North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

North Carolina GOP politicians want to make Christianity their "State" religion and have proposed a bill that would exempt the state from the US Constitution and court rulings.

The bill, filed Monday by two GOP lawmakers from Rowan County and backed by nine other Republicans, says each state "is sovereign" and courts cannot block a state "from making laws respecting an establishment of religion." The legislation was filed in response to a lawsuit to stop county commissioners in Rowan County from opening meetings with a Christian prayer, wral.com reported.

www.huffingtonpost.com...

All these people screaming about how the Democrats are undermining our constitution, and then the GOP tries to do this? Freedom of religion and freedom from religion is one of the pillars of American society. In my opinion these legislators are dangerous and are enemies of the US Constitution and should be held accountable as such.

I find this so offensive and arrogant! What is wrong with these people? What happened to "no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States."

This a blatant conspiracy to undermine our constitution and to force a religious state, a state religion on the American people, with a preference for Christianity. But, anyone who denies their "state god" is ### out of luck.

I can't imagine anything more unAmerican!

The bill reads:

SECTION 1. The North Carolina General Assembly asserts that the Constitution of the United States of America does not prohibit states or their subsidiaries from making laws respecting an establishment of religion.

SECTION 2. The North Carolina General Assembly does not recognize federal court rulings which prohibit and otherwise regulate the State of North Carolina, its public schools, or any political subdivisions of the State from making laws respecting an establishment of religion.

The North Carolina state constitution disqualifies those who do not believe in God from public office. The provision has been unenforcible since the 1961 Supreme Court decision in Torcaso v. Watkins, which prohibited such bans.

Uninforcible, maybe. But are atheists electable?

As it is, atheists and alternate religious groups are being discriminated against by Christians in America everyday.

It’s well known that there aren’t many open atheists in Congress or in state government, and that atheists aren’t held in high esteem by potential voters. Some question our dedication to what they view as a “Christian nation” while others feel that they can’t relate to a candidate who doesn’t share the same faith as they do. Whatever the reason, public distrust isn’t the only means by which atheists are discouraged for running from office. In fact, running for a spot in state legislatures as an atheist is outright illegal in some states. Obviously, these laws are trumped by the “No Religious Test Clause” of the United States Constitution, which is found in Article VI, paragraph 3, and states that:

The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution; but no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States.

However, the Constitution means little in these states.

Arkansas, Article 19, Section 1: No person who denies the being of a God shall hold any office in the civil departments of this State, nor be competent to testify as a witness in any Court.

Maryland, Article 37: That no religious test ought ever to be required as a qualification for any office of profit or trust in this State, other than a declaration of belief in the existence of God; nor shall the Legislature prescribe any other oath of office than the oath prescribed by this Constitution.

Mississippi, Article 14, Section 265: No person who denies the existence of a Supreme Being shall hold any office in this state.

North Carolina, Article 6, Section 8 The following persons shall be disqualified for office: Any person who shall deny the being of Almighty God.

South Carolina, Article 17, Section 4: No person who denies the existence of a Supreme Being shall hold any office under this Constitution.

Tennessee, Article 9, Section 2: No person who denies the being of God, or a future state of rewards and punishments, shall hold any office in the civil department of this state.

Texas, Article 1, Section 4:
No religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office, or public trust, in this State; nor shall any one be excluded from holding office on account of his religious sentiments, provided he acknowledge the existence of a Supreme Being.

www.americanhumanist.org...

It's easy to see that Christians themselves can't agree on a definition of "GOD" just by reading the religious forums here on ATS. Some think the 10 Commandments should be posted in public courthouses, while others think that the Old Testament laws don't apply to Christians.

Some want to pull the teaching of evolution from public schools in favor of creationism, and others think that science and religion can co-exist.

Many want to outlaw abortion and contraception and stem cell research and envitro reproduction, while others may not agree, but support the idea of a woman's choice and scientific advancements in the arena. Some hate homosexuals and others are more tolerant.

What I'm saying is that the Christian community isn't unified enough to declare itself a "state religion" (thankfully) and a bill declaring a state religion can only exacerbate more division, even among Christians, little alone alienating those who don't follow Biblical traditions.

