What would you do: advice sought on a controversial topic

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posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 12:43 AM
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Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by tetra50
 

I have actually read the whole thread but none of what you reposted does away with the need for a reason for a person to be targeted. All those points show a means to an end but none give a clear idea of what that end, as far as any individual in particular is concerned, could possibly be or why X is targeted instead of Y or Z. This is where individual cases break down.

edit on 5-4-2013 by daskakik because: (no reason given)


Bleeep asserted we are all targeted. Intersting given your perspective.
And Ophiuchus posted this, another interesting take, and I will take it a step further, if he doesn't mind:



Its wild because the same things may be going on with ALL the ENERGIES related w/o knowing as some can be like lets say flytraps as to attract questionable energies closer as so THEY Are WATCHED/EVALUATED...


Though he may have meant less, or more or different here, it brings up the idea that indeed we are all targeted, but on different levels with different awarenesses of it, dependent upon how plugged in we are to television, cell phones, electronic gadgetry we are both addicted to, dependent upon, and which serve to detach us from our own inner voice because we are so busy listening to distracting, basically fluff information about celebrities and the like so that we don't think on a certain level, mostly. So one could be manipulated in this way without even realizing it, dependent upon their awareness, as all these distractions are designed to disassociate us from our own psyches; they in fact, aim to keep us concentrated on the most superficial levels of thought, so as not to recognize how we are increasingly disassociated both from ourselves, our place in the world, what the world truly is, and what is really happening in it, and how this leads us to abdicate our control over it. By degrees, we accept what we feel helpless to change, and so to survive with some kind of humor and social integration, it is necessary that we ignore certain truths, and our own inner intuitions, and think less and less about the big picture and what really matters. We are given every day to understand we can effect little change anyhow.




posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 12:45 AM
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reply to post by tetra50
 


It is not off topic for me to disagree with what the actual root of the subject is. I could have said it was 5th dimensional elephants controlling you with some sort of elephant technology, and it would still be on topic.

Once more, I am not saying you are not having genuine experiences; I am in actual agreement that something is going on. I just think that you have misidentified what the experiences are, and that your interpretation is impractical. Furthermore, I think that it is not just you, and your ilk, who have this happen to them - it's everyone - all the time.

Also, what I am trying to tell you, is that I have already seen almost all of the evidence you are presenting, and that if you put everything possible into scope, the most likely culprit are the fallen ones. You just do not wish to accept that possibility, because you are in such a grave state of denial.

I have considered your possible answers; it is you who deny to consider mine.

I also want you to understand that I am not placing blame on you, I am just trying to help you see it as I do.

Further still, you do not know what I have experienced, so don't be so quick to discount me.

Answer these: Do you ever feel like a pressure on your head, as if something is pressing in, if you try to block the thoughts? Do you often hear what sounds like the swan song of a dieing ear drum cell? Are you only overcome with "filth" when you dwell on what you are perceiving? Do you hear random noises about you very often?

I'm telling you it's not just you. It's everyone, and everyone just doesn't pay attention like you are. If you stop dwelling on it, it will get easier for you.



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 12:47 AM
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Initially, I wrote nearly 4500 characters of a response to this topic before my browser froze on me. I could literally write about this stuff all day, as gang stalking and its associated "phenomena" are a very intriguing topic to me. Hopefully I don't run out of steam before I finish with my thoughts on this.

First, not on the topic of OP, but on something that I feel is central to the discussion. I believe that the victims of gang stalking are not directly under any sort of "mind control" that is depicted in your typical sci-fi movie. If that really was possible, it would be silly to use for the sole purpose of psychological abuse and not something that truly benefits whoever has that power (like manipulating stock prices, or more, who you vote for . I could expand on that, but my point is made). Entertaining the thought that gang stalking is real, wouldn't it be in the organizers best interests to perpetuate the idea that these victim's minds are being read? That's undeniably the easiest way to fast track somebody to the loony bin.

I believe that the perpetrators of gang stalking have just deeply analyzed all recorded aspects of the victims life.  We are all creatures of habit. If you have a significant other, or have lived with somebody for a long time, I'd be willing to bet that at any time of day you would be able to make a very decent guess of where your SO or roommate is, and what they are doing. Investors have made millions of dollars using software which analyzes all sorts of data like news reports, social media, market data, and environmental data as indicators of potential stock market directions. Now, what if this type of software was used not to predict movements of stocks, but was used to predict your next movement?

