China buying Su-35s

China and Russian sources have announced a deal that would send 24 Su-35s, and four Lada class submarines to China. The deal is expected to be concluded by the end of this year, with delivery of the first Su-35s by the end of next year.

China will also get four Lada class submarines, which are upgraded Kilo class subs, as well as signing an agreement to work with Russia on S400 missiles, IL-476 aircraft, and IL-78 tankers.

China has signed an agreement with Russia to buy 24 Sukhoi Su-35 fighter jets and four Lada-class submarines in its biggest weapons purchase from Moscow in a decade, state media reported yesterday.

China Central Television said the two countries had reached the framework agreement before President Xi Jinping started his maiden visit as head of state to Russia on Friday.

Antony Wong Dong, chairman of the Macau International Military Association, said yesterday that domestic and overseas military watchers had been keeping a close eye on the progress of the deal for the past few months.

"With such a concrete agreement, I expect the deal will be formally closed before the end of this year," said Wong, adding that the Russians would deliver the first batch of Su-35s to China no earlier than the end of next year.

www.scmp.com...

So given China's propensity for reverse engineering, it sounds like their problems with engine development and longevity are about to disappear. The Su-35's engine features thrust vectoring, does it not?

reply to post by Orwells Ghost


That is actually one concern brought up by the Russian side.

reply to post by Zaphod58


Antony Wong Dong made sure the deal got done.......Solid effort from him (pun...sorry)

So who are they really preparing for??

reply to post by Zaphod58


Don't you usually stick with planes?

reply to post by Senduko


Usually, but sometimes there's an overlap, and I occasionally branch out to the Naval side of things too. I'm multitalented.

reply to post by Chrisfishenstein


China wants to become the regional superpower, so they're upgrading their military as fast as they can, and taking advantage of things stolen, bought, licensed to do it.

From what I hear Russia wouldn't sell the 117S a la carte so China decided to purchase the entire aircraft in order to adapt the engine for the J-20.

reply to post by Pants3204


Cool, that's pretty much what I figured. 24 aircraft isn't going to add a significant amount of new capabilities to their airforce, but 48 working 117s' is going to be a great boon for their engine manufacturing industries. Before long they'll be cranking out those two new stealth planes in quantities that would make the west blush, and I suspect they will be VERY capable. Not to mention that new strategic bomber Zaphod mentioned they are working on in another thread. PLA Airforce parity by 2020 I thinks.

reply to post by Orwells Ghost


China is already developing a new large turbofan that is supposed to be a huge improvement over their current engines. It will be used on the Y-20 airlifter. What I think is interesting is that they haven't tried to reverse engineer an engine off an Airbus or Boeing aircraft yet. That would give them a huge boost to their engine making abilities.

As the J-15 flying shark is a SU-33 I cant see Russia selling

The Su-35 only to become the J-35 evan if the PAK T-50 will be the next great

Russian super plane

reply to post by Zaphod58


This deal is a little confusing. China, if I understand correctly, is pretty much up with the best when it comes to non-nuclear sub technology. Why buy upgraded Kilos??

Also, the SU-35 engines are obsolete. The Russians are having their own problems trying to develop engines for the Pak-50 that even match the 20 year old F-119s in the Raptor.

Maybe a money issue as the subs and SU's are already built??

Doesn't make much sense from what I can see...

reply to post by nwtrucker


They may have been part of the deal, as a sort of "Oh, add these or we won't sell you those" kind of thing. As for the engines, they've seen a huge improvement in engines after buying P&W, and getting tech support for them, but they still have a ways to go to match up to the more modern Western engines.

reply to post by nwtrucker


The Improved Kilos are stillvery effective in the right role. China has had several problems with their indigenous submarines. Looking to purchase the Ladas might mean they are still/again having problems with developing their own AIP.


Also, this deal is probably never going to take place. China has wanted the Su-35s for years and Sukhoi is in no hurry to sell them after the J-11B scandal. We hashed this out in another thread earlier, I think.

The sale is far from confirmed, and Russia has denied it, but Chinese sources are continuing to talk about it.

Here's a pretty interesting article about the possible sale.

www.informationdissemination.net...

reply to post by Zaphod58


OK, that makes it clearer,thanks for the link!

The J-11B scandal? I thought it was the J-15 the Russians ware mad with China even calls it a new aircraft and not a copy of the Su-33/Su-27

Neither was licensed. The Chinese first introduced the J-11B in violation and then when the Russians understandably didn't want to sell them the Su-33, they went ahead and developed an unlicensed approximation of that as well as the J-15. Neither left the Russians with a good taste in their mouth. I'm sure China is interested. They've been trying to buy them for more than a decade. I just don't think Russia is interested in handing them more technology for the Chinese to dissect, as they're convinced the Chinese will buy a handful of units before turning to an indigenous effort without recompense.

With all the "new" aircaft J-20 and J-31 steath fighters china still wants to import aircaft form Russia is kinda weird to me

reply to post by springtime


Because stealth aircraft are notoriously hard to develop. This way they have new aircraft that are reliable, and already developed.