This bill is a bad idea, blatantly unconstitutional, bigoted and unAmerican. These religious whackos need to be stopped in their tracks!

reply to post by windword


Just goes to show there are idiots on both sides, holding jobs that give them the right to propose stupid bills like this one.

It is becoming more apparent to me....some Politicians have waaayyyyyy too much time on their hands. And not enough brain cells to fill that time.

Des

Now what IS it with the GOP?? It's not the whole party and it's not something inherent. I know GOP party people in my own area and they aren't like Todd Akin or some of the other idiots that came up during the election making statements like this was the 1950's or earlier. However, it sure does attract a certain flavor of nut. Perhaps we should be thankful they are coming out and making themselves known this way. All the easier to flush that type out of public life entirely.

If these bozos hadn't read the WHOLE Constitution? Establishment of ANY state religion is about as far into unconstitutional as an elected official can ever get. After all, it's #1 on the list and the list wasn't ordered randomly.


* Among Christians, I've never seen any problem with defining God. Not a bit. I've certainly seen confusion among those that 'claim' Christian. Plenty of those running around. Those are also the ones who'll give you dumb, blank stare if asked to recite some of the BIG points out of the Bible. That book their whole belief system is SUPPOSED to be based on. Christians know it very well. Christians-in-name-only know it with a passing familiarity or the level of Cliff's Notes. I think it's important not to confuse them as they are VERY distinct and separate, IMO.

Originally posted by windword
This a blatant conspiracy to undermine our constitution and to force a religious state, a state religion on the American people, with a preference for Christianity. But, anyone who denies their "state god" is ### out of luck.

They don't even try to make it a conspiracy! This is so ridiculous, I mean, I've been noticing that people such as police, and small time govt. Officials have been ignoring the constitution, but really? Maybe this is just an elaborate attempt to ruin the GOP by the democrats... Anyways this bill is ridiculous.

reply to post by windword
There are idiots of all walks of life and in all professions- including politics. Please don't judge all Republicans or Christians by the cloth that a few mule headed morons have woven. As a Republican and a Christian I would never support any government mandated religious system at any level whether that be federal, state or even local level. Our Constitutional right to freedom of religion is suppose to protect us from being forced by the government to adhere to a state sponsored religion. People should be free to make their own decisions involving their choice of religion- or of NO religion. I want you to have that freedom Oh Greatest of the Windsock Clan!

reply to post by littled16


Hi Littled16.

Sorry if I gave the impression that I think that "all Christians and Republicans" are like this. I don't think that at all! There is a vocal few, who muck things up for everyone.

It's unfortunate that this kind of thing makes all religious people look bad, when most really want no part of this kind of nonsense.

Religion is a personal issue that should be private and not held to the standards of lawmakers.

I agree with the post above. Please do not judge all Christians and Republicans by this measure. I am both and I in no way support this bill.

Excellent thread, windword! s/f

I'm barely able to believe this is actually happening, but it doesn't surprise me. Seems like these extremist zealous types are getting louder and more pushy. No, they certainly don't represent ALL Christians - only 30,000 of them of the billion plus...are "Evangelicals" (I think I saw somewhere around here - where's that note? *rumaging* Bah. You know what I'm talking about.) who do think this way.

This seems about as logical as Texas seceding from the Union. Push is coming to shove, and it's scary.

reply to post by windword


I don't think that's Constitutional, it would violate the establishment clause.

reply to post by wildtimes


Indeed, it's really scary. These evangelicals are more threatening than the fear of Sharia Law that they're pushing on us! It seems to me that these people really DO want a "One World Government" of their own Christian creation.

I'm amazed and appalled that those anti-atheist laws are still in effect, barring non-believers from service in public office. Where's the ACLU?

Personally, I'd rather have a liberal moral atheist in office than an narrow minded, immoral Christian who uses their position to force their agendas on others.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by windword

 

I don't think that's Constitutional, it would violate the establishment clause.

These legislators seem to think that they are above the "establishment clause,"

The bill, filed Monday by two GOP lawmakers from Rowan County and backed by nine other Republicans, says each state "is sovereign" and courts cannot block a state "from making laws respecting an establishment of religion."

reply to post by windword


I'm not saying they aren't trying, just saying I don't forsee how it would be Constitutional under the establishment clause.

Legislators try to pass things all the time that violate the Constitution, you see that push today with the 2nd Amendment for example.

