Can you reject Paul and still be a "Christian"?

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posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 09:25 PM
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Hello everyone!

Quick question for those who are willing to answer...

Can you reject the writing of Paul who actually wrote the bulk of Christian scripture and still consider yourself a Christian?

Books written by Paul (some of which the author is debateable)

Romans
1 Corinthians
2 Corinthians
Galatians
Ephesians
Philippians
Colossians
1 Thessalonians
2 Thessalonians
1 Timothy
2 Timothy
Titus
Philemon

Without Paul the concept of "grace" would likely be absent from the NT... along with many other ideas Paul brought to the world.

So is it possible to reject one of the founders of the religion and still consider yourself a part of said religion?

Yes?

No?

Explain...

I look forward to reading your replies





posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 09:35 PM
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That is a good question. But isn't it believe in Jesus not Jesus and Paul.



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 09:36 PM
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reply to post by buster2010
 


Shhhh...

Don't tell anyone man...

Geez... :bnghd:



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 09:38 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


Dear Akragon,

It is a trick question (I love those). Can someone know Christ and never have read the bible? I would argue that they could. Now, if one has read the bible and rejects the letters of Paul then one must also reject Peter and the other apostles as they accepted him. Paul himself argued with the other apostles that gentiles did NOT need to be circumcised and in the end, they agreed.



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 09:39 PM
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reply to post by AQuestion
 


Good to hear from you my friend...

You know me well... but seriously, no tricks...

Just a simple question

Have at it...




posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 09:40 PM
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Yes because the faith is centered on Christ... not Paul, or it would be called Paulstianatity



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 09:50 PM
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I actually fit this category very well.

I consider myself a Christian because I believe in Jesus...but I don't agree with most of what Paul wrote.

Ironically...I'm a Catholic...I don't care to change my denomination because I have already come to the conclusion that there is no "right" denomination or even no "right" religion. So I just stay a "Catholic" because it is more tradition than true dedication to the church.



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:04 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


Dearest Akragon,

There are those who knew Jesus and never knew Paul. Stephen is a good example of this. Whatever he knew of Paul predated Paul's conversion and writings. So, what is it to know Jesus. It says that many will come to him calling his name and he will say he never knew them. Satan met Jesus; but, it did not save him. Our salvation comes from having the mind of Christ, a mind of love and forgiveness. That is the toughest part, actually learning love and forgiveness more than just concepts and words, they must be centered in our heart. Both hate and love for selfish reasons are idols that prevent us from truly knowing God. Peace and it is a good question.



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:12 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon

Without Paul the concept of "grace" would likely be absent from the NT... along with many other ideas Paul brought to the world.






Grace is just a word for the vitality of the soul. Even if it were absent from the bible its meaning would still have substance in reality.

Also, I believe anyone who practices virtue religiously is a Christian. A man of good will is a man who knows Christ.



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:12 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 

Ephesians
Colossians
2 Thessalonians
1 Timothy
2 Timothy
Titus
You can throw Hebrews into this list, too, since there are still people who think Paul wrote that, and was why it was originally put into the New Testament.
The six I listed here are ones most New Testament biblical scholars agree were most likely not written by Paul.
I think that a lot of people who reject Paul, base that feeling on what they read in those books he probably never even wrote.
As for believing or not believing in Paul, I would say . . No. No one would be Christians today unless people way back in the beginning of Christianity believed Paul, and then went on to write the other books of the NT, including the four canonical Gospels.
edit on 26-3-2013 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:14 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


you can reject all of them

only thing is if your true to god

never let anyone or anything come between you and god

peace



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:17 PM
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reply to post by OptimusSubprime
 

Yes because the faith is centered on Christ... not Paul, or it would be called Paulstianatity
Then Jesus wasted a lot of energy choosing disciples and spending the entire time of his ministry teaching them, then sending them out to spread the Gospel.



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:19 PM
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Yeah you can.

