Italys Overturns Amanda Knox Murder Aquittal, Orders New Trial

reply to post by Hatred


Burn her at the stake!

She is a witch.

So do you engage in this role of judge, jury, and prosecutor regular?

You sound like someone who is criminally insane.

If you make snap judgements like this about Amanda Knox, then you probably do the same to everyone else.

Which can only lead one to wonder how many times you have carried out your own little vendettas based on your belief in your absolute ability to judge the guilt or innocence of others.

reply to post by FlyersFan





I have read the thread and I have also read many, many reports and articles

on the case. There are no facts only the reporting of events from many different

sources and 'nationalities' and each one from their own perspectives ( a whole day

in court equates to a double page spread?)


I don't think you are in a position to know any more about the facts regarding this case

than anyone else on this thread (not unless anyone else was actually in the courtroom)


The tabloid press in Italy is no more biased than the American press, or the UK press, or

the press any where else in the world.


Italy have their own justice system like any other country...but just because it's

different from the US doesn't make it wrong, and facts don't show 'it's corrupt to the core'

One corrupt member (who I believe has been dealt with) doesn't equate to the 'whole

judicial system'....Corruption is not the sole prerogative of any one country, it can

be found any where, even in the US


I don't know how you can categorically state that "there are no FACTS that show

Amanda Knox was involved in the murder" Do you have a private line to the

prosecutor?? There are no facts to prove she wasn't involved...


Evidence may have been flimsy at the trial....but the three judges who 'found' to re try the

case took a full day discussing it and didn't come to the decision on a whim, they must

have felt there was sufficient reason and perhaps new evidence for a re-trial?


An analogy

Sometimes I need to read the reviews for hotels....and after reading them, I am left to wonder

were all those people really staying at the same hotel - the reviews were so vastly

different: ....And when I read some of your posts I am left to wonder if we are following

the same case!!

reply to post by eletheia



when the prosecutor in this incident is let go, and attempts made to prosecute him for abuse, then I will develop more respect for the Italian legal system.

I don't have much respect for the one here in the states, but it isn't as bad as the Italian system from looking at this case.

Originally posted by eletheia
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

I have read the thread and I have also read many, many reports and articles
on the case....I don't think you are in a position to know any more about the facts regarding this case
than anyone else on this thread (not unless anyone else was actually in the courtroom)

So we are to assume your view on the matter as authoritive and in the "know". Simply because you have read this thread and "many, many reports and articles"? And then you have the gall to question those who are expressing their view upon it that is contrary to your view? Your opinion carries as much weight as ours in this matter.

Italy have their own justice system like any other country...but just because it's different from the US doesn't make it wrong, and facts don't show 'it's corrupt to the core'

I cannot speak to the validity of the system in Italy, but I do not think people are saying their system is wrong. The instance in which many Americans see it as such is because we understand a few basic principles that we enjoy: double-jeopardy being one. So seeing one our own citizens, being subjected to an Italian court willing to continue the trial, even after a jury found that person innocent, is reaching.

One corrupt member (who I believe has been dealt with) doesn't equate to the 'whole judicial system'....Corruption is not the sole prerogative of any one country, it can be found any where, even in the US

Very true; hence why many are even jaded on the system employed (which isn't that different than Italy) in the United States. To put into perspective, I would be harping on the likes if it were an American case such as whats-her-name from Florida. The jury found her innocent even though many thought she was guilty. It matters now what the "public" thinks, only what the 12 (in the case of an American jury) thinks. In essence, it is a very sacred understanding that we are innocent until the State itself and a jury of our peers can prove otherwise.

In this case, Amanda Knox could not be proven guilty. Her innocence, may it be valid or not, holds.

I don't know how you can categorically state that

"there are no FACTS that show Amanda Knox was involved in the murder"

Do you have a private line to the prosecutor??

There are no facts to prove she wasn't involved...

It matters not in a court room. Puzzled indeed. In modern Justice, a person is innocent until the State or the offended party can prove otherwise. In this case, the State failed miserably with piss-poor conduct and questionable motive. The notion that there was "no facts to prove she wasn't involved" holds no bearing in the court of law.

That type of thinking makes me wonder if you are for people having to prove their innocence (such as many have done in very restrictive nations such as the USSR, North Korea, East Germany) against the State who has all the power of arrest and prosecution.

Evidence may have been flimsy at the trial....but the three judges who 'found' to re try the case took a full day discussing it and didn't come to the decision on a whim, they must have felt there was sufficient reason and perhaps new evidence for a re-trial?

If there is new evidence, that was improperly handled by the court, then yes, a re-trial is in order. If it is evidence that is happened upon or even old evidence that they suddenly want to admit, then no.

An analogy

Sometimes I need to read the reviews for hotels....and after reading them, I am left to wonder were all those people really staying at the same hotel - the reviews were so vastly different:

....And when I read some of your posts I am left to wonder if we are following the same case!!

