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Stephen Hawking lays out case for Big Bang without God

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posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 05:26 PM
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reply to post by Nuke2013
 


Yes but that still does not explain where the universe came from, how it started. And of course, subsequently if it was down to God, who created god? Its quite the head duck.


edit. Both arguements, the proGod and the noGod, are both as difficult to get ones head around.
edit on 18-4-2013 by thedoctorswife because: (no reason given)




posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 05:30 PM
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Originally posted by thedoctorswife
reply to post by Nuke2013
 


Yes but that still does not explain where the universe came from, how it started. And of course, subsequently if it was down to God, who created god? Its quite the head duck.


Do you know what God is since you can come up with the statement: Who created God?

God is a name. But what source carries the name? Do you know?



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 05:35 PM
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reply to post by spy66
 


I don't often reply in these forums -
Second line - in answer to your question - Fluctuations my friend fluctuations.



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 05:40 PM
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Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by thedoctorswife
reply to post by Nuke2013
 


Yes but that still does not explain where the universe came from, how it started. And of course, subsequently if it was down to God, who created god? Its quite the head duck.


Do you know what God is since you can come up with the statement: Who created God?

God is a name. But what source carries the name? Do you know?


Offcourse i dont.
Why are you asking me if I know what God is, based on my statement "who created God". For all I know GOd wasnt created, but im limited by the human belief of Linear time and the chicken and egg scenario, that i feel compelled to ask how it/he/whatever came into existance.



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 05:43 PM
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Originally posted by Global consciousness
reply to post by spy66
 


I don't often reply in these forums -
Second line - in answer to your question - Fluctuations my friend fluctuations.


There are no fluctuations in a absolute empty infinite space. That absolute empty void is absolute stationary, there is no time/motion. It is the absolute constant.

You should know that a constant doesn't change. A absolute constant will never change over time either.



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 05:49 PM
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Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by Global consciousness
reply to post by spy66
 


I don't often reply in these forums -
Second line - in answer to your question - Fluctuations my friend fluctuations.


There are no fluctuations in a absolute empty infinite space. That absolute empty void is absolute stationary, there is no time/motion. It is the absolute constant.

You should know that a constant doesn't change. A absolute constant will never change over time either.


Id like to understand more about his "fluctuations". How can nothing have fluctuations, what can cause it to change its state if nothing exists?



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 05:49 PM
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Originally posted by thedoctorswife

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by thedoctorswife
reply to post by Nuke2013
 


Yes but that still does not explain where the universe came from, how it started. And of course, subsequently if it was down to God, who created god? Its quite the head duck.


Do you know what God is since you can come up with the statement: Who created God?

God is a name. But what source carries the name? Do you know?


Offcourse i dont.
Why are you asking me if I know what God is, based on my statement "who created God". For all I know GOd wasnt created, but im limited by the human belief of Linear time and the chicken and egg scenario, that i feel compelled to ask how it/he/whatever came into existance.


In the Bible God said he always was and always is. That means God is infinite.

Initially God can only be one thing. And that is the absolute empty infinite space. The source to the existence of finite time.
edit on 27.06.08 by spy66 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 06:07 PM
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Originally posted by thedoctorswife

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by Global consciousness
reply to post by spy66
 


I don't often reply in these forums -
Second line - in answer to your question - Fluctuations my friend fluctuations.


There are no fluctuations in a absolute empty infinite space. That absolute empty void is absolute stationary, there is no time/motion. It is the absolute constant.

You should know that a constant doesn't change. A absolute constant will never change over time either.


Id like to understand more about his "fluctuations". How can nothing have fluctuations, what can cause it to change its state if nothing exists?


You are correct, a dimension that is absolute empty and infinite will not fluctuate. There are noting present within this void except the one empty infinite void it self. So there is nothing present to form a random fluctuation.

The infinite void is absolutely empty, and it exists as one single void free from other compressed finite.



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 06:18 PM
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Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by thedoctorswife

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by Global consciousness
reply to post by spy66
 


I don't often reply in these forums -
Second line - in answer to your question - Fluctuations my friend fluctuations.


There are no fluctuations in a absolute empty infinite space. That absolute empty void is absolute stationary, there is no time/motion. It is the absolute constant.

You should know that a constant doesn't change. A absolute constant will never change over time either.