So much data on our personal lives is available in easily organized and obtainable electronic datasets. 

Some examples of your own recorded data:
1. Credit card purchases
2. Text messages and emails
3. Online searches
4. Real-time GPS locations from your cell phone
5. Purchase history from stores with "rewards" cards
6. (Possible but unlikely) Federal Gov. GPS tracking device 
(remember, the court decided that its perfectly legal to put one on anybody's car without the need for a warrant)
7. Social networking (containing just about every aspect of your life, including personal conversations and every connection you have to "friends", etc.)

All of this data directly related to you is available to the federal government with minimal regard to privacy and judicial oversight. 

Think about the mindless actions you perform each day leading up to the actual action you intended to do, such as purchase groceries, visit friends, or pick up fast food. We all research things online, and many will look up information on some topic (like restaurants, stores, items, etc.)  If you're like me, many times there will be some unique characteristic in your prior actions leading up to what you intend to do. For a simple example, I live in a large subdivision with many exits. Depending on where I am going, I will drive towards a specific exit that is closest to where I am going. From an analytical third-party perspective, I just eliminated potential destinations and made it easier to determine where I will ultimately end up. If its around the usual time that I eat a meal,  and my credit card record shows that I usually buy dinner out, that would increase the probability that I am heading to a restaurant (most likely the restaurant that I frequent most, or one that I go to every friday night, etc.). Maybe you had mentioned some specific idea or topic in a text message or email that is related to a location that is in the direction you are headed. All of this minor data can add up and give a good indication of your intentions.

Assume for a second that you are the victim of gang stalking. Through historical analysis of your habits, your most probable destination can be determined based on quick analysis of current state (all prior actions leading up to "now", time, and location data etc.) and the gang-stalking organizer could quickly dispatch a "street theater" group to this location. They might have actors speaking with the intent for you to overhear a conversation eerily related to an intimately personal topic you've discussed in what you thought was a private conversation, random actors at the scene might seem to be paying more attention to you than the other "random" people, some could be wearing clothes that reference something that applies to your personal life or something that is unique to you, and to finally top it off, one actor close to you might yell your name loudly to another actor some distance away. All of these coincidences overwhelm your mind, leaving you to question how these random people knew to organize exactly where you were going and play out scenes that seem to directly relate to you in multiple, but subtle, ways.

[Turns out I didn't run out of stem. Continued next post]



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 12:52 AM
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reply to daskakik:

And so, yeah, we might not even recognize it is happening, for we take Bleeep's advice and just don't dwell on it.
And it is human nature, I repeat, a matter of pride, that no one and nothing can control us. And all those signals we are bombarded with, overtly in advertising, not to mention real signals surrounding us through electrical grids and household appliances, and myriad possibilties, right down to Gwen towers and the Maroon Bowsprit array in Florida and many other places, and this isn't even dealing with personal zeroing in on unique signatory electromagnetic fields given off by unique brain processes.....

As for targeting, there could be many reasons, from average Joe with no way of fighting, to those who actually do have very definitive reasons for their credibility being destroyed. And these exist as well. But they aren't going to risk coming forward at the risk to themselves or loved ones, or even making the situation worse for the public at large, to give posters on internet forums hard facts about what the motivations were behind negating their credibility.
None of which means it isn't happening, and for all the reasons I have stated.

But again, I digress from the stated purpose of this thread. I wish not to become mired in the standard arguments of whether it is happening, the validity of it, but for a suspension of your need for proof, to see the whole picture, imagine in compassion what those suffering are going through, and think about some ways it could be stopped. If you can't extrapolate there on someone else's behalf, at least you may be able to see that our rights are being eroded at an alarming rate. And the last sacred place is your mind. And there are plenty of threads on this site alone, giving myriad reasons what is behind the hijacking of the very mind, and what this means in the creation of one world government, and total control of the populace.
edit on 5-4-2013 by tetra50 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 12:53 AM
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[Contined from above.]

It is not surprising that many victims feel their thoughts are directly being read due to the sheer amount of coincidental and disturbingly personal scenes being played out at the exact location they were intending to go.  

