's suggestions are becoming reality for some. I have a really bad feeling about this.

Originally posted by Blueangel7
I think that Civil War is a bad idea. I think it would destroy the country and tear it apart. I think a study needs to be done about "suggestion". I think that John Titor's suggestions are becoming reality for some. I have a really bad feeling about this.

firstly, John Titor was debunked, the pictures on here were debunked by a group of us. Secondly, the person who pretend to be a time traveller was using theories that have been around for years. I remember here about another Civil War back in 1998. Titor didnt travel back in time...sorry

Seeings America is a declining superpower, it might start to tear itself apart in the next few years.

(note:typo)

[edit on 27-1-2005 by infinite]

America is already being torn apart. we have a second term pres that, on the first election lost the popular vote, among other...things, and on his second term he was GIVEN 51% of the popular vote. Americans are putting up with the march of democracy through force around the world...they are putting up with it for now that is. how much longer will those that oppose the imperialistic leanings of AMERIKA stay silent. I'm talking about politicians here. there are some that would like to speak out but they are worried about being re-elected or corporate contracts in thier state, or DOD contracts in thier state. Where are the politicians that are for the people???

it is your elected officials that are leading America to AMERIKA...and leading to the future internal conflict in America. the sheeples do have a hand in this also..through thier ignorence, an ignorance that is known to them, an ignorance that his used as an excuse to do nothing, an ignorance that is used against them. How can this series of actions or inactions lead to anything other than conflict?

Originally posted by centurion1211
I disagree on the likelihood of a U.S. civil war and here's why:

The people generally opposed to the current administration don't own guns and are so afraid of them that they can't imagine ever owning a gun.

The people generally in favor of the current administration do own guns.

VERY presumptious. i would agree that those in favour of the current adminisration are ill informed and ignorant of the hippocracy being visited on the american sensibility.
i would also say i've seen more than a few libertarians here, who USED to be republicans, until the republican party became the corporate big brother party. these people are patriots who will try and fight the hostile takeover of america by these fascist neo-nazi empire builders.
even liberals keep guns for self defense. there's no shortage of guns for a civil war. ammo might be a problem in a prolonged conflict.

however, it's probably not going to happen for a different reason. people are kept confused as to what the truth is. if you don't know what it is, how can you fight for it?

Originally posted by centurion1211

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
I am more or less convinced now that there will be a US civil war this year as a direct result of the Iran war and possible draft. I predict that there will be a major rebellion by the people leading to several events of police brutality by the state.

I disagree on the likelihood of a U.S. civil war and here's why:

The people generally opposed to the current administration don't own guns and are so afraid of them that they can't imagine ever owning a gun.

The people generally in favor of the current administration do own guns.

When the police are attacking civilians, people are going to be too pissed off for thinking about wether they are strong enough to fight. Anger shuts down the logical mind.

I also think a lot, a lot more people will be opposed to this war. Hence, the police brutality to quell the movement.

[edit on 27-1-2005 by Indigo_Child]

if you haven't noticed, the populace at large seems to have forgotten by now that there was an election three months ago... people aren't even protesting any more, much less getting their guns out.

There's not going to be a war. That's really all there is to it.

Originally posted by Odd
if you haven't noticed, the populace at large seems to have forgotten by now that there was an election three months ago... people aren't even protesting any more, much less getting their guns out.

There's not going to be a war. That's really all there is to it.

I kind of agree with you there Odd. I have found Titor's predictions impressive on the level of their unprovability but I think now we can put John Titor to bed.

Unless you want to go down the "slightly different reality" route in which case you can be making up an alternative history or building castles in the sky for the rest of your life.

Titor was always going to face his biggest test as concrete events made themselves clear. They have and he';s got it wrong and it's been shown to be a clever hoax worthy only because it represents an interesting part of internet history.

however, it's probably not going to happen for a different reason. people are kept confused as to what the truth is. if you don't know what it is, how can you fight for it?

they are too busy watching fear factor to acknowledge the dibauchery. indeed a sad state.



[edit on 30-1-2005 by sturod84]

Originally posted by John bull 1

Originally posted by Odd
if you haven't noticed, the populace at large seems to have forgotten by now that there was an election three months ago... people aren't even protesting any more, much less getting their guns out.

There's not going to be a war. That's really all there is to it.

I kind of agree with you there Odd. I have found Titor's predictions impressive on the level of their unprovability but I think now we can put John Titor to bed.

Unless you want to go down the "slightly different reality" route in which case you can be making up an alternative history or building castles in the sky for the rest of your life.

Titor was always going to face his biggest test as concrete events made themselves clear. They have and he';s got it wrong and it's been shown to be a clever hoax worthy only because it represents an interesting part of internet history.

Are you kidding me, from what I am hearing the nation is very divided and there is quite a bit of unrest, as one can see at the protests at Bush inaugural ceremony. Just, because they are not ransaking the streets or there are not battalions of police forces and tanks about, does not mean there isn't "unrest" Titor said it would begin in 2005, there is still about 90% of the year left.

Odd, the unrest and division from the elections would just be the first blow. The second blow is the war on Iran and the third, a draft. You can mark my words if you want.

America is much divide at the moment, its going to be an interesting year or two, but im not sure if Civil war will result in it. Im looking around on google at the moment to see if i can find any interesting articles.

I doubt a civil war will take place. They already want a war with Iran and Syria. Acivil war will be too much.

Originally posted by cavscout

I really think it is harder for those on the east coast and for those in the large west coast cities to understand. Although, most who are talking about a civil war here seem to hail from the left, the guys who have been talking about for years, even training for it in many cases, are from the extreme right.

[edit on 4-11-2004 by cavscout]

i could not have said it better myself. most people who have actulally trained for a civil war are on the far right. if there ever was a civil war between people on the far left and right, i think the right would win. right-wingers have the weapons they need to get the job done and from most of my dealings with the left, most lefties have never even seen a real firearm, much less fire one. (hmmmmmmmmm, could this be why lefties like hillary clinton, ted kennedy, diane finestien, and chuck shumer be pushing for more gun control laws, mabey even an outright ban)?

i dont know if a civil war will come, but if it does, there will be nothing we can do about it. there is no way the civilian population will be able to defeat the U.S. Military. and when the civil war breaks out, other countries will see it as a prime opportunity to attack the U.S. we would have caused a World War 3. when another country attacks us, we will attack them, then that country will get their allies to help them fight, and when their allies jump in, the United States' allies will jump in. theres World War 3. and that just might be the end of the world. if anyone has any questions or comments, feel free to U2U me.