Id like to understand more about his "fluctuations". How can nothing have fluctuations, what can cause it to change its state if nothing exists?


You are correct, a dimension that is absolute empty and infinite will not fluctuate. There are noting present within this void except the one empty infinite void it self. So there is nothing present to form a random fluctuation.

The infinite void is absolutely empty, and it exists as one single void free from other compressed finite.

So can we absolutely agree on one thing, (and this ofcourse is based on our known laws of physics), some"thing" could not have just appeared, without cause? How can this be possible, im not a physicist though.



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 06:28 PM
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Sorry if im not as "science minded" as many of you cleverbots on this thread, but what if, (and i provide ABSOLUTELY NO scientific evidence for this) God didnt need to be created, yes it goes against all the rules, but did he HAVE to be created? We're limited by our understanding of the laws of science and the universe, and chickens and eggs offcourse, cant forget them..

But what if he s always been here, and created big cycles of life and death forever, infinitly, maybe that is just his nature, literally.
Why cant it be just this?



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 06:32 PM
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reply to post by thedoctorswife
 



Sorry if im not as "science minded" as many of you cleverbots on this thread, but what if, (and i provide ABSOLUTELY NO scientific evidence for this) God didnt need to be created, yes it goes against all the rules, but did he HAVE to be created?


If you could provide any instance of anything coming into being without the aid of already-existing molecules from another source, I'm sure we would be willing to consider it. Otherwise, no.
edit on 18-4-2013 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 06:38 PM
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Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by thedoctorswife
 



Sorry if im not as "science minded" as many of you cleverbots on this thread, but what if, (and i provide ABSOLUTELY NO scientific evidence for this) God didnt need to be created, yes it goes against all the rules, but did he HAVE to be created?


If you could provide any instance of anything coming into being without the aid of already-existing molecules from another source, I'm sure we would be willing to consider it. Otherwise, no.
edit on 18-4-2013 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)


Mmn yeah, but as i said before, where did God come from and where did the universe come from are equally as puzzling, could Gods existance be the one-off? the only thing that didnt need to be created. Oh God my heads about to explode.


Why do i always get involved in these threads, i nearly always regret it.



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 06:57 PM
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Originally posted by thedoctorswife

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by thedoctorswife

Originally posted by spy66

Originally posted by Global consciousness
reply to post by spy66
 


I don't often reply in these forums -
Second line - in answer to your question - Fluctuations my friend fluctuations.


There are no fluctuations in a absolute empty infinite space. That absolute empty void is absolute stationary, there is no time/motion. It is the absolute constant.

You should know that a constant doesn't change. A absolute constant will never change over time either.


Id like to understand more about his "fluctuations". How can nothing have fluctuations, what can cause it to change its state if nothing exists?


You are correct, a dimension that is absolute empty and infinite will not fluctuate. There are noting present within this void except the one empty infinite void it self. So there is nothing present to form a random fluctuation.

The infinite void is absolutely empty, and it exists as one single void free from other compressed finite.

So can we absolutely agree on one thing, (and this ofcourse is based on our known laws of physics), some"thing" could not have just appeared, without cause? How can this be possible, im not a physicist though.


Correct. Nothing can be formed without a cause.

This is why the idea of a absolute empty infinite space becomes a problem for a lot of people.
A absolute empty infinite space is a absolute constant. And it presents a major scientific problem. This space can only change if it wants to. And that implies a factor people have a hard time excepting.

That is why people use wikipedia to argue that this space is not proven to exist scientifically. It is a argument used to ignore the fact that it does exist.

I am not saying that science is lying. But how do we know that they are telling us everything?
edit on 27.06.08 by spy66 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 07:34 PM
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Originally posted by thedoctorswife
 

Mmn yeah, but as i said before, where did God come from and where did the universe come from are equally as puzzling, could Gods existance be the one-off? the only thing that didnt need to be created. Oh God my heads about to explode.


Why do i always get involved in these threads, i nearly always regret it.


No regrets and it's always worth thinking about it ...


Perhaps we're not made to understand the concept of something that goes on indefinitely, without beginning and without ending (or will there be one?). In our world nothing seems to work without cause and effect (at least as far as I know, whereas some aspects of quantum mechanics seem to point in a different direction).