While I do not believe anybody has the ability to actually "read" the thoughts you have, I'm not one to completely disregard that somehow the technology exists. I just think its ridiculously unlikely that the technology or ability exists. I do however strongly believe that just about all aspects of the average American's lives are digitally accessible to certain organizations. 

William Binney, the ex-NSA whistleblower already came forward and discussed the use of this exact type of analytical software being designed. He even mentions in one of his interviews/videos that the microphone on cellphones can be accessed remotely even when the phone is "off". Thats one more way gang stalking and "street theater" scenes can relate to the personal, non-digital, conversations which can be used to further the idea that the victim's mind is being read. 

To answer OP's question on what I would do if I were a victim? Despite the extreme difficulty of having the most psychologically mind-bending events occurring everywhere I go, I would try my best to keep my mind in a state of rational observance. I believe the intent of this "street theater" is twofold, one, it is to keep you in a constant state of fear and isolation with the ultimate goal of causing you to act out and appear incompetent and insane. I would practice meditation and keep a very close relationship with family members. I'd try to keep focused on what is important to me, keep busy with hobbies and work, and just accept the fact that some organization has every aspect of my life monitored. I'd try my best to be friendly and respectful to each actor I happen to interact with, with the intention to show them that I am just a normal human being. I truthfully believe that many actors and "extras" are told lies about the victim and are given a believable story that paints the victim as a criminal or 'undesirable' member of society as a means to encourage participation and overcome any feelings of remorse they might feel towards the victim.  (I use the term "extra" to mean someone who is not a trained gang stalking actor, but is an everyday individual convinced to participate).I believe that eventually everyone but sociopaths would eventually see their participation as morally wrong if they were harassing somebody who honestly does not seem to deserve it. I just know that it is highly unlikely that the victim would be able to do anything to get out of the situation by themselves without seeming absolutely bat-# insane. 

 If the reports are true, even people who are close to you will be drawn into the act, but family members would never ultimately want to harm you and really want what's best for you. Likewise, I would remind myself that everybody is human, even those acting in the abuse. Eventually, with enough people involved in your harassment and an increasing number of victims, somebody will realize the true harm they are doing. With the involvement of enough "extras", the secret cannot stay secret forever. 

Sure, the main reason why you were chosen as a victim might be unknown, but I believe the ultimate goal is to strip you of your rights as a free person and to break your strength of will by essentially forcing you to take antipsychotics (literally blocking the dopamine, serotonin, and norepinephrine receptors in your brain; the same chemicals that evoke emotion, pleasure, alertness, and motivation) or worse, forcing repeat hospitalizations in mental health facilities.

That's my two cents.
edit on 5-4-2013 by Dantose because: Ambiguous garbledegook.



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 12:57 AM
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reply to post by daskakik
 

I have more than elucidated in many ways what is gained. We are covering the same ground. And I will not waste time with the same, repeated, explanations.
Thanks for your reply.



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 01:02 AM
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reply to post by tetra50
 


But if this is the case then is it accurate to say that anyone is really targeted? If someone goes for a stroll in a park and it starts to rain, does it rain only on them because someone is trying to trigger a preprogrammed response? Isn't everyone that is out and about in that area getting the same treatment?

As for your other reply, my point was in reference to specific cases. Your general explanations don't really address them and they do nothing to validate them. I don't think it is wrong on my part to take individuals claiming to be targets of this type of control as individual cases that may or may not be factual.

edit on 5-4-2013 by daskakik because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 01:13 AM
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Originally posted by Bleeeeep
reply to post by tetra50
 





I just think that you have misidentified what the experiences are, and that your interpretation is impractical. Furthermore, I think that it is not just you, and your ilk, who have this happen to them

Then be clearer, and explain in plain words what the experiences are, and why you find my interpretation impractical, especially not knowing my history. And I would object, here, that you have brought this into a personal interpretation, which I was avoiding. This was for all the victims who suffer, not me. So, I resent this pounding at me personally, when the OP was clear.

Next, pray tell, what is my "ilk?"




Also, what I am trying to tell you, is that I have already seen almost all of the evidence you are presenting, and that if you put everything possible into scope, the most likely culprit are the fallen ones. You just do not wish to accept that possibility, because you are in such a grave state of denial.