So, I don't see how it would pass Supreme Court if the NC legislature adopts the measure. Furthermore, I don't even see a valid point anyways. The pilgrims came to America to practice freedom from state religion, and the worst thing to ever happen to the Christian faith was when Theodocius I made it the official religion of the Roman Empire.

People who ignore the lessons from history are doomed to make the same errors.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Honestly, I doubt that this bill will pass, and if it does, it will go to the Supreme Court and certainly be shot down. But, those laws that bar atheists from service in public office are still on the books, even though they are technically "unenforcible."

This is just stupid, but it's not the fault of Christianity or religious people, or the GOP. This hangs on the shoulders of the idiots who proposed it.

This is a joint resolution in response to the legal action taken by the ACLU.

Rowan County, North Carolina commissioners have been opening their meetings with almost exclusively Christian prayers. The ACLU sued on behalf of three people present at the meetings.

This resolution, being so clearly illegal, can only be seen as reactionary bluster.

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Honestly, I doubt that this bill will pass, and if it does, it will go to the Supreme Court and certainly be shot down. But, those laws that bar atheists from service in public office are still on the books, even though they are technically "unenforcible."

With 80% of the electorate stating a belief in God or a higher power it would be pretty hard for an Atheist to find enough constituents in a given district to be electable I'd imagine.

reply to post by windword


As someone who has always lived in North Carolina I can tell you that our state seems very Stupid most of the time. This is coming from a former "socialist" who thought republicans were all dumb.. I grew up in college towns like little islands of what I thought was truth next to the surrounding stupidity..

I now realize they are all stupid.

I love North Carolina anyway, but I find more and more who ever runs the place and votes here is not representing true republicans or true democrats either way, and libertarians be damned because those in power must always be right at the expense of free will eh?

Maybe I really will move soon.. I'm not christian.. I like christians, but I'm not so I guess this isn't my state anymore. A man without a home?

the illegality not withstanding, I don't want to be around such people on either side anymore. This box has more than 2 sides anyway.

IT'S NOT GONNA HAPPEN! The days when religion is forced on man is OVER, well in the west.

It amazes me to see that we still have many people that are wanting the past. Is it because they feel lost under the light of truth and they would prefer to cover themselves in dogma and all that that is not truth.

Until the Gods return keep man made religion out of public places and schools. It is evil to force your will or belief on others. Everybody has free choice and that is the truth.

also just to add, I do think the American constitution is going to be challenged in the future, yes maybe in court. We wait and see if im right.

The bill, filed Monday by two GOP lawmakers from Rowan County and backed by nine other Republicans, says each state "is sovereign" and courts cannot block a state "from making laws respecting an establishment of religion."

Well, that was the law in the United States before the Civil War.

It beggars belief that any North Carolina state official is unaware that North Carolina lost that war, and like other losing sovreigns throughout history, forfeited many of the powers of sovreignity. The power to establish a religion was, for North Carolina, one of those lost powers, right along with permitting some people to own other people.

It appears that this is not a serious proposal, but rather a bit of political theater pertaining to a pending law suit. Even if it were sincere, and even if it were passed, it would have no legal force, beyond taking up space in a law book. Huff 'n Puff knows that as surely as the law's "proponents" do.

BTW, neither do those state constitution items in the OP have any legal force. What a sovreign does retain is the power to say what the law would be if it still had the power. That's nice to know, but no states actually do have such powers. Meanwhile, even private individuals can say what they think the law should be, whether as individuals or as a group.

The North Carolinians' actual remedy is to call for a federal Constitutional Convention, or to request their congressional delegation to introduce amendments to the First or Fourteenth Amendment. My guess is that the verdict of the Civil War will not be reversed any time soon, and my further guess is that our friends in North Carolina know that.
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Being a resident of N.C. I find this offensive at it's core. I am ashamed of our elected officials, if this fails, I can garantee the author of the bill will not win re-election. I myself have fired off a nice long letter to my congreesman and my Senator and a copy of those to my friends At The Freedom from Religion Foundation. It's 2013 folks, let's get our heads pulled up out of the crap.... If you live in N.C. fire off and let your reps know how you feel about being labeled.

It's stupid crap like this that makes my damn head explode .