What is love?

You wanted to make it more complicated, and you wanted to dive into the details.

Since you seek that path, I am willing to walk with you down that way.

Wherever your feet go, there is your love.

Whatever your hands touch, there is your love.

Whatever you lay your eyes upon, there is your love.

Whatever you choose, there is your love.

Whatever you think, there is your love.

Whatever you say, there is your love.

All things pertaining to you, every aspect of your life. All things are counted. Wherever your attention lies, there is a tally.

In 1 Corinthians 13, we learn that love is first pure; and then it is peaceable, gentle, kind, long-suffering.

Why is love first pure?

Have you not seen how the world hates those whose focus is upon God? Have you not seen how sometimes the enemy hates you even more because you showed love to them? Have you not read about the chaos that took place surrounding Jesus and the apostles and the disciples? And how they forsook their families, and left all things, to go serve? Have you not read how they loved sinners and healed them, but their friends and fellow Christians they reprimanded, scolded, and reamed out, because their testimony did not match their actions or their doctrines? Have you not read that at the last day, God will destroy heaven, earth, and all the wicked, and there will be a new heaven and a new earth?

God is love. We are made in the image of God. Therefore, we are the embodiment of love. Jesus Christ was the perfect embodiment of that love; for He was not just fashioned in the image of God, like us, but He possessed the perfect Spirit of God. Therefore, He was the embodiment of love, and also the source of love, love itself.

And so then, if we learn what love is, then we learn what God is.

If we learn what God is, we learn what love is.

Since Jesus is that perfect manifestation for us to witness, then we look to Jesus to understand who God is. And therefore what love is.

And as I have already told you, Jesus made it clear that love is where your attention is.

I have already covered what attention is. Whatever you do, say, or think, that is what you love.

So, if God is all powerful, all knowing, and ever-present, therefore His works are eternal and everywhere, His sayings are eternal and everywhere, and His thoughts are eternal and everywhere. Therefore He is outside and inside of this universe. It is created by Him, and within Him. And because the universe encompasses all His work, His thoughts, His sayings, therefore, that is where His focus is. Now if His attention is upon the whole universe, and all things in it, and all the living, then therefore, God loves all. If God created all things, therefore He loved and loves all things.

Therefore, God is love.

Therefore, the amount of attention we offer is representative of the love within us.

Now many words have been said to simply lead back to the simple point.

Love is wherever your desire is. For wherever your desire is, there will you also be.

So if you are good, you will love the eternal God, for there you will be. And you will love your neighbors and your enemies, for they are who you are, and you love yourself, because you cannot help but have attention for yourself. So then if you love the eternal God, and you love your neighbors and your enemies, you will cause them to make a choice; love God or hate God. And the choice is the same as this - to be or not to be.

Shakespeare said it himself.

That is indeed the question.

reply to post by TarzanBeta

When Jesus said to love your enemy, He didn't say that it would be easy, or that you would feel like doing it at first. But to desire to do whatever you can for your enemy, as if they were your family, is what you need to develop. Desire is something that you can choose. Whatever you change your heart, mind, and soul to focus upon, that is where the attention will be.

Love is a matter of attention, simply put.

Wherever your attention is, that is where your heart, mind, and soul are. That is where the love is.

Yes, the first of what you say here, is exactly what I meant by speaking of Jesus telling us to love our enemy. Perhaps I did not make that clear enough. It was my whole point.
As far as it being a matter of attention: I could not disagree more. This is only a factor. Unless you are using the word and concept of attention as the same thing as consciousness, but I think consciousness is more than just attention. But no need to split hairs, and I am certainly not trying to argue with you.

Since love encompasses a variety of emotions, love itself is not an emotion. Therefore, love is our focus. And however our focus treats us will define how we emotionally respond.

Perhaps the secret here is we experience it differently as individuals, for I do not see it that way. No matter my focus of the moment, which may be varied and split between several different subject matters at the same time, my love for someone is still there, all encompassing, and more one true feeling, I find, than any other I have ever experienced. And speaking of unconditional love, this is more true than anything, for it matters not what that person does at that moment, it means I still love them, no matter my focus on living in that moment.

So once again, the true question is, "What is desire?"

You say that when one has all that they need, they no longer have desire.

I absolutely did not say that. And if you interpreted what I wrote this way, I apologize, for it was not at all what I meant. Desire is a physical or emotional want, craving, drive. And to me, it implies in its satisfaction a more physical, sensory reward. Love encompasses that, but also goes beyond it, as it is only a part at a specific time in a certain type of love.
What I said was when all needs are met (in Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs--are you familiar with that level by level hierarchy of human needs in a specific order, as one need it met, another of a different level then manifests, and is met, and at the top is self actualization: in other words, the freedom from need so that a human being is free to become their and actualize their fullest potential of the embodiment of who they are in every way) so, when all those needs are met, and self actualization occurs and you are truly every bit of potential of who you are, then desire becomes a something else entirelly, and more true and authentic than ever.....for there is no need attached to drive a connection with another. This is very important, I believe. I hope I am writing it well enough to communicate to you what I am trying to say, for the way you interpreted what I wrote is directly opposite to what I was trying to say.

Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by TarzanBeta

 

Are you sure you are reading my post right? Love can be transmitted through the air or by touch. Sex is different than love. It is all about balancing energy and frequency of our bodies. Science will deny this. Medicine will deny that some people can give or take energy from others. I understand how it works. If you give someone energy, it is only temporary. If you balance their energy it is only temporary and reinforcement is needed. Fixing the problem is more complex, I'm working on that.

Auras exist, this is the bleeding of energy from the body. Is a bright aura good or bad? If you have excess energy it is good to get rid of it if you can not adequately and safely store it.

I agree with quite a bit of what you are saying; however, this thing about auras being the bleeding of energy from your body, I don't quite agree with. I see that more as an emmanation of your total energy, sort of like the electromagnetic field that surrounds every living thing. Your body interacts with that field, also, although scientifically there is quite a bit of disagreement whether that field affects your body, or vice versa.

But I do not mean to get off topic here. Just a little side note.

Originally posted by TarzanBeta
reply to post by NorEaster

 

So many words for the simple impetus don't you think?

All of these have love in common do they not? Why make it so complicated?

Love is simply this - whatever is the focus of your desire, that is what you love.

So then the real question you should be asking is, "What is desire?"

Well, why do you want? Why do you care about anything at all? What's the point of it all?

Like I said, the impetus is simple and universal. Survival. All those words are to delineate the many ways that Survival is addressed by the human being. A question was asked, and when such a question is asked, I feel that it's okay to go ahead and answer it.

Why do you feel that your bumper sticker catch phrase fully answered the question? Why do you see love as different from desire? Desire - that urgent need - is the basis of all impetus, and survival of self is the basis of all desire. You can romanticize or intellectualize it all if you wish - which is what I generally do - but it's extremely primitive and universal. Desire is what facilitates existential survival, and human beings are loaded with desire.

Even the most Namaste-afflicted enlightened are driven to make damn sure that their lack of desire is fully appreciated by those who've stumbled across them in their own pursuit of whatever meaning can be extracted from life. That desire for such a finitely specific Identity trademark - the enlightened acolyte - is akin to the need that Donald Trump has to splatter his name all over a high rise in midtown Manhattan. Naked pursuit of unique Identity survival, and there's nothing at all wrong with that pursuit. It's primordial. It's not to be "overcome" by anyone, and even Mahatma Gandhi "branded" himself relentlessly over the course of his ministry. As did Martin Luther King, Buddha, and especially Jesus (if such a person did actually exist, of course).

The truth is that none of this is really easy to explain without using words, and making it "complicated" for some people. Not every truth can be reduced to a catch phrase. In fact, if your truth fits on a T-shirt, then you haven't really thought it through

There's how's that for a catch phrase?

I keep coming back to this thread bc perhaps I am so bereft of it in my life.......

I know what love is, because I know what it means to not have it.......nor know it, nor experience it and it is the lonliest place in this place, wherever that is,. to exist and try to keep going


Bless all those of you who to try to define it and give it, unquestioningly, for that, I am convinced, is what matters.....

"and sometimes when the night is slow the wretched and the meek, we gather up our hearts and go a thousand kisses deep
Leonard Cohen

Love is a super power. Few of us experience it in it's totality. It's great to watch young people in love. Love is also a simple thing at times too. A simple hello or thank you to someone else can make a difference. Real love can't really be defined. Love transcends.

Love is one of the three primary motivations a human can have and represents 'maintenance', as opposed to Power which focuses on destruction, and Wisdom which focuses on creation. All three are necessary for motion and life, and parallel the trimurti/trinity; no one is superior to the others. This trinity is also illustrated by the psychologists who's life work revolved around each concept singularly; Adler with Power, Jung with Wisdom, and Freud with Love. They each believed in turn that their position was PRIMARILY responsible for the motivations and therefore actions of people, and could thus be used to predict and modify behavior, and they were ALL right collectively. Here is an exercise that I've composed and use, that seems to work pretty well to illustrate this and all around be a fun meditation:

Virtue as a survival mechanism

- Just for fun, imagine you find yourself in the wild somewhere, you have no idea where. To the best of your knowledge, there is no one else around, just you alone in the wilderness with physical needs to be addressed. What do you look for first? Water? Shelter? Tools? Think about different stress situations that might occur, bear attacks, harsh weather. Don’t worry too much about the whole picture, or an extended stay, just imagine what your first reactions would be.