Who are the fallen ones, pray tell? And why would I not accept that, what state of denial am I in, in your estimation. And here, I find downright offensive, for you do not know me at all. Nor does my OP provide anything with which you would take it to this personal level, of my ilk and state of denial.




Answer these: Do you ever feel like a pressure on your head, as if something is pressing in, if you try to block the thoughts? Do you often hear what sounds like the swan song of a dieing ear drum cell? Are you only overcome with "filth" when you dwell on what you are perceiving? Do you hear random noises about you very often?

I'm telling you it's not just you. It's everyone, and everyone just doesn't pay attention like you are. If you stop dwelling on it, it will get easier for you.

No. 1: No. 2) No. Haven't a clue what you are talking about. 3)No. I am overcome with "filth", after many years of more subtle interference which wasn't filth, but simply thoughts that didn't seem germaine to what I was doing at the moment, nor had I ever encountered in my mind before, totally unrelated to absolutely anything going on at the time. The characteristics of this changed dramatically approx. 10 yrs. ago, when it became pure filth, uncharacteristic of any thoughts ever entertained nor occurring in my brain before, ever. The filth overcoming me comes out of the pure blue, not trying to fight anything, fixing an egg for breakfast and the symbolism of that being consuming a potential life of another form. Or, seeing the worst, dirtiest interpretation of a really harmless statement, as though my mind comes up with completely foreign (previous to forty years of thought, on academic levels mainly, or serious intellectual probing of concepts), bad, out of taste jokes about something I would never have responded to that way--out of the blue, my not resisting anything. Just suddenly, some totally uncharacteristic, immature, and raunchy, sometimes offensive--and totally uncharacteristic again, in all my thinking all my life, of the same ponderings of abstractual concepts to the most mundane.

It has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with me dwelling on it. I can distract myself in a variety of ways. These foreign thoughts creep in, no matter how relaxed a state I am in. The more relaxed, and not resistant, the worse it is.
edit on 5-4-2013 by tetra50 because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 01:16 AM
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reply to post by Dantose
 


Sorry, perhaps refer to the original OP. This is not a thread about gang stalking. It relates, albeit in a very tangential way. But very limited, a reinforcement, if you will, extraneously and circumstantial surroundings, to sometimes further what the OP is really about, which is mind control.



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 01:23 AM
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reply to post by Dantose
 


Sorry to have first dismissed your lengthy, and well thought out reply because you chose to focus on gangstalking.
You are only one of two responses here that I regard as getting to the heart, and thinking seriously about how to deal with these possibilities, according to some, and probabilities, if not reality, by others. I thank you greatly for applying such a considered reply to the questions raised in my OP, and understanding why this would be taking place.

The gangstalking feature is but one. I feel the mind control issues are foremost, and the gangstalking secondary to it, to achieve a further isolation and disenfranchisment and loss of credibility on a social and/or career level, rendering the victim, thereafter, helpless, having been defined by what surrounds him/her.

But the true question I was trying to address is what I see as the last bastion of our natural rights as individuals: our minds.

But thank you greatly for you considered and thoughtful response.



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 01:29 AM
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Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by tetra50
 


But if this is the case then is it accurate to say that anyone is really targeted? If someone goes for a stroll in a park and it starts to rain, does it rain only on them because someone is trying to trigger a preprogrammed response? Isn't everyone that is out and about in that area getting the same treatment?

As for your other reply, my point was in reference to specific cases. Your general explanations don't really address them and they do nothing to validate them. I don't think it is wrong on my part to take individuals claiming to be targets of this type of control as individual cases that may or may not be factual.

edit on 5-4-2013 by daskakik because: (no reason given)


Of course, there are most likely cases which are factual and those which are not. Absolutely. Much in the world is about pretense and facade, if only for the sake of denying responsibility. But for those for which it is real, they are also hamstrung by this fact, and appear to be just another nutjob denying responsibility for the choices they have made. For those in the real situation, sadly, the frequently have no real choices. Their lives are quite controlled, in fact.
But again, I am wasting my time trying to convince you of something you have preconceived notions of. I wish only to deal with folks suffering from something very real. You either accept it or don't. I asked for a suspension of your need for proof or acceptance of their plight, and to imagine what could be done to fight it.