Did you just analogize a case; in which someone's life was in the balance to you seeking a hotel room?

reply to post by ownbestenemy





Did you even read the post I replied to? 'Quote from FlyersFan post'


"...just the tabloid rhetoric that isn't true and that carrys 'loaded language' in which an

unsequestered jury pool would be tainted.

The FACTS show that it is corrupt to the core. Read the thread. The FACTS are there.

Speaking of facts ...there are no FACTS that show Amanda Knox was involved in the

murder.

(spelling errors and capitals are FlyersFan)


Whilst I know no more than anyone else on this thread I think there are

many assumptions being made in that post and I pointed this out. And as everyone has

only had what has been in the media to form their opinions on, mine are no less valid than

that of anyone else


In the UK the criminal justice act of 2003 a retrial can be ordered where there is new and

compelling evidence. This came into force in 2005 and at least two people have subsequently

been convicted for crimes that they were previously acquitted of. Although this is only true of

England and Wales. Scotland and NI both still operate the double jeopardy rule.


Here in the UK in 2012 new evidence convicted two men of a fatal stabbing, for which

they had been acquitted of 18 years previously!....(google Stephen Lawrence murder)

reply to post by ownbestenemy




Your quote


"Did you just analogise a case; in which someone's life was in the balance to you seeking

a hotel room?"


NO The case is about a murder. But who's life is in the

balance?

US Citizens have shown beyond doubt, both here on this board, and in the celebrations they held when the murderer Knox was released, that they view our legal systems with contempt. They have demonstrated an attitude suggesting they feel they are above the laws of European nations, and as seen here, are willing to revel and celebrate in this theory. As such, I suggest that all US citizens should be banned outright from entering any EU country for any purpose. There is no reason for a US citizen to be in the EU in any case, and your being in EU nations causes nothing but discontent for the residents of said countries, so I don't predict any opposition to this idea.

Originally posted by MiG24
As such, I suggest that all US citizens should be banned outright from entering any EU country for any purpose. There is no reason for a US citizen to be in the EU in any case,

Ban me from the EU, please.

Meredith would still be dead if you had your way, because Rudy Guede was not an American, fool.

Amanda is far superior to your fake royals or the stupid family and the stupid EU rags that the EU sheeple worship so much that they could believe a story by a pedophile one eyed criminal prosecutor Mignini.

Go worship your fake queen and all your stupid fake ugly royals and we will continue not to give a damn about them. Too bad we can't band the stupid EU media for pushing this fake royal crappola on American TV. Like we really care about when some skinny ugly uk chick is having the premature bald guys baby.

Justice has been served, Perugia's system gave the rapist killer Guede time in prison and the Kercher's need to leave America out of their ordeal because America and Amanda don't have a damn thing to do with their daughter's death. Had she not been out whoring around with a street urchin, she'd probably still be alive.

reply to post by eletheia


Justice is a curious thing here on ATS. People, regardless of the case at hand, enter in with highly subjective views and apply their views to what justice should be.

Case and point: Amanda Knox was acquitted by a jury of her peers. The State failed to prove that she was the murderer. In one corner, some here have stated that she is free and clear (which shouldn't be equated to innocence by the way) and others have stated that she should be retried again and again until their "justice" is achieved. The later here is not justice, but mob-mentality. The State must prove guilt, otherwise anyone can be snatched up and convicted at the whim of the State without any due process.

Now, in my world view of justice, the later is dangerous. It gives the State unlimited time to continue the pursuit of someone just because they have a feeling or that they were not able to achieve their desired goals the first time around. That is the basic premise of double-jeopardy and the concept of innocent until proven guilty.

We are not talking about a hung-jury here. The jury did not find the State's argument against Amanda Knox to be compelling enough to prove her guilt. Like it or not, she was given due process, was subjected to State evidence, and they failed to see guilt. That is justice.

On a side note: I reread your analogy and apologize as it wasn't directed towards the case; rather, a post.

Originally posted by verylowfrequency

Ban me from the EU, please.

Gladly.

Originally posted by verylowfrequency
Meredith would still be dead if you had your way, because Rudy Guede was not an American, fool.

Meredith was killed by Amanda Knox.

Originally posted by verylowfrequency
Amanda is far superior to your fake royals or the stupid family and the stupid EU rags that the EU sheeple worship so much that they could believe a story by a pedophile one eyed criminal prosecutor Mignini.

Whatever you say. If you believe everyone worships the EU flag, then you are sorely mistaken, however, one positive thing that has come through this union is greater cooperation between EU nations. I'm sure that given your continued law breaking in the Asian countries, and the speed with which US citizens escape justice there will encourage them to take similar lines.

Originally posted by verylowfrequency
Go worship your fake queen and all your stupid fake ugly royals and we will continue not to give a damn about them. Too bad we can't band the stupid EU media for pushing this fake crappola on American TV.

edit on 4/3/13 by verylowfrequency because: (no reason given)

Gladly, the Royal Family symbolise over 1000 years of history and heritage. This annoys you, because you know deep down, that your artificial, cultureless and morally bankrupt nation wont last half that time.

