3 good questions for christians/creationists

reply to post by micmerci

I don't push my agenda on anyone but I also do not back down when people attempt to present inconclusive evidence as fact.

Well then, my dear, you are like the rest of us who don't back down.
Inconclusive evidence is just that: inconclusive evidence.

reply to post by Nightaudit

Hehe, yeah driving is kind of my thing

Yeah. You and my dad.
I remember as a very little girl my mom, new brother, dad and myself being in the front seat of a now-classic Ford Thunderbird ('58?) hard-top convertible, and seeing the hard-top in the lawn as we pulled out of the driveway.....

Decades later, he bought another one (after doing a Ford Galaxy 500, a Datsun 240 Z - the first one in town - fire-engine red, etc. )
When he got the 1980s model new Thunderbird, he took me out driving it (ME driving it) to show me what it would do - and he said, "Step on it! Now jam on the breaks!"

His last car was a Mustang Turbo. He became unable to drive it after a few more years, but he let me take my kids out in it - my son was saying, "MOM! Tell him and Nan that this is what I want on the list (they were compiling a 'who-want's-what-when-we're-gone list)

Mom, sadly, sold it when he had become too ill to drive it.

But yeah, he LOVED cars, and automotive SPEED!!!!

EDIT: He taught me to drive in a 360. I think... also had practice and lessons in the VW Beetle that was my mom's car.
.....will have to image search to figure out which Datsun model he taught me in.
But yeah, my first car was a Datsun 1200 - built like a tuna can (tin of fish?).....
manual transmission, choke, and everything!

reply to post by wildtimes


Hehe, sounds like your dad would have been a guy I would have very much liked a LOT!

I love classic american muscle cars, and I really want to own one someday and build it up a little. They are very popular in sweden, but here in germany they are very rare. But I guess "speed freaks" are kind of the same all over the planet.

I remember my dad taking me out in a quite powerful car with me driving, and I was still a bit young a little nervous.

After about 5 minutes he turned to me and basically said:"Why are you driving like a pussy? Step on it, son!"

And sure as hell I did hehe. Good times!

PS: You just gotta love these old cars with the choke. They kinda felt more like a living thing to me, the way you have to treat them until they "come alive"

reply to post by Nightaudit


He was awesome. A pilot by the time he turned 22, had been in a very debilitating motorcycle crash when he was about 22ish.....
spent 18 months in traction and told the doctor who wanted to amputate his leg, "uh, NO YOU WILL NOT!" and got another opinion. (They didn't, despite the gangreen in his foot....but for the rest of his life he had to wear a built-up shoe on that side, and believe me, we were told to NEVER get on a motorcycle!)

After he was released from the hospital, he went through physical rehabilitation, and a couple of years later became a life-guard on the Beach at San Diego - swam FIVE MILES to get his 'job'!! They don't require that kind of fitness anymore....I visited there a few years ago, and got to talk to the current CEO at the life-guard tower.

He was awesome. Brilliant engineer....electrical, mechanical, etc. NOTHING he couldn't fix or do. It's hard to find guys like that anymore.

sorry about leaving, i was at work. I cant be on here all day when im there.

let me start off by saying that you guys make me out to be animal beater or something. on the contrary, i love animals.i live on a farm we grow everything in our garden, just to paint a picture of my lifestyle.. we got chickens, turkeys, dogs ,goats.. the works.. so before you go thinking im some industrialist animal hater, youre mistaken.

my point about animals is that they dont get judged by what they do because they dont have that special thing that humans have. (the soul part) the thing that says "that lady is beautiful, but i dont think forcing sex on her is a good idea" whereas a dog could really care less. they dont have that thing in the back of their head telling them whats right and whats wrong. thats God in my opinion. you can call it what you want but the evidence is clearly on our side. point out an animal that does this. rationalizes thought objectively? without that your a vessel. your no different than an animal. thats why when people act horrible they act more and more like animals. doing away with that filter..

c.s lewis has a lot of great ways of explaining things in layman's terms..

“My argument against God was that the universe seemed so cruel and unjust. But how had I got this idea of just and unjust? A man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line. What was I comparing this universe with when I called it unjust?” ― C.S. Lewis, Mere Christianity

people know right and wrong. their body tells them what is and isnt.

“A silly idea is current that good people do not know what temptation means. This is an obvious lie. Only those who try to resist temptation know how strong it is.. A man who gives in to temptation after five minutes simply does not know what it would have been like an hour later. That is why bad people, in one sense, know very little about badness. They have lived a sheltered life by always giving in.” ― C.S. Lewis, Mere Christianity

i think its funny people want to say that Jesus was "just some guy" & we have a timeline that goes by B.C. and A.D. like it was a turning point in mankind. i think c.s lewis says it best with.