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 01:44 AM
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reply to post by tetra50
 

Sorry that I am not suffering from something very real. I have said that I believe that real cases exist but that I don't believe everyone claiming to be a victim is real.

I see you putting this out there like it has been worked out to a science, which is more reason against arbitrary experimentation on the average person. If they were actually at the roll out stage then I doubt people would notice and there would be no way to fight it.

I think you might be building up an enemy just to satisfy a romantic notion of fighting the good fight.



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 01:55 AM
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Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by tetra50
 

Sorry that I am not suffering from something very real. I have said that I believe that real cases exist but that I don't believe everyone claiming to be a victim is real.

I see you putting this out there like it has been worked out to a science, which is more reason against arbitrary experimentation on the average person. If they were actually at the roll out stage then I doubt people would notice and there would be no way to fight it.

I think you might be building up an enemy just to satisfy a romantic notion of fighting the good fight.


so sorry you see it this way. It was not at all how my op was intended so it was be my fault for not expressing it well enough, or to think I could go about this without more sourcing for this is plenty, and very factual and official. It is absolutely worked out to a science, and I am privy to quite a bit of knowledge about it. It is hardly at the "roll out stage," Without risk of offending you or asking your age, you might do a bit of research. This has gone on for a very, very long time. I alluded to factual allegations in the '50s from the US government directed at Russian interference in DOD and military and political interference via EMF. I alluded to MK Ultra, which is without doubt, real, with congressional hearings, and laws against psychotronic experimentation on civilian populuses. There is a great deal, of very old research out there, pinning this down and substantiating it, without really any doubt whatsoever.

I have no need to build an enemy. I have no need for a romantic notion of fighting the good fight. I know of which I speak. Enough said. And I am weary of attempting to convince when the whole point of the OP was to find other threads to fight the convincing on--there are a plethora on this forum alone.

Believe what you will. It matters not to me. I have plenty in my life to fight without a romantic notion of anything. And your couching it in that particular language says to me you have absolutely no clue what the rape of a mind, what that constitues, and what it means for the average population means. Plus, I found your logic, even when given logical examples, and sources, lacking. I see your comments as belittling, especially that romantic crap, as there is nothing at all romantic about the hijacking of your mind.

But hey, hope you never have to experience such because it would be the rudest awakening of your life.



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 02:10 AM
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reply to post by tetra50
 

You might feel that it is belittling but I'm just being honest. Mind control seems to be a little like illness. Some people are really ill and then there are hypochondriacs. Not in reference to you but they do exist. I don't really understand what it is you are trying to convince me about. I already stated that I believe these things happen but I doubt it happens to people for no good reason.

I also believe that a general form of control, as Bleeeeep and Ophiuchus mentioned, does not fit the phenomenon as stated in the OP so are we to discuss one or the other?



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 02:15 AM
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Originally posted by tetra50
Originally posted by Bleeeeep
reply to post by tetra50
 





I just think that you have misidentified what the experiences are, and that your interpretation is impractical. Furthermore, I think that it is not just you, and your ilk, who have this happen to them

Then be clearer, and explain in plain words what the experiences are, and why you find my interpretation impractical, especially not knowing my history. And I would object, here, that you have brought this into a personal interpretation, which I was avoiding. This was for all the victims who suffer, not me. So, I resent this pounding at me personally, when the OP was clear.

Next, pray tell, what is my "ilk?"




Also, what I am trying to tell you, is that I have already seen almost all of the evidence you are presenting, and that if you put everything possible into scope, the most likely culprit are the fallen ones. You just do not wish to accept that possibility, because you are in such a grave state of denial.

Who are the fallen ones, pray tell? And why would I not accept that, what state of denial am I in, in your estimation. And here, I find downright offensive, for you do not know me at all. Nor does my OP provide anything with which you would take it to this personal level, of my ilk and state of denial.




Answer these: Do you ever feel like a pressure on your head, as if something is pressing in, if you try to block the thoughts? Do you often hear what sounds like the swan song of a dieing ear drum cell? Are you only overcome with "filth" when you dwell on what you are perceiving? Do you hear random noises about you very often?

I'm telling you it's not just you. It's everyone, and everyone just doesn't pay attention like you are. If you stop dwelling on it, it will get easier for you.