Paul was a murderous psychopath whose writings go against Jesus' own at times.

I don't know why Christians take his words over Jesus'. It's quite weird actually. Paul never even met Jesus, unless you take his own account of a supposed vision he had.



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:20 PM
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Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by Akragon
 

Ephesians
Colossians
2 Thessalonians
1 Timothy
2 Timothy
Titus
You can throw Hebrews into this list, too, since there are still people who think Paul wrote that, and was why it was originally put into the New Testament.
The six I listed here are ones most New Testament biblical scholars agree were most likely not written by Paul.
I think that a lot of people who reject Paul, base that feeling on what they read in those books he probably never even wrote.
As for believing or not believing in Paul, I would say . . No. No one would be Christians today unless people way back in the beginning of Christianity believed Paul, and then went on to write the other books of the NT, including the four canonical Gospels.
edit on 26-3-2013 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)


Actually I left Hebrews out of that list because it seems to be the most debated on who the author was... It seems the majority of people do not believe it was paul who wrote it.

Personally I don't care either way... this is really about the topic, not about what he wrote

thanks for you reply my friend




posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:22 PM
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Originally posted by WaterBottle
Yeah you can.

Paul was a murderous psychopath whose writings go against Jesus' own at times.

I don't know why Christians take his words over Jesus'. It's quite weird actually. Paul never even met Jesus, unless you take his own account of a supposed vision he had.



2013 years later and I have met Jesus. I'm sure a lot of people do everyday. I speak with Him on a daily basis



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:22 PM
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reply to post by AQuestion
 

Stephen is a good example of this. Whatever he knew of Paul predated Paul's conversion and writings.
Most likely 'Stephen' is made up as a composite of the early martyrs for Christ, and his vision as he was about to be murdered is a sort of hypothesis of the vision Paul had when he was converted.
Luke never knew Paul, but knew of him, though he never mentioned that Paul had ever written the letters that became the first books of the New Testament.



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:26 PM
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reply to post by jmdewey60
 



Luke never knew Paul, but knew of him


That is a bold statement... considering luke is known in many "Christian" circles as Pauls companion...

Care to explain that?




posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:26 PM
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reply to post by backcase
 

Grace is just a word for the vitality of the soul. Even if it were absent from the bible its meaning would still have substance in reality.
Grace is the gift from God that gives everyone the ability to believe in Jesus.
Outside of Christianity, it would have another meaning, since the one I mentioned is how it was applied by Paul who made it into a technical term in his theology.



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:31 PM
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Originally posted by backcase

Originally posted by WaterBottle
Yeah you can.

Paul was a murderous psychopath whose writings go against Jesus' own at times.

I don't know why Christians take his words over Jesus'. It's quite weird actually. Paul never even met Jesus, unless you take his own account of a supposed vision he had.



2013 years later and I have met Jesus. I'm sure a lot of people do everyday. I speak with Him on a daily basis


Yeah you never met him.

Praying to something isn't meeting the said being.

edit on 26-3-2013 by WaterBottle because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 26 2013 @ 10:33 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


You said that without Paul, grace is absent from the NT? Grace and mercy was the point of Christ in the New Testament, foretold in the Old and confirmed by Paul's message. Grace is unmerited favor from God. We, who are many, are one loaf WITH Christ. By his stripes, we are healed. We don't merit this and cannot bear the cup of Christ. Adam to Adam is his to cup to bear. Show me how Paul contradicts this.

Isaiah 53

4 Surely he took up our pain
and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
and by his wounds we are healed.
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
yet he did not open his mouth;
he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
and as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
so he did not open his mouth.
8 By oppression[a] and judgment he was taken away.
Yet who of his generation protested?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
for the transgression of my people he was punished.
9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.
10 Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the Lord makes[c] his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
he will see the light of life[d] and be satisfied[e];
by his knowledge[f] my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,[g]
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,[h]
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.


edit on 26-3-2013 by EnochWasRight because: (no reason given)





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