Propaganda reality check:from North Korea.

reply to post by terriblyvexed


No... Your post was actually awesome... It just takes the right kind of person to appreciate the realism. In an artistic sense, it was a very candid reaction and because of that, and the fact that people don't post like that on here anymore, everyone's so calloused I suppose, but that makes your post very, very beautiful to someone like me. To me, your post represents the feeling I suspect a lot of us have had at some point... I realize alcohol was involved, but you still managed to write that post pretty damn legibly...so I'm thinking it was the honest type of drunk rather than the "im crazy as bat# so don't pay attention to anything I say" kind of drunk.

The simple fact is... the way things are in the world, and have been for some time now... the very human condition itself...is cause to shed tears. It's a perfectly normal reaction. I tell you this, the more you understand the world, the more difficult it can be to find reasons to be happy. I think that's the point. We are supposed to "do something" about it...so we can be happy. Because we aren't happy now, are we? Well, I guess that depends on how much you understand about the world... If this movie rips the veil from your eyes, then good. We can't all just keep riding this planet around and around the sun again and again without a single care as if this is some kind of carousel of delightful fantasies... We've got work to do!!!

Of course you were not meant to be a soldier. Well, maybe a different kind of soldier...

Have you ever witnessed something wonderful such as an act of kindness towards another human being? Did it inspire you or at least put a smile on your face to think of it? If it had an effect on you, then imagine the effect you could have on others... You can be a soldier of love. What makes it even better is when you refuse any reward or even recognition for your actions. That can also cause it to have a greater impact on those around you.

I don't know if you are "down with" the Bible, but it talks about people who pray loudly so as to let everyone around them know how holy and great they are... I pray quietly. Which is a metaphor meaning that I do my good deeds quietly. Making a big show of it might get more attention from more people, but the impact it had on those people will not be as effective as it is spread so thin throughout the crowd... When just one or two people know about what you did and they see that you did not try to receive accolades, well, that can change someone's life forever.

Psychological warfare always works better when its real and not a made up ploy to divert peoples attention... I help people because I like the feeling it gives me. And I'm a very selfish person so I like to feel good a lot. A little humor there... or is it?

reply to post by Cancerwarrior


My reading comprehension is just fine thanks - but your swipe at communism (even if it had ever truly existed) harks back to the fear mongering of the McCarthy era. (and I just hate fear mongering)

What's happened to our democracies? They never really truly existed either did they? There's one country in the world which, in my view, has a true democracy - and that is Switzerland. The fact that is also one of the world's most affluent countries should send us all a very clear message.

But what started out as faltering attempts at democracy in the so-called developed world quickly dissolved into capitalism - and unfortunately - capitalism, in many peoples' minds equates to democracy. That is obviously untrue....and capitalism patently does not work. In fact capitalism has collapsed in exactly the manner predicted by Karl Marx - that old communist clever dick.

Jibjab say it very well.



When it became clear that the emerging economies would out-produce and undercut the western world our own dear leaders encouraged everyone to get themselves a plastic friend and turned (almost) all of us into debt slaves. I'm in my 40's and yet even in my younger years to buy something on credit (known locally as 'the never never) was a family embarrassment that would never have been made known to family and friends. And yet they somehow managed to turn ownership of a credit card into a status symbol.

China was unleashed on the world in 2000 - all export restrictions lifted - it took 8 years to bring the developed world to its knees. And - unless we do all wake up - our countries' will continue to behave in a provocative manner and wage unnecessary war - simply to make money.

I'm trained in hypnosis. There is a myth spread by hypnotists that one cannot hypnotise anyone to do something against their will. That is a lie. If I can couch my suggestions in a manner that complies with the individual's moral code I can make the do whatever the hell I want them to do.