No. 1: No. 2) No. Haven't a clue what you are talking about. 3)No. I am overcome with "filth", after many years of more subtle interference which wasn't filth, but simply thoughts that didn't seem germaine to what I was doing at the moment, nor had I ever encountered in my mind before, totally unrelated to absolutely anything going on at the time. The characteristics of this changed dramatically approx. 10 yrs. ago, when it became pure filth, uncharacteristic of any thoughts ever entertained nor occurring in my brain before, ever. The filth overcoming me comes out of the pure blue, not trying to fight anything, fixing an egg for breakfast and the symbolism of that being consuming a potential life of another form. Or, seeing the worst, dirtiest interpretation of a really harmless statement, as though my mind comes up with completely foreign (previous to forty years of thought, on academic levels mainly, or serious intellectual probing of concepts), bad, out of taste jokes about something I would never have responded to that way--out of the blue, my not resisting anything. Just suddenly, some totally uncharacteristic, immature, and raunchy, sometimes offensive--and totally uncharacteristic again, in all my thinking all my life, of the same ponderings of abstractual concepts to the most mundane.

It has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with me dwelling on it. I can distract myself in a variety of ways. These foreign thoughts creep in, no matter how relaxed a state I am in. The more relaxed, and not resistant, the worse it is.
edit on 5-4-2013 by tetra50 because: (no reason given)


I really wish, having drawn this personally to me, when I asked specifically for help for many, and then pointing it directly in my direction, that you would return and answer said questions, in fairness, for I have answered yours.
What "ilk" exactly are you lumping me in with. For this borders on insulting with no further eplanation. As well, as this statement about the fallen ones being the culprits, but I am in too much a state of denial to admit this.
Are you implying I am of the ilk of fallen ones, or what exactly?

And what is it you would supply a list of questions I answered for you, but do not in all fairness answer mine--when you turned an OP into caring about the plight of others into what seems a rather personal assault, with what could be construed as several comments bordering on personal insult, when the OP was anything but personal, but reaching out to the plight of others.......



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 02:30 AM
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Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by tetra50
 

You might feel that it is belittling but I'm just being honest. Mind control seems to be a little like illness. Some people are really ill and then there are hypochondriacs. Not in reference to you but they do exist. I don't really understand what it is you are trying to convince me about. I already stated that I believe these things happen but I doubt it happens to people for no good reason.

I also believe that a general form of control, as Bleeeeep and Ophiuchus mentioned, does not fit the phenomenon as stated in the OP so are we to discuss one or the other?


What "general form of control?" I find your writing lacking in clarity. You are using wide swaths which is easy in a controversial subject, and you are using this to steer the whole OP off kilter. Honest? There is nothing in my OP which could be construed when talking about horror and the rape of the mind that is romanticizing in the least. Yes, I doubt it happens to people for no good reason either. All the reasons are bad. Perhaps you are one of those who have that overblown sense of patriotism and do not realize that what is often happening is the opposite of what you are told. These things don't happen to protect country and loyalty, but to destroy it. Not getting to the root of it by exposing it, and understanding that there is a long history of whistle blowing being met with dicrediting via such techniques, does not save anything, anyone, or any republic or organization. It self perpetuates what happens out of evil in dark places, and virtually ensures it will be ongoing, because it works so well. And so few believe.

I see your responses as picking apart something that was wholly intended to do the opposite. Leave the picking alone, assume it happens, suspend your belief for the purposes of healing. You continue to degenerate the discussion to tangential nitpicking, refusing to accept any logic you will not entertain regardless of its logic.
World domination and the domination and control of the populace must not be something you see as happening, or a goal.

If you do not wish to participate in the discussion on that level, then leave it. You lost me with the romanticized anything once I described what the rape of the mind must be like and it should be the last sacred bastion of our lives and bodies as individuals. If you don't see the paramountness of that, and how offensive it is to suggest this is some kind of romanticization, we will never reach any agreement about much of anything, and I feel you have missed the point of the OP.

No hard feelings. But you got me , and what I wrote, pretty much all wrong.
I'll take responsibility that I must not have communicated it well enough. You want to degenerate into tangentials of should we discuss this or that. Go debate on the debate forum. This OP was not intended to be a debate of your beliefs. It was outlined clearly. It was about compassion, and stopping this happening. If you've nothing to add to that, then there isn't anything left to say, for I will not let you sidetrack me with inflammatory "romantic" notions about the raping of one's mind.
Needless to say, I found that highly inflammatory, and adding nothing to the subject worth continuing.



