IRS claims it can read your e-mail without a warrant

As some of you may know, the 4th amendment right is based off of a reasonable expectation of privacy as determined by SCOTUS.

Well it seems the IRS thinks that it is unreasonable to think our emails are private, a cnet article states.

Newly disclosed documents prepared by IRS lawyers says that Americans enjoy "generally no privacy" in their e-mail, Facebook chats, Twitter direct messages, and similar online communications -- meaning that they can be perused without obtaining a search warrant signed by a judge.

IRS Claims it can read your email with out warrant.

The ACLU has taken um-bridge with this stance as it should.

Let's hope you never end up on the wrong end of an IRS criminal tax investigation. But if you do, you should be able to trust that the IRS will obey the Fourth Amendment when it seeks the contents of your private emails. Until now, that hasn't been the case. The IRS should let the American public know whether it obtains warrants across the board when accessing people's email. And even more important, the IRS should formally amend its policies to require its agents to obtain warrants when seeking the contents of emails, without regard to their age.

To me this highlights a greater concern, that being the bases of what Privacy means based of the SCOTUS ruling. Which is based solely on the public expectation of privacy. That in and of it self is not bad, what is bad is that the continuing assault on that expectation.

The longer we allow the government to infringe on our privacy based on "safety" concerns the weaker and weaker the 4th amendment becomes.

What happens when this generation of youth having grown up getting the freedom group from the TSA, and their expectation of privacy is nill, than we have lost our 4th amendment rights.

good luck reading mine

also I dont and never have paid taxes... good luck getting it from me, other then the taxes i cannot avoid like sales tax and whatnot

reply to post by dc4lifeskater


It is always wise to have PGP type programs at your disposal, I fell out of practice using it but I might just have to start looking at encryption methods again.

Well you all know that the IRS is in charge of implementing the new Obamacare mandate, right?

I guess I missed where the Constitution had an asterix next to the 4th amendment with a footnote exempting the IRS. I'm sure they'll show us all where we missed that, right?

Some agencies are getting FAR too big for their britches.

It's sad, but American freedom is burning away like a short candle in the wind of socialism. The two party system is corrupt, and the judicial system is not far behind. Our electronic media/communication is monitored, our Constitution is evaporating, and our rights are being whittled away. Soon, very soon, I'm afraid that even forums like this will be shut down, or it's outspoken members will be bridled.
SnF

Originally posted by benrl
reply to post by dc4lifeskater

 

It is always wise to have PGP type programs at your disposal, I fell out of practice using it but I might just have to start looking at encryption methods again.

The only encryption program that the alphabet agency failed to crack was an Eastern Block program that was written about 20 years ago. It is now illegal to use.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
I guess I missed where the Constitution had an asterix next to the 4th amendment with a footnote exempting the IRS. I'm sure they'll show us all where we missed that, right?

Some agencies are getting FAR too big for their britches.

The sad part is that its not just for the IRS, Reasonable expectation of privacy by the public is a fairly large loop hole for any government agency.

The fact that they can base the protection on something that changes as time goes on, especially something as fickle and easily manipulated as public opinion is astounding.

reply to post by benrl


Interesting . .. .

Not surprising in the least. They can actually see it all. Not just email, but everywhere you have been in the web. It is ALL recorded in logs.

Weather anyone cares to admit it or not, the Homeland Security, the FBI, CIA, and many other government entities we have probably never heard of ALSO has the ability to take what they want just like this.

Just goes to show you, .. . . The IRS really is a bunch of nice guys. At least they are good enough to tell us about it.

On a little more serious note, I honestly do not believe that the current situation in OUR country is going to improve without some sort of Divine Intervention or Action from "WE THE PEOPLE".

Though it is a Big Damn Unfortunate, we will just have to tolerate it until "WE THE PEOPLE" can act as a Collective and return OUR government to what it once was.

...but they cant go after illegal aliens who commit tax fraud of over $5 billion a year.

..figures.

worthless.

Originally posted by Common Good
...but they cant go after illegal aliens who commit tax fraud of over $5 billion a year.

..figures.

worthless.

...

Or some of the largest corporations in the country that pay Zero in tax liability.

1) Exxon Mobil made $19 billion in profits in 2009. Exxon not only paid no federal income taxes, it actually received a $156 million rebate from the IRS, according to its SEC filings.

2) Bank of America received a $1.9 billion tax refund from the IRS last year, although it made $4.4 billion in profits and received a bailout from the Federal Reserve and the Treasury Department of nearly $1 trillion.

3) Over the past five years, while General Electric made $26 billion in profits in the United States, it received a $4.1 billion refund from the IRS.

4) Chevron received a $19 million refund from the IRS last year after it made $10 billion in profits in 2009.

5) Boeing, which received a $30 billion contract from the Pentagon to build 179 airborne tankers, got a $124 million refund from the IRS last year.