E.g. If I entrance a subject and simply tell them to pick up a gun from the table and shoot the guy in the corner of the room - everyone except the psychopath will immediately awaken and ask me what the hell I'm playing at. However, if I firstly tell the subject that there's a guy in the corner of the room holding a bag containing a chemical agent that he plans to put into the water supply to kill every man, woman and child in the city - that there's a gun on the table - and they could pick it up shoot the individual - and save all of those peoples' lives. Nearly everyone will do it,

That is how propaganda works - and they way to stop it working is education education education. Once you are aware of the techniques (including the subliminal ones) they cease to be effective.

Originally posted by christina-66
reply to post by Cancerwarrior

 

My reading comprehension is just fine thanks - but your swipe at communism (even if it had ever truly existed) harks back to the fear mongering of the McCarthy era. (and I just hate fear mongering)

Ah, so thats why you're all riled up? I am not your enemy here, and it is not my fault if you want to take something said one way as meaning something else. You may hate fear mongering, personally I hate self-righteous know it alls that have the world painted black and white. Or in your case just black. But I guess thats just me.

And I guess Russia (and many other countries) were not communist for several decades? If that is what you are saying, I have known and served with personally several Russians that would disagree with that asinine statement. I dare you to go to eastern Ukraine or mother Russia and find someone who lived there through the middle of the last century and tell them that communism is all rainbows and hookers.

And since you bring it up, Capitalism/Democracy certainly has its flaws, but I would take it anyday over the bootheels of an iron fisted communist government dictatorship. Really, I would prefer democratic socialism,which is much much different than communism.

But again, these are just my opinions, and thank god I live somewhere I can have one instead of being told one. (for the time being at least.)

And thanks for the lecture, nothing in that whole little spiel that I did not already know, but a scooby snack, erm star for your efforts anyways

truely, no one wants to harm the nk people except their own leadership.

it's skating on thin ice in a glass house to assert that, but here, i will.

reply to post by Cancerwarrior

And I guess Russia (and many other countries) were not communist for several decades? If that is what you are saying, I have known and served with personally several Russians that would disagree with that asinine statement. I dare you to go to eastern Ukraine or mother Russia and find someone who lived there through the middle of the last century and tell them that communism is all rainbows and hookers.

Except the whole capitalism/communism thing is somewhat of a false dichotomy. You know who helped communism get going? Same people that helped Capitalism get going-the banking families/Illuminati. The whole dichotomy was set up for mostly one purpose-social engineering society in the way the puppet masters wanted it to go. Plus there is that whole us vs. them, divide and conquer thing that the puppet masters like so much.

"false dichotomy" is the perfect term.

America is a disgrace to anything good.


All of this NK talk lately is probably american propaganda, because videos like this were made, and so America needs to corral the spirits against NK, so that no american has the chance to hear their side of the story and so no more american 'terrorists' are created. Is George Orwell a prophet?

reply to post by Cancerwarrior


No you are not my enemy. You are a part of a conversation and that’s what we’re having here – you have been a member of this site for over a year now and you haven’t yet grasped the concept?

I am not a ‘know it all’ but I do have my opinions as you have yours – and I am as entitled to express them as you are. I do not see the world as black but know that it is shades of grey – probably as you do – but some facts are simply irrefutable. Like the US ptb lust for war.

And no – for your information Russia was never ever truly a communist state – it was an extreme form of socialism (Google it). And did I even state that communism was a good doctrine? I don’t think so – in fact – I know I didn't. Communism in its truest form was always good on paper but never ever good in practice – cos the fact is people are NOT equal – and not all people deserve equal rewards.

And you've done it yourself – you've proven my point – simply with the use of a forward slash

And since you bring it up, Capitalism/Democracy certainly has its flaws, but I would take it anyday over the bootheels of an iron fisted communist government dictatorship.

Capitalism and democracy are NOT one and the same. They are completely different concepts. One pertains to economics and the other to politics. The choice is not capitalism v communism. That’s a stupid comparison (comparing apples to pears) and I don’t think you’re stupid.