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 02:47 AM
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Originally posted by tetra50
What "general form of control?" I find your writing lacking in clarity.

I would say that it may be your lack of understanding. People having thoughts beamed into their heads by EMF is individual. Messages spread through pop culture are general. I took the posts by Bleeeeep and Ophiuchus to be focused on the later while, the OP seems to focus and the former.


Perhaps you are one of those who have that overblown sense of patriotism and do not realize that what is often happening is the opposite of what you are told. These things don't happen to protect country and loyalty, but to destroy it.

That isn't me.


I see your responses as picking apart something that was wholly intended to do the opposite. Leave the picking alone, assume it happens, suspend your belief for the purposes of healing. You continue to degenerate the discussion to tangential nitpicking, refusing to accept any logic you will not entertain regardless of its logic.
World domination and the domination and control of the populace must not be something you see as happening, or a goal.

Sorry but this isn't your own little dictatorship where you get to tell other members of ATS what to do.


If you do not wish to participate in the discussion on that level, then leave it. You lost me with the romanticized anything once I described what the rape of the mind must be like and it should be the last sacred bastion of our lives and bodies as individuals. If you don't see the paramountness of that, and how offensive it is to suggest this is some kind of romanticization, we will never reach any agreement about much of anything, and I feel you have missed the point of the OP.

I never said a mind rape is romantic. That is you twisting what I said. You painting the picture of the last stance of human beings to protect the last bastion of our lives and bodies as individuals is romantic.


This OP was not intended to be a debate of your beliefs. It was outlined clearly. It was about compassion, and stopping this happening.

But if it isn't happening then it is on topic and a relevent part of the discussion. Just because you don't want to even entertain the possibility shows the adherence to your personal preconceived notions.



Needless to say, I found that highly inflammatory, and adding nothing to the subject worth continuing.

Since you mistook it for something it was not, I'm not surprised.

edit on 5-4-2013 by daskakik because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 02:48 AM
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reply to post by tetra50
 


I'm sorry, but I can't be any more clear in what I think is happening: It is “they”. The fallen ones. The angels cast down from heaven.

Your denial is expressed in your unreceptive rebuttals and in the very opening post of this thread. You are hostile to any conclusion that is not derived from technological thought propagation or the efforts of some special agency that targets random people.

Ilk may have been a bad choice of words, since it is often used in a derogatory manner; but I assure you, I meant no disrespect when I wrote it. I just meant the other people who have the same conclusions as you. It is easier for me, and you, if I repeatedly write ilk, rather than write: All the victims who believe they suffer from technological thought propagation and well choreographed stalking.

Further, I use other words like superficial in their naturally neutral form as well. If you see me say superficial then I am saying it in an atypical manner such as “the surface of an issue; something that is not the root of the issue”, and not the typical derogatory manner which is “stupidly obvious; vein opinion”. It's only because I have a lack of vocabulary, and not because I'm rude.

As for your answers to my questions: Although you asked us not to, I guess I should have started out by asking you what your symptoms were. And I'm sorry if it offends you, but it is the only way we can identify with what you are saying. Further, and mostly rhetorical for your sake: When you start to have experiences do you not then dwell and attempt to block them? If so, do you not suffer physical effects when you do so? Do you really not hear strange sounds? I have a feeling you are not being 100% honest.

If you insist that we must share you opinion. Then I must apologize, because I cannot do that. I have read over, and studied, far too many things that dictate, to me, that what is happening is not the superficial conclusions you have come to.

I'll just leave you be. Sincerely, good luck.



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 02:58 AM
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reply to post by tetra50
 


Yeah, sorry about the lengthy and indirect reply. The topic of the mind can lead to some funky metaphysical ideas which honestly could have no truth to them. 