6) Valero Energy, the 25th largest company in America with $68 billion in sales last year received a $157 million tax refund check from the IRS

7) Goldman Sachs in 2008 only paid 1.1 percent of its income in taxes even though it earned a profit of $2.3 billion and received an almost $800 billion from the Federal Reserve and U.S. Treasury Department.

8) Citigroup last year made more than $4 billion in profits but paid no federal income taxes.

9) ConocoPhillips, the fifth largest oil company in the United States, made $16 billion in profits.

Companies that dwarf anything "illegals" cause... but priorities I guess.

reply to post by benrl

I'm a little torn on this one. If you click on the source you'll notice that the case being discussed is U.S. v. Warshak. The article makes the same statement (basically) that the OP does:

As some of you may know, the 4th amendment right is based off of a reasonable expectation of privacy as determined by SCOTUS.

I agree, but the 6th Circuit noted that not every search violating the 4th results in barring the evidence from being used. I like reading legal stuff, but I assume you don't so I'll risk oversimplifying to save space. (These are quotes from the 2010 Warshak decision.)

Thus, government agents violated his Fourth Amendment rights by compelling NuVox to turn over the emails without first obtaining a warrant based on probable cause. However, because the agents relied in good faith on provisions of the Stored Communications Act, the exclusionary rule does not apply in this instance.

The Stored Communications Act (“SCA”), “permits a ‘governmental entity’ to compel a service provider to disclose the contents of [electronic] communications in certain circumstances.”

The compelled-disclosure provisions give different levels of privacy protection based on whether the e-mail is held with an electronic communication service or a remote computing service and based on how long the e-mail has been in electronic storage. The government may obtain the contents of e-mails that are “in electronic storage” with an electronic communication service for 180 days or less “only pursuant to a warrant.” The government has three options for obtaining communications stored with a remote computing service and communications that have been in electronic storage with an electronic service provider for more than 180 days: (1) obtain a warrant; (2) use an administrative subpoena; or (3) obtain a court order.

In addition, we note that the Fourth Amendment violation was likely harmless.

Hey, I read this stuff so that you don't have to. Send me my cookies. (Oh, I'm torn based on some of their other holdings.)

reply to post by charles1952


I will say that, in a certain context, this all seems perfectly reasonable and harmless--almost benevolent. And then I look at it again and say: "WTF? The Founders would be so appalled they'd puke at this constant creeping 'lawyering' away at our rights."

It's absolutely emblematic of the incremental police-state tyranny being put in place before our eyes and under our very feet. It's criminal--it's worse than criminal--and I can only hope against all realistic hope that we can stop it before it's too late....

reply to post by benrl


Haven't you heard? The CFO of Facebook, Sheryl Sandberg, wants to make the world a better, more open and connected place.

reply to post by Violater1
Oh but that's a good thing. If sites like these shut down that means we'll have real opportunity to get off our asses and stop the governments from combining themselves instead of regurgitating what we hear essentially allowing all kinds of chaos to happen.

Originally posted by Meaningless
reply to post by Violater1

 

Oh but that's a good thing. If sites like these shut down that means we'll have real opportunity to get off our asses and stop the governments from combining themselves instead of regurgitating what we hear essentially allowing all kinds of chaos to happen.

I'm not getting you at all here. So... basically... you're saying you think ATS being shut down would be a good thing? There are sites on the net I'd expect to see such a sentiment voiced....but actually FROM here, isn't among them? I must have totally misunderstood your first sentence. Surly you didn't really mean how that appeared.

1) Exxon Mobil made $19 billion in profits in 2009. Exxon not only paid no federal income taxes, it actually received a $156 million rebate from the IRS, according to its SEC filings.

2) Bank of America received a $1.9 billion tax refund from the IRS last year, although it made $4.4 billion in profits and received a bailout from the Federal Reserve and the Treasury Department of nearly $1 trillion.

3) Over the past five years, while General Electric made $26 billion in profits in the United States, it received a $4.1 billion refund from the IRS.

4) Chevron received a $19 million refund from the IRS last year after it made $10 billion in profits in 2009.

5) Boeing, which received a $30 billion contract from the Pentagon to build 179 airborne tankers, got a $124 million refund from the IRS last year.

6) Valero Energy, the 25th largest company in America with $68 billion in sales last year received a $157 million tax refund check from the IRS

7) Goldman Sachs in 2008 only paid 1.1 percent of its income in taxes even though it earned a profit of $2.3 billion and received an almost $800 billion from the Federal Reserve and U.S. Treasury Department.

8) Citigroup last year made more than $4 billion in profits but paid no federal income taxes.

9) ConocoPhillips, the fifth largest oil company in the United States, made $16 billion in profits.

I don't think you understand.

THOSE CORPORATIONS ARE THE GOVERNMENT.

Not just the U.S. Government, but the Global Government.

If the IRS wants to read my E-mail, can they throw it out when they are done? All I got is junk mail usually, I don't even open ninety nine percent of it. I do get a few jokes from friends so they can save those ones if they like.

I wanted to bump this thread giving after the previous on-going irs scandal...