When I was a student I was taught that China was the best example in the world (at that time) of communism and that the US was the best example of capitalism – but that the UK was the best example of the mixed economy i.e. that life’s necessities e.g. gas, electricity and water remained in the public sector and everything else was open to free enterprise. I was taught that it would be immoral to privatise gas, electricity and water because they were necessities to life. (but oh how attitudes change)

And FYI this is a bulletin board – with many more readers than participators. I wasn't giving a lecture to you – but rather trying to discuss an important topic with you and help educate anyone else who may be reading. Get that ego of yours in check.

Bring back the concept of the mixed economy – that’s my message.

reply to post by ImaFungi

Is George Orwell a prophet?

Nope. He was a member of a "secret society" and had the inside scoop on the long term agenda. Same with Huxley and Brave New World.

www.conspiracytruths.co.uk...

Originally posted by christina-66
reply to post by Cancerwarrior

 

No you are not my enemy. You are a part of a conversation and that’s what we’re having here – you have been a member of this site for over a year now and you haven’t yet grasped the concept?

I know what a conversation is, however, my earlier statement that only fools and communists think there is no difference in the world somehow made me strike you as a fear monger and also made you feel the need to "educate" me more on the topic. Not what I was trying to do, but take it for what you will. As you point out, this is ATS after all. And actually, I have been a member for over 5 years on ATS, but I had an extended stay in the hospital a while back and when I recovered I had no idea what my old account and password was.

Originally posted by christina-66
And no – for your information Russia was never ever truly a communist state – it was an extreme form of socialism (Google it).

And is not communism an extreme form of socialism as well? Seems like you are comparing apples to apples.

Originally posted by christina-66
And you've done it yourself – you've proven my point – simply with the use of a forward slash

Capitalism and democracy are NOT one and the same. They are completely different concepts. One pertains to economics and the other to politics. The choice is not capitalism v communism. That’s a stupid comparison (comparing apples to pears) and I don’t think you’re stupid.

The only reason that I put the slash on there was because you said this in your earlier post.

Originally posted by christina-66
what started out as faltering attempts at democracy in the so-called developed world quickly dissolved into capitalism - and unfortunately - capitalism, in many peoples' minds equates to democracy.

I am well aware that they are two different concepts, and thank you for not thinking I am stupid. I don't think you are stupid either.

Originally posted by christina-66
And FYI this is a bulletin board – with many more readers than participators. I wasn't giving a lecture to you – but rather trying to discuss an important topic with you and help educate anyone else who may be reading. Get that ego of yours in check.

Sure, I'll check mine if you check yours

Originally posted by christina-66
Bring back the concept of the mixed economy – that’s my message.

And it is a message I agree with. Actually, most of the points you make I agree with. I would even take it a step further and have worker controlled production. I don't think that it is ever going to happen in the US anytime soon sadly.

Originally posted by coyotepoet
reply to post by Cancerwarrior

 

And I guess Russia (and many other countries) were not communist for several decades? If that is what you are saying, I have known and served with personally several Russians that would disagree with that asinine statement. I dare you to go to eastern Ukraine or mother Russia and find someone who lived there through the middle of the last century and tell them that communism is all rainbows and hookers.

Except the whole capitalism/communism thing is somewhat of a false dichotomy. You know who helped communism get going? Same people that helped Capitalism get going-the banking families/Illuminati. The whole dichotomy was set up for mostly one purpose-social engineering society in the way the puppet masters wanted it to go. Plus there is that whole us vs. them, divide and conquer thing that the puppet masters like so much.

Yes, Jim Marrs Rule by Secrecy is a great book about this same topic. And divide and conquer is still going on today. If anything it has just gotten worse. Most average Americans have an astounding ignorance about the rest of the world. And most don't care to learn and educate themselves about it either. It is especially bad if you live in a very rural area like I do.