I sometimes compare this to beings living in a two-dimensional flat world. They could only move like in a maze drawn on a piece of paper. They wouldn't know what the third dimension (height) is. They could never see their world from above and the concept of a three-dimensional world would probably be inconceivable to them. They just might not be able to come up with a concept like that ...

I admit, that such thoughts belong to the realms of metaphysics, but so does the concept of God. It also fails to explain the situation we're in (at least in a way that we could logically understand it).

Perhaps science will one day provide the tools and models that help us to imagine a concept of a world that's independent of the laws of causality ... but I'm almost sure that even then, we would be confronted with a whole new set of intriguing questions!

Again no answers (sorry!), just some food for thought ...



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 07:41 PM
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Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Fromabove
 



It is easier to say that what is comes from God than to say that what is comes from nothing. No one knows where God came from. They can't even tell you where the universe comes from.


You mean it's easier to dismiss years of mind-numbing research at the hands of a genius with a simple, "he's talking nonsense because he's angry." Right. Okay.


Stephen may seem grateful for his one chance, but he sounds like so many angry people I've heard before. So like I said, he is obviously an angry person.


And now you know why we look to Professor Hawking for rational conclusions.









You don't have to have a PhD in theoretical science to know that my answer beats Stephen Hawking's. It's like a man who finds a car in the desert, and being a mechanic he can tell you that it works and you can drive it, and even what it's made of. But he can't tell you where it came from, who made the metal and where all the atoms were found that it consists of. To simply say there is no God and that everything exists because it simply does is dumb at best. Anyone having a sixth grade knowledge of science knows that to have something, something else had to put it there. The universe is a byproduct of something greater than itself. For me that's God. And my belief is better than simply saying everything is cause I say so cause I have a PhD.

He must be very upset.



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 07:50 PM
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reply to post by Fromabove
 


I understand where you're coming from with your post. What I see that you're saying is that you understand that there is most likely a god who is somehow involve with the creation of the universe. As an atheist I have a disbelief of a godlike being who is responsible for creation and everything in between. That is why I see science as the tool to help me understand anything. I lack a lot of scientific knowledge. However, I'm confident from what I do read is true. Just question everything.



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 07:55 PM
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Originally posted by Phoenix267
reply to post by Fromabove
 


I understand where you're coming from with your post. What I see that you're saying is that you understand that there is most likely a god who is somehow involve with the creation of the universe. As an atheist I have a disbelief of a godlike being who is responsible for creation and everything in between. That is why I see science as the tool to help me understand anything. I lack a lot of scientific knowledge. However, I'm confident from what I do read is true. Just question everything.



Having once been an atheist I want to say that you don't sound like a die hard atheist. You seem to be a person who would just simply rather know the truth, whatever that truth is. And right now science is doing that job for you. If mankind has enough time, it could be that science one day reaches the point of finding God. But given the world as it is we'll probably nuke the planet before that happens.



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 07:58 PM
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It is wild though because on the micro level certain collisions may in fact be generating energies not understood to be being made not created but made from Existing proton materials etc. And so WHY can this not as well go on on a MACRO Level... Stephen Hawking, 1 has followed his intellect since learning of he long ago and has respected he as a scientist and so as 1 who is not the Judge places no judgments on his beliefs. But again micro - macro experiments with energy hmm. Guess the difference is the on the MACRO WOULD know of those in the micro as opposed to some doing collider experiments in the micro-macro and not being aware of what's made Objectively.. in the further micro-dimension etc..

NAMASTE*******



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 08:04 PM
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reply to post by Fromabove
 


I don't know if there is a die hard type of atheist. Because I have a disbelief in god I chose to identify as an atheist. Makes more sense to me. Atheism basically means without theist. The reason I chose to identify as an atheist is because of the idea of believing in a godlike being made no sense. From racist, to immoral people, etc. Everyone's concept of God seem to reflect themselves. More than there really being a divine God who created the universe. Which is why you would see me commenting sometimes "the idea of god could mean anything within the limits of human imagination". You see where I'm coming from here. I also doubt there is truth out there. Other than the stander definition from the English dictionary. Hopefully you can see where I'm coming from here.



posted on Apr, 18 2013 @ 11:48 PM
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reply to post by Phoenix267
 


They call it the singularity no one has any idea what happened right before the big bang because the laws of physics just break down when ever they try to apply the math to understand it, in other words our tools of the time don't apply.





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