C.S. Lewis “I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: I’m ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don’t accept his claim to be God. That is the one thing we must not say. A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic — on the level with the man who says he is a poached egg — or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God, or else a madman or something worse. You can shut him up for a fool, you can spit at him and kill him as a demon or you can fall at his feet and call him Lord and God, but let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about his being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to.”

so you can say what you want but im not going to change your mind. you have to try understanding it for yourself. its just your opposition to the whole subject keeping you from understanding. you use the word bigoted like im the one with the one sided view when its clearly you guys. its like a kid hating ice cream without even trying it because he just doesnt want to. hes the only one missing out. i can really care less... but some quotes to leave you with

“If you are a Christian you do not have to believe that all the other religions are simply wrong all through. If you are an atheist you do have to believe that the main point in all the religions of the whole world is simply one huge mistake.” ― C.S. Lewis, Mere Christianity

“If the whole universe has no meaning, we should never have found out that it has no meaning: just as, if there were no light in the universe and therefore no creatures with eyes, we should never know it was dark. Dark would be without meaning.”
― C.S. Lewis, Mere Christianity

‘If the solar system was brought about by an accidental collision, then the appearance of organic life on this planet was also an accident, and the whole evolution of Man was an accident too. If so, then all our present thoughts are mere accidents—the accidental by-product of the movement of atoms. And this holds for the thoughts of the materialists and astronomers as well as for anyone else’s. But if their thoughts—i.e. of materialism and astronomy—are merely accidental by-products, why should we believe them to be true? I see no reason for believing that one accident should be able to give me a correct account of all the other accidents. It’s like expecting that the accidental shape taken by the splash when you upset a milkjug should give you a correct account of how the jug was made and why it was upset.’

btw you two should exchange phone numbers or something.

reply to post by wildtimes


Sounds like you had the honor and pleasure of having an awesome father. From what I hear that is certainly not a given anymore.

You can and should be rightfully proud of his achievements. And you can be goddamn proud to call yourself his daughter

It is exceptional humans like that who make me believe in a greater sense of this all.

Let us raise our glasses in honour of your father. A racer, a father and a fighter.

reply to post by MikeHawke

let me start off by saying that you guys make me out to be animal beater or something. on the contrary, i love animals.

Okay, fair enough.
But you DON'T show that you 'love' or 'understand' animals.

And when you said, "where I come from they'd lock you up," it was a complete and utter turn-off.

I actually thought you wouldn't think twice about torturing an animal just for the 'fun of it.'

THEY ARE NOT "EMPTY VESSELS", and again....shame on you for saying they are!! That's just wrong on SO MANY levels!!!
But, good on you to come back and explain yourself.

reply to post by MikeHawke


Hehe, yes maybe. I don´t have the energy to debate you right now though. I´ll answer you tomorrow.

reply to post by Nightaudit


!!!!

i can answer the questions but they require you relinquish the grip you have on papal interpretation. pretty much everybody views the bible according to how the popes interpreted it, over 1000 years ago, before science or even archaeology. before the discovery of sumer. before comparative cultural studies. before translation of ancient language variants and on and on.

if you're willing to take an eraser and wipe off everything you knew about the bible, and start over, i'm willing to answer your questions.

reply to post by MikeHawke

Stick to your points and stop bashing other members, please.

You have again done nothing to validate your attitude about animals.

reply to post by MikeHawke


Ok, I still got enough in me to debate that, though.

You obviously haven´t had a lot of contact with animals yourself. I can´t convince you that there is more to that, especially a sense of right or wrong in animals, and you won´t convince me.

Believe you me though, dogs know EXACTLY what is right and what not, I am sure every pet owner can relate to that question.

In any case. This is such a fundamental difference of opinion, that we surely won´t be on the same page at the end of this.

So let us just agree to disagree.

reply to post by wildtimes


lol you dont even know me. want my moms phone number to see that im actually great with animals. i shouldnt even explain myself =. but better yet

reply to post by undo


If you are willing (or able) to use basic spelling and punctuation like a grown up, then I´ll think about answering you.

I am too buzzed at this point to argue on that level.

But all the best for you, Sir!

yea.. im animal hater of the year alright..

reply to post by MikeHawke


I am sure you are Mike, I am sure you are.

reply to post by Nightaudit


use your eyes to look at the pictures

reply to post by undo

i can answer the questions but they require you relinquish the grip you have on papal interpretation. pretty much everybody views the bible according to how the popes interpreted it, over 1000 years ago, before science or even archaeology. before the discovery of sumer. before comparative cultural studies. before translation of ancient language variants and on and on.

if you're willing to take an eraser and wipe off everything you knew about the bible, and start over, i'm willing to answer your questions.

Please. Go for it.

Be reminded, however, that I have not seen ANYONE on this thread claim or indicate a "grip" on 'papal interpretation.'

And furthermore, I have seen non-Catholic Christians decline into a mess of authoritarian dictatorship and obscenely repressive and oppressive stances and think it is right.

The new Pope seems to me like a good guy....with his head on straight.

reply to post by MikeHawke



To be honest, Mike, I couldn´t care less. Are you in those pics cuddling a dog or something?

What possible difference does that make to your statements you made earlier?