As you pointed out, I believe the end game of gang stalking is to basically castrate the mind, either through powerful antipsychotics, enormous mental stress, or constant barrage of chemical analogs of the human body's primal hormones. I believe that reports of victims claiming to be attacked by "EMF weapons" which cause the victim to be overcome with a physical response or emotional response are really just ultra low dose highly active hormone analogs dispersed as an aerosol near the victim. Honestly, to me it just makes more sense being that every biological response in living organisms is due to some chemical messenger (even the brain, but it's a lot faster to connect distant cells with electrical conduits that end with the release of a chemical signal). A lot of the responses these victims describe can be explained by a chemical hijacking of the body's hormone responses.

Sorry, got off topic again with gang stalking. Regardless of the abuse, all of the results seem to completely prevent the victim from attaining rest. Rest being more than sleep, but actual spiritual/mental rest and relief from the constant barrage of unsettling events that become the sole focus of the victim. If the victim is able to somehow find relief from the psychological events playing out, they are still plagued with the mental fatigue resulting from the traumas. 

Surprisingly, this has been a topic I've thought about many times over the past few weeks. I have no idea of the true purpose behind intentionally overwhelming the mind with distractions or psychological assault, but I have a few ideas on it.  Most relate to the subconcious mind and the role it plays in the concious mind. I'm a traditionally rational guy, but I do feel that spirituality and the subconcious mind are tied close together (even to entertaining the idea of a mystical connection to the subconcious mind). 

In my experience, most of my "moments of insight" do not occur while I am doing something which requires a lot of mental energy, but when I am in a state of relaxation or doing something which allows my brain to seemingly disengage from the task I am performing.  In fact, I am at my happiest when I am able to enter a state of peaceful, non-specific, thought and just allow myself to observe thoughts that surface (that's the introvert in me). 

Research and scientific investigation (read: non-recreational use by individuals) into psychedelic drugs and the mind-state that they produce is said to be as if the barrier between the subconcious mind and the concious mind is removed, making the user seem as though they are able to observe (in some convoluted fashion) the mechanisms of true subconcious thought through disturbances in sensory perception and a profound alteration in "observable" thoughts. While in this state, individuals can have deep philosophical and mental realizations due to the apparent loss of normal "ingrained" beliefs due to previous social and cultural conditioning. This is taking the subconcious to the extreme, but these psychedelic experiences have many similarities to experiences of individuals in states of deep meditation.

In order to reach a state of meditation, the mind must not be fatigued and must be clear. Personal insight and reflective thought are easily attained while in a state of meditation. 

Before jumping into the rabbit hole which is mysticism/the unknown, I just want to finish my main theory. I believe those who are victims of this "mind control" are victimized with the sole purpose of handicapping their mind and essentially eliminating any threat they pose to the perpetrator. Just as somebody who has to work multiple jobs and apply all of their energy to just be able to obtain their basic needs does not have time to realize the creep of tyranny or have the time to fight for their rights, I believe that a fatigued and overwhelmed mind is in the same situation. All of their time not being victimized is spent recovering and piecing back together their psyche, and not being spent actively fighting back, or if they manage to become active, being totally discredited by their behavior and statements if they attempt it.

[Continued}



posted on Apr, 5 2013 @ 02:59 AM
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[Continued from above]

One thing that really has me thinking though, is the marginal benefit to the perpetrator. Sure, one person loses the mental will or capacity to fight the machine. How big of a threat is that person? Certainly not big enough to merit a full scale infestation of resources into every aspect of the victim's life, right? Is the victim somebody who could possibly become a leader against the machine? Doubtful, seeing that seemingly random individuals are becoming victims; individuals that are not associated with leading even small groups. That led me to the thought of a deeper, but completely baseless, idea towards the spiritual/mystical. I want to stress that this is mostly fanciful and somewhat religious, meaning there is no science to it. Since so many people seem to be screaming about the end times, rapture, and yada yada, what if there was something deeper to it? What if there really is some good vs. evil motif? What if a clear and alert mind, coupled with meditation or spiritual reflection could lead to deeper insight on a spiritual level, and those that are ultimately seen as being threats are not true threats to the current political state, but a threat to a completely evil and truly devastating entity which some of the rapturists seem to belive that TPTB are trying to manifest?

One final thought to end on. One of my favorite quotes is from the game Skyrim. One NPC mentions to your character, "Remember, your mind is the greatest weapon you have".
edit on 5-4-2013 by Dantose because: (no reason given)
edit on 5-4-2013 by Dantose because: no raisin given





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