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Originally posted by greenfox86
reply to post by sacgamer25
a very true human insight into the natural world, love is probably one of those spiritual truths that can be proven by science, it is necessary and probably the best energy that can carry us into the future.
Originally posted by Nightaudit
I just wanted to get your take on a few points that always made me kind of doubt in the bible and it´s validity as THE holy book.
My intention here is not to step on anyone´s toes, but to try to understand how believers view certain things. Maybe I can learn something from you or at the very least I can understand your position better.
I would like to focus this thread on the following three points that kinda sum my doubts up.
1: If you were born in a non christian country with a different main religion, would you still somehow end up a christian?
2: How do you cope with the obviously wrong and horrible laws and statements in the bible? (How to treat your slaves and that it´s ok to beat them, women´s "right´s", that we have to stone people that wear two different fabrics and all that jazz). In other words, do you pick the nice points out of the bible and ignore the bad ones? Or do you accept everything in it?
3: I personally would detest the god who pulled that stunt with Abraham and Isaac. Or the god who completely wipes out whole ecosystems including innocent animals, just because he doesn´t like the ways of men. I wouldn´t WANT that to be true.
Those are the three big ones that made me leave church. I know that the religion you choose is mainly dependent on what country you grow up in and what your parents believe in. And as not believing in another god is one of the 10 commandments, that means that the majority of the worlds population will go to hell without even a chance.
The second one is obvious. Most christians cherry pick, and the ones that don´t are in the westboro baptist church. What I would like to know is how you justify the selection for yourself.
And lastly, I regard the christian god as a pretty selfish and ego driven deity. I am sorry to be so harsh, but who in his right mind would want to follow a god who does atrocious things like that?
That´s it I guess. I just wanted to get that out there and see what you guys think about it. Again, no disrespect to anyone, but things are there to be discussed.
Oh, and if you have any questions for me (I believe in god and know science to be correct as well) feel free to ask anything you want. That road has to go both ways of course.
Originally posted by undo
the god of the old testament is more than one god.
Originally posted by charles1952
1: I might if I read enough, or met the right people.
2: Two points. "Obviously" wrong and horrible? What is your source for judging that, contemporary customs? The Bible is a collection of books. Some are poetry, worship instructions, history, songs, visionary and prophetic literature, etc. I accept everything that's in it for what it is meant to be.
3: Fine with me if you want to say your judgment is better than God's. But you might want to read the conversation God had with Job at the end of Job.
Originally posted by OptimusSubprime
1: God doesn't care where you were born, and religion was created by men. Men are sinful and imperfect, and so is anything created by men. Anyone can become a Christian, regardless of where they were born, or what religion they were brought up in. Christianity is a lifestyle... it is a philosophy. It is not a religion.
2: I accept everything in the Bible, but I accept it in context. The horrible laws you mention were not the laws of God, they were the laws of men who thought, in their arrogance, they were acting on behalf of or in the name of God.
3: God was testing Abraham's faith. God created the Earth and all of the ecosystems, therefore God has the right to destroy it whenever he sees fit. You must realize that our physical existence here on this Earth is not important. What IS important is the eternal destiny of your soul. When you come to terms with that, what happens to you here on Earth will become inconsequential.
Originally posted by sacgamer25
reply to post by Nightaudit
Maybe God did create everything the good and the bad. In the bible God claims that he created everything good and bad.
Grace is Unconditional love, if you were born God loves you. Doesn't matter what you believe he loves you. Because the bible also says God is love.
Jesus came to prove that God is love, despite everything we see. The only way to prove this was to prove life after physical death. You see if death is the end, than it is not possible by our own understanding to reconcile that God is love. It is only when you accept that all you see is not all that is, that you can accept that even the bad things have served God's greater purpose for us.
You must deeply embrace the concept of life after physical death to accept that God indeed is love and has loved us from the beginning. This is probably one of the toughest things to have faith in.
edit on 18-4-2013 by sacgamer25 because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by Bleeeeep
reply to post by Nightaudit
1. Impossible to know.
2. & 3. It doesn't matter what we think, because he's the creator. As creator, he has the right to do whatever he pleases. Furthermore, we have no idea what is best for him, or us, so truly, we have no right to say anything...
You should read Job - just saying.
Originally posted by schadenfreude
1. If you lived in another country...yes. Why? It depends on the heart.
2. There are too many issues here at once (and I obviously can't answer them all) but lets take your first one;slavery.)
That person, who, if they're really "born again", has already in their heart laid their life down for Christ. They're dead already, to the things in this world, and working to save people from a literal hell, is paramount above all, including freedom. This slave could very well, by his life, example, etc, end up being a great witness to his "master" for his case for Christ, and ideally, end up seeing him "saved". (Which btw, is the great commission Jesus gave to ALL Christians, not just pastors or evangelists.
3. The stunt with Abraham, was prophetic. It was an archtype for what the Father would do to the Son. Isaac wasn't a "lil boy", Isaac was in his thirties, just like Christ. Furthermore Abraham had already had a promise from God that he would be "a great nation" THROUGH Isaac. Ishmael was not the chosen one, (despite arguments to the contrary by some religions), so Abraham knew he would be a "great nation" THROUGH Isaac. Point? God could EASILY resurrect Isaac from the dead, if He(God) reopened Sarah's wife's womb at the age of 90 something, raising the dead is no problem.
Originally posted by Y10H5W6H5
Whenever someone tells me they are an atheist, I think, what a dumbass, he thinks everything created itself out of nothing...what kind of illogical mind does this person have, how deep is the darkness in them...what cause them to become so broken and lost...well, the answer is that the creation itself testified to them of His Eternal Power and Glory, but their sorry asses preferred LIes
Atheist destroyed Matematically @ anhundredandfiftyandthree.blogspot.com