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Originally posted by Harte
Originally posted by rayuki
Originally posted by smyleegrl
Greetings, ATS!
Let me start with a caveat. This post is pure speculation. I have no sources, no quotes, no videos or links to support my theory. In fact, I hesitate to call this a "theory," because that would imply some scientific validity and I have none to offer.
you lost me after that part, great thread....
there is so much stuff you could have quoted, linked to, called "evidence" and you couldn't even be bothered to manage that? lol
The capability of calling some claim "evidence" does make that claim worthy of the statement.
Smyleegrl appears to be above such nonsense, and is only speculating and wondering here. I certainly applaud her for not mentioning the sort of flapdoodle you're talking about.
Everything mentioned in this thread so far has been beaten to death in the past here at ATS. There exists no evidence whatsoever for any such ancient advanced civilization. There is no claim that has not been either soundly refuted, exposed as fraud, or shown to be spurious due to there being no evidence for the claim.
For example, the "bell in coal," and any other object supposedly found in coal. There's no coal on these objects. There's no object somewhere embedded in coal. Even the people that submit this claim, if they know anything at all about the subject, tell the story of how the finder cleaned the coal off the object.
IOW, there are objects.
There are claims that the objects were found embedded in coal.
The objects are no longer embedded in coal.
There is no official report of the object having been examined while embedded in coal.
There's no coal on the object.
So, why should we believe it was embedded in coal? Because somebody said so?
Some time back, I read (and linked here) an old newspaper report that the local turnips that year wear growing so well that the U.S. Army had established a military school and bunkhouse inside of a hollowed out turnip in a farmer's field.
You like turnips?
Harte
Originally posted by GargIndia
reply to post by Harte
The Muslim invaders burnt down great library at Taxshila.
India had a federal structure during Vedic time. There were several kingdoms ruled by 'Raja'. The most dominant kingdom had authority over these kingdoms, and its king was called a 'Maha Raja'. 'Chakravarti Raja' is a title reserved for the king of entire Earth.
Originally posted by ABeing
I hadn't considered how intelligent, whatever intelligence truly is, Erectus and Australopithecus could have been.
While we are still on the topic of brains; the cone head-skulls found around the Andean area are rather interesting too. The majority of the skulls have been proven to have been subject to head-wrapping and other methods used to elongate the skull, but some, at least according to some researchers, are claimed to be completely natural in their shape.
If they indeed were a now extinct race of the Hominidae family, with such a large brain cavity, could it be possible that they also had greater brain volume than we have, and perhaps, even more efficient "wiring"?
Stretching it a bit here but, what if the next step in terms of evolution is actually a conscious one and we actually would develop "psychic" abilities thanks to our greater natural understanding of physics? Possible?
What if; our current theory regarding the origins of civilization is not correct, and perhaps, evidence suggesting otherwise is being "swept under the rug" or ignored because of the implications such a discovery would have on the population's paradigm and the current scientific establishment?
We all know the legends of the ancients. About the gods who descended from the heavens and taught Mankind about the sciences of the Universe. Perhaps, there is some truth to these claims?
let us imagine that life originated out of a primordial soup in another part of the galaxy ... and that the Earth was "seeded" in accordance to the panspermian theory ... with the same basic DNA structure as in other parts of the Universe and an another race of "humans" ... develop[ed] ...intergalactic travel...[and]... then focused on trying to find the original source of life... is it possible that they could have found Earth and our ancestors, still struggling to establish an organized society because we hadn't stumbled upon such ideas yet, and decided that they would give us a little push forward?
Originally posted by Blue Shift
The way I look at it, you can't have an "advanced" civilization unless you have the ability to manufacture lots of little high quality screws. I don't think we're advanced because we can build atomic bombs or particle accelerators. It's because we have the ability to manufacture lots of consistently high quality screws of various sizes that hold the planes and missiles and buildings together where the atom bombs or Mars rovers are made.
Yeah, you might be able to find somebody like the Unabomber who was able to make his own screws so they couldn't be traced. But if you're going to have any kind of chance of creating any technologically advanced machines and maintaining them, you're gonna need screws and lots of them, and when you dig in archeological pits, there are going to be plenty of them lying around all over the place.
Originally posted by GargIndia
reply to post by Harte
The name of the country was 'Bharat' during 'Mahabharat war'. The name of the country was 'Aryavarta' during Ramayan time. The country 'Bharat' was fairly large - it comprised of most of the area of modern day India, Bangladesh, Pakistan, Afghanistan and Iran.
Originally posted by ABeing
While we are still on the topic of brains; the cone head-skulls found around the Andean area are rather interesting too. The majority of the skulls have been proven to have been subject to head-wrapping and other methods used to elongate the skull, but some, at least according to some researchers, are claimed to be completely natural in their shape.
Originally posted by Byrd
I think the ones that they are calling "natural" are those like the Egyptian Ahkenaten (whose skull is unusually long but still within human norms.)
If they indeed were a now extinct race of the Hominidae family, with such a large brain cavity, could it be possible that they also had greater brain volume than we have, and perhaps, even more efficient "wiring"?
More efficient... is hard to assess. Larger, no. Not based on the fossils we have.
What if; our current theory regarding the origins of civilization is not correct, and perhaps, evidence suggesting otherwise is being "swept under the rug" or ignored because of the implications such a discovery would have on the population's paradigm and the current scientific establishment?
It wouldn't have any impact on the scientific establishment or on governments if we found out that 20,000 years ago there was a large group of people organized into a commune. Or empire. Or anything. It'd change history and science books, but those change with every new discovery (since science and history aren't religions... they're supposed to update with new discoveries.