Since this whole thing started with NK making the news recently, I have heard so many false and just blatantly ignorant statements about the people of NK from Americans the last few days that I think I have officially lost what little hope I had for this country ever making any kind of turnaround. The us vs. them mentality is so strong I can see that it is ultimately going to be the downfall of this country.It is so hard to have any meaningful intelligent conversation with 90 percent of the people I know. I usually have to dumb myself down when I speechify with folks here because people will think I am trying to be a smartypants if I try to talk about anything halfway meaningful besides the latest episode of Duck Dynasty or whatever garbage they watch on TV.

History is full of cultures and civilizations that thought the same thing that Americans do. "It can't happen to us." "We are better than everyone else." "We live in the most free country the world has ever seen and everyone else hates us for it." In the end, all of those societies were wrong. America will be no different. It makes me sad really.

I am 34 now, but when I was younger I was a patriot. I joined up at 18. My dad and grandad served in Vietnam and WWII respectively. After spending 6 years training and 2 years fighting in these bullsnip wars, it is easy to see that it is all a lie. The lies and doublespeak are as common as a cold. Many of my brother veterans (and I guess soon to be sister veterans thanks to that coward Panetta.) that are coming home have seen this as well. I can only hope that my generation somehow does what the previous ones haven't, and thats make this country a constitutional republic again and somehow overthrow these banks and corporations that send the poor mans son off to kill and get killed.

Unfortunately, things are going to have to get worse for the majority of people to wake up. When the neverending bread and circus' stop, then maybe people will start giving a damn again.

reply to post by Cancerwarrior


You win major points for using the word speechify. Other than that, sadly you are right on. But then,. that's part of the plan isn't it. When I look at the kinds of things my (would be if she lived) nearly 99 year old grandma studied in high school prior to the Rockefeller education "reform" and compare it to the kinds of things high schoolers learn today there is no comparison. Unfortunately dumbing down the population is part of the plan and it has been all too successful. The really sad truth of the matter is that I think that the majority of Americans currently living are unable to tell propaganda from truth. Don't think for a minute that it's by mistake.

Originally posted by coyotepoet
reply to post by Cancerwarrior

 

You win major points for using the word speechify. Other than that, sadly you are right on. But then,. that's part of the plan isn't it. When I look at the kinds of things my (would be if she lived) nearly 99 year old grandma studied in high school prior to the Rockefeller education "reform" and compare it to the kinds of things high schoolers learn today there is no comparison. Unfortunately dumbing down the population is part of the plan and it has been all too successful. The really sad truth of the matter is that I think that the majority of Americans currently living are unable to tell propaganda from truth. Don't think for a minute that it's by mistake.

Public schools are a total joke in this country. I have a nephew who is a 16 year old sophomore in high school and the boy cannot read. The boy cannot READ! I had to say it twice because it totally blows my mind. And you are correct, it is not by mistake.

When the whole 2012 thing was going on late last year I was really thinking something might happen. Not that the world was going to blow up or aliens were returning or anything like most people seemed to think was going to happen. What I thought about was how the government has psychologsts, social engineers, behavioral scientists etc. who are just sitting around thinking of ways to capitalize and further their own agendas on all of the 2012 hysteria. That thought scared me alot more than the thinking world was going to just blow up at midnight on Dec. 21st.

And yeah, I always wanted to say that word ever since I heard Early Cuyler say it on an episode of Squidbillies one day. One of the few TV shows I like to watch.

reply to post by Cancerwarrior

When the whole 2012 thing was going on late last year I was really thinking something might happen. Not that the world was going to blow up or aliens were returning or anything like most people seemed to think was going to happen. What I thought about was how the government has psychologsts, social engineers, behavioral scientists etc. who are just sitting around thinking of ways to capitalize and further their own agendas on all of the 2012 hysteria. That thought scared me alot more than the thinking world was going to just blow up at midnight on Dec. 21st.

And despite my cynicism and awareness I was on the other side of convinced that something was going to happen. It's only when it didn't that I started to think about the social engineering and mind control involved with the whole issue. But that's a topic for the 2012 forum.