TREAT THIS AS A MEDITATION, RECORD YOUR CONCLUSIONS BEFORE READING THE EXPLANATION. PICK 1: WATER, SHELTER, OR FOOD.

People who react with strength will be more outgoing and less goal oriented, they are likely to take more risks and move on quickly, relying on their personal vitality to deal with obstacles. They might not have one thing in particular they are looking for, they will waste little time planning and just get out there to see what is available to them. They will then become fixated on things they find useful or in abundance, such as tools. Food may take a bigger priority over other needs, scavenging and hunting will be their primary actions to preserve their strength. Love people will focus more on shelter, and take longer to establish it and make themselves comfortable, gradually venturing out from that central point that was chosen for its stability, not necessarily for its proximity to necessities. It may be a cave or den that is well fortified and warm. Gathering will play a big role, picking low hanging fruit rather than risking precious energy on hunting. Wisdom people will be much more specific in their search, relying on prior knowledge to locate water, and then a refuge nearby. They will set about making tools and fire, relying on trapping instead of hunting. They may overestimate themselves in their command of mind over matter, but their patience will often pay off with higher quality food and supplies. They invest more time than the restless power-monger, but the amounts they come up with will likely fall short, as opposed to the love person who tries very hard to stockpile in defense against the elements, and in the hope that someone else will come along.
Now, when we do add other people to the mix, the social love people will be able to thrive where normally they would just get by in trading and communication. Power people will have difficulty because of the competition between them for the vital positions, but they will find security in the rest of societies need for them, provided they do their job. Wisdom people will make their own niches by becoming specialized in different tasks. And as the complexity branches out into multiple tribes, and the way they interact, you begin to see a fractal affect where each branch is a reflection of the original unit, and though the whole picture may appear dense and impenetrable, if at any point you can identify one of the three original archetypes, you may systematically unwind the entire thing and chart the interconnections in terms of these principle elements. -

Everyone, experiences combinations of all three motivations, all the time, but the idea that one could be dominating your behavior is really helpful for self reflection and individuation. I found personally, that I was Power oriented, and it explained a lot about why I like to finish things but don't really have the patience to stick around through the process while its going on, so I've been a lot more aware of it and its helped me a great deal to relate to Love oriented people. I use astrology to determine primary motivation, but of course psychoanalysis proper and other methods work fine too. Namaste!

love is a serious mental disease
-plato

( though I think out of context, it's from a dialogue in Phaedrus, I do feel it's relevant here )

reply to post by frankky


That is a good question, and I do not think there is a good answer.

What I do know however, is that at the end of ones life, it is love that counts. You wonder about your children, spouse and friends, not about what happens to your house or cars or who will get your job.

Love matters most in life.

reply to post by frankky


Love is the union of all the virtues and wisdom is above all the virtues, it leads and directs each virtue, when and how to use them. Reason understands, will follows, virtues execute, affections enjoy.

reply to post by frankky
Thanks for the thread and your views.

Love is the fundamental unity in which we all arise. This unity or love is senior to all conditions but not separate from anything or anyone. To recognize that we all arise in a field of infinite relatedness is the first noticing of this essential unity.

This relatedness or unity is right in our faces all the time and can be noticed in any moment - we are inherently related to, not separate from, what is arising, and this whole-bodily feeling-observation/participation releases real energy/love. We usually do not notice this relatedness because we have turned in on ourselves, identified with some subjective interior process we call "I", rather than noticing our actual situation of relatedness/unity/love.

reply to post by frankky


Your post seems to chalk Love up to a a form of mysticism, a form of spiritual energy. This is incorrect IMO.

Love is a verb that denotes positive action. Love is Not an emotion. Love is Not a noun.

You cannot treat Love as an emotion or an energy because these get you into a trap that makes one think it is a thing that can be manipulated. Love cannot be manipulated - it simply is or it isn't depending on the persons willingness to show the actions of Love.

For instance. There is no such thing as "being in Love" or "falling in Love" Love is a conscious choice people make - they choose to show actions of a positive state of being toward their loved ones.

I am Not "in love" with my wife, never have been, never will be. and neither will you be "in love" with your spouse. Do I love my wife? Absolutely - because I choose to.

People use this term as if love were an emotion, but it's not an emotion in itself. You may feel emotional about your positive actions toward your spouse, or about the people around the world but that's separate than love.

Love is Not an energy to be harnessed nor is it repelled by war. It is simply the act of choosing positive actions many times coupled with an emotional response. In fact, in war time people choose to act in love more because they see the suffering of their fellow man. By putting Love into a narrow box and calling it an energy you turn something real into something make believe that no longer becomes obtainable - you must understand love is a conscious choice that comes from within not some mystic energy floating around the universe.