We all know the legends of the ancients. About the gods who descended from the heavens and taught Mankind about the sciences of the Universe. Perhaps, there is some truth to these claims?
Actually, you're "kit bashing" a bunch of mythologies from various times and cultures there. Most of the times, the gods don't teach people anything (people just 'know.') For instance, you get Thoth who originally is a Moon god, changing into the Divine Teacher later in the mythos and then you get the Greeks adopting him as the Divine Teacher of Everything... while the Romans (still later) ignore Egyptian thought and have Prometheus bringing fire and various gods teaching different things. Babylonian deities simply made humans as laborers and no divine teacher was assigned. (etc)
There is no period where one group takes an unimaginable leap forward in technology and then dominates the world.
Originally posted by ABeing
I am sure that the ancient Egyptians, Greeks, Romans and Babylonians revered the celestial bodies and the natural elements as gods, but then we have cases such as that of Quetzalcoatl, who is often depicted as a man and Native American tribes whose legends speak of “star people/brothers” who visited them in the past.
Originally posted by ABeing
The Incas, for example, state that they did in fact not themselves construct ancient cities such as Puma Punku or Machu Piccu, but that the “gods” did it, and the Incan forefathers assisted them.
Now, that does not prove that the gods were extra-terrestrials, but, it does indicate that the ancient Incas were not attempting to fabricate a myth just to provoke the imagination of those their history was being told to, but that there actually were some truth behind it.
Originally posted by ABeing
And it is not hard to imagine, that something out of the ordinary at least, took place, since Puma Punku and Machu Piccu definitely are some of the most mysterious sites on the face of the Earth that are still intact since ancient times and contain some of the largest megaliths ever found.
Originally posted by Harte
Also, Puma Punku was not built by the Incas, as it predates them. Hence, they told the Spanish that they did not build it.
The Incas, for example, state that they did in fact not themselves construct ancient cities such as Puma Punku or Machu Piccu, but that the “gods” did it, and the Incan forefathers assisted them.
Originally posted by ABeing
Regarding the Incas and the conquistadores, I see your point. The Inca people did tell this story to the Spanish invaders and have continued to tell the same story to whoever asks.
If the Inca actually constructed Maccu Piccu themselves and you know this for a fact; please explain how they moved the giants stone blocks along the mountain side.
Originally posted by ABeing
Originally posted by Harte
Also, Puma Punku was not built by the Incas, as it predates them. Hence, they told the Spanish that they did not build it.
The Incas, for example, state that they did in fact not themselves construct ancient cities such as Puma Punku or Machu Piccu, but that the “gods” did it, and the Incan forefathers assisted them.
Yes, Puma Punku predates the Inca people, whose forefathers referred to the site as "a place of the gods", which was built by the gods and inhabited by the gods.
The mere scale of the blocks and construction of Puma Punku is evidence enough for me to believe that when the ancient people, whose tales the Inca elders still tell, described a group of people, wherever they originated from, which were evidently more advanced, sophisticated and intelligent than the Inca forefathers themselves and thus were regarded as gods, or divine beings; the Inca predecessors actually tried to explain something completely natural. Although, rather extraordinary in nature.
Originally posted by LABTECH767
reply to post by Byrd
That said there are growing indication's that modern humans may be far older than previously thought
and there have a great number of things that in any other science would have thrown the standard model of human evolution into doubt or suggest rapid leaps with equally rapid reversal's in at least the social evolution of the human race,
there are as you know numerous story's of stone artifact's pushing the age of man back even further and at every level of human evolution they may have had there equivalent inventive geniuses
that does not mean by any means that earlier human types were actually any more stupid than the average human but that they lacked the tool's to communicate effectively.
...the world is replete with many mystery's such as the supposed white pyramid of china which if real and not destroyed by the cultural revolution may indicate a far older culture were china now stand's,
and though this is not anything more than proof of ancient large scale construction requiring the entire infrastructure to support the behemoth task of this construction it is also proof of an indifference at best or even a deliberate policy of silencing the past,
AS for the pyramid's on china there are many reasons the Chinese are afraid of the lost history that may be uncovered such as the legend of the sun god's whom built the pyramid's and founded that earlier culture whome had hair like the sun and eye's like the sky according to one YouTube video anyway.
...even if they did any self respecting archaeologist is not going to put his reputation on the line for a screw or nut and bolt but hallofthegods.org...
There is I believe evidence out there and another important point, though there is a lack of evidence (some does exist but only anecdotal or suggestive but none definitive) we may not be the first sentient or sapient race to have evolved on earth,.
Originally posted by ABeing
reply to post by Harte
I have never heard of any Native American tribe that describe what you mention, ants and coyotes, as star people.
Who knows what they symbolized originally.
If I am not mistaken; coyotes chatter to each other and it does almost sound like they are talking?
If the Inca actually constructed Maccu Piccu themselves and you know this for a fact; please explain how they moved the giants stone blocks along the mountain side.
The mere scale of the blocks and construction of Puma Punku is evidence enough for me to believe that when the ancient people, whose tales the Inca elders still tell, described a group of people, wherever they originated from, which were evidently more advanced, sophisticated and intelligent than the Inca forefathers themselves and thus were regarded as gods, or divine beings; the Inca predecessors actually tried to explain something completely natural. Although, rather extraordinary in nature.
Originally posted by Harte
Please provide an example, showing not only that the tales exist at all, but also that they are "still told."
Originally posted by ABeing
If the Inca actually constructed Maccu Piccu themselves and you know this for a fact; please explain how they moved the giants stone blocks along the mountain side.
Originally posted by Byrd
They used the stone of the mountain -- stones that were on-site.