To bring it back to the OP, I've engaged in an interesting thought exercise over the past few years. What if Syria, NK, Iran, Gaddafi, etc. were being demonized because they were actually going against the plans for the NWO. What if they were actually the "good guys?" Now I know that it's not as simple as all of that as even the "good guys" have done bad things, but it's an interesting consideration nonetheless considering the state of the world.

Originally posted by coyotepoet
What if Syria, NK, Iran, Gaddafi, etc. were being demonized because they were actually going against the plans for the NWO. What if they were actually the "good guys?" Now I know that it's not as simple as all of that as even the "good guys" have done bad things, but it's an interesting consideration nonetheless considering the state of the world.

I think you are close to the truth with this statement. I don't think that it is a coincidence at all that these countries like Libya, Syria, Iraq, and now Iran had plans underway to move away from the petrodollar, then all of a sudden the US feels a need to intervene citing reasons such as "terrorism", "dictators", and my favorite, "Nukuler weapons."

When I left Bosnia in 2001 and got deployed to Afghanistan in 2003 we were all told how we were there to fight the evil Taliban there. How we were the ones that were doing the right thing because we were there for the people of the country, to protect them from their former evil overlords. Thing is though, we hardly ever patroled any towns or villages. There were however many times that I remember patroling the pipelines and poppy fields. I'm talking about poppies everywhere, as far as you can see to the horizon.

One day I was hanging around some headquarters guys and the CO. just so happened to be around too. He was actually a cool guy who would talk to an enlisted guy like me without the condescending tone you get from alot of high up officers. So I just asked him, "Sir, don't we have this whole war on drugs thing going on in America? Does'nt the vast majority of the worlds illegal opiates come from these very poppy fields?" He looked me straight in the eye and said some hogwash about how it was the only way these poor farmers can make a living, and we were here for the people. I asked him what about people back home who are selling that green plant that you cant talk about on ATS to support their families and get busted and then thrown in jail for it. He did not have an answer for that one. I really was not the best soldier I guess, they don't like for you to ask questions and think.

I also read a few years back where it was discovered several trillion dollars worth of rare earth metals discovered in the mountains of northern afghanistan. Add that to the drugs and pipelines and anyone with half a brain can see through the propaganda and realize the real reasons the US is still there.

reply to post by Cancerwarrior

There were however many times that I remember patroling the pipelines and poppy fields. I'm talking about poppies everywhere, as far as you can see to the horizon.

Yep. Afghanistan: The 3 O's: Opium, Oil, and Oligarchy.
Not quite as familiar with the subtleties of NK but there's got to be a clever but true saying in there somewhere.

And you touch on another point. I have nothing but the greatest respect for the soldiers, those who put their life on the line for what they believe in. And yet, most, unknowingly aren't there for the reasons they think they are (and that includes almost all modern wars) and are simply being used as fuel for the Empire fire.

So, to someone who has put their life on the line (self-described good soldier or not) thank you and I'm sorry.

reply to post by coyotepoet


If NK had resources for the US to exploit you can bet the US would have already had an invasion underway. They don't have much though, all they really have is a nation of starving uneducated people that have been brainwashed by decades of propaganda from their leaders. As it is though, I really think that NK has leaders far more psychopathic than we do here at home, and they are the ones that are really clamoring for war.

You are absolutely right about the soldiers. I was floored by all the new recruits 18-21 who joined up after 9/11. All of them said they joined up for the same thing. "To fight the terrorists." "To get some payback for 9/11." Before that, it was for college money. Never underestimate the power of propaganda I guess.

And your welcome, I always felt silly when people told me thanks for serving, now I have just learned to say your welcome if someone mentions it. I don't want to say my time in the military was a waste of my life, even though I think of the differences of why I joined up and my experiences overseas. I really met some good people and saw some things in the world that I would have never seen otherwise, good and bad. But it is a part of what made me who I am today and I like who I am so its not all bad I guess.