What has been displayed here is the inherent instability seen in all US Citizens, this is why that nation is so prone to violently attacking other nations.

reply to post by MiG24

Yes, many people around the world look at the Italian 'justice' system with contempt. Including 84% of Italians (I gave that information link previously). That is because .. (drumroll) ... IT IS CORRUPT. Try reading the thread and taking a look at the information provided about the intense corruption of both the Italian "justice" system and the prosecutor who had the Amanda Knox case.

And as far as your hate filled comment that Americans have no business visiting the EU
... Gawd ...

Originally posted by MiG24
Meredith was killed by Amanda Knox.

There is no proof of that. Just a bunch of anti-American/Anti-Amanda Knox tabloid fodder
which the simple minded suck up. And Amanda Knox has been AQUITTED.

What has been displayed here is the inherent instability seen in all US Citizens, this is why that nation is so prone to violently attacking other nations.

I hope the mods take note of your blanket hate statement ....

Originally posted by MiG24
No, justice will be served when the murderer Knox is found guilty and locked away for years,

So .. 'justice' by mob rule ... mobs that are 'educated' by Euro-Tabloids ?? Mobs that don't look at the facts .. and the facts are that there is no evidence. Yeah ... great. (sarcasm)
.

You would say that. Like all US Citizens, you are conditioned and brainwashed by your schools and media industry to believe that US Citizens can do no wrong. This is not the case.

You complain about the American media, and yet you don't think that you've been conditioned to hate Americans and/or hate Amanda Knox by the tabloids in Europe ... tabloids that published errors fed to them by a corrupt prosecutor. Again .. yeah, right. (Sarcasm)

Originally posted by FlyersFan
reply to post by MiG24

 

Yes, many people around the world look at the Italian 'justice' system with contempt. Including 84% of Italians (I gave that information link previously). That is because .. (drumroll) ... IT IS CORRUPT. Try reading the thread and taking a look at the information provided about the intense corruption of both the Italian "justice" system and the prosecutor who had the Amanda Knox case.

And as far as your hate filled comment that Americans have no business visiting the EU
...

Gawd ...

Originally posted by MiG24
Meredith was killed by Amanda Knox.

There is no proof of that. Just a bunch of anti-American/Anti-Amanda Knox tabloid fodder
which the simple minded suck up. And Amanda Knox has been AQUITTED.

What has been displayed here is the inherent instability seen in all US Citizens, this is why that nation is so prone to violently attacking other nations.

I hope the mods take note of your blanket hate statement ....

Originally posted by MiG24
No, justice will be served when the murderer Knox is found guilty and locked away for years,

So .. 'justice' by mob rule ... mobs that are 'educated' by Euro-Tabloids ?? Mobs that don't look at the facts .. and the facts are that there is no evidence. Yeah ... great. (sarcasm)
.

You would say that. Like all US Citizens, you are conditioned and brainwashed by your schools and media industry to believe that US Citizens can do no wrong. This is not the case.

And you don't think that you've been conditioned to hate Americans and/or hate Amanda Knox by the tabloids in Europe ... tabloids that published errors fed to them by a corrupt prosecutor. Again .. yeah, right. (Sarcasm)

edit on 4/3/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)

Blah Blah Blah more pro murderer Knox drivel from a Yank.

US citizens are not welcome in our countries. I would have thought this would be clear to you, but still you come here and pollute our countries with your presence. You genuinely are the thickest grouping of living creatures anywhere on earth.

reply to post by MiG24


The truth is, Amanda won't be going anywhere because there isn't any evidence to convict her. It doesn't exist.

Prosecutor Mignini's story is preposterous. How the Kercher's could fall for such an impossible story is beyond me, but perhaps the same flawed family mindset is what led to Merideth's death.

Even if she is convicted, she has such strong support that extradition would be nearly impossible. Worst case scenario for her would be a travel ban.

Gloat all you like, but in the end the story will end and nothing will change.

Originally posted by verylowfrequency
reply to post by MiG24

 

The truth is, Amanda won't be going anywhere because there isn't any evidence to convict her. It doesn't exist.

Prosecutor Mingini's story is preposterous. How the Kercher's could fall for such an impossible story is beyond me, but perhaps the same flawed family mindset is what led to Merideth's death.

Even if she is convicted, she has such strong support that extradition would be nearly impossible. Worst case scenario for her would be a travel ban.

Gloat all you like, but in the end the story will end and nothing will change.

edit on 4/3/13 by verylowfrequency because: (no reason given)

Refusal to extradite would be seen as an insult to all Europeans and the response would be strong. I would suggest imposing eminent domain to remove US bases from EU soil, a complete ban on any missile defense systems and imposing a large tax on any US imports should be enough.

Failing that, we could just lift any embargoes on Iran and allow them to rebuild their military, allowing oil to be sold in vast quantities at extremely low prices, causing Saudi Arabia to lose business and an energy crisis in the US.

She will be extradited, and she will be punished. I can't wait to see her sobbing her sordid little heart out as she hears she will never see her family for decades.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
You complain about the American media, and yet you don't think that you've been conditioned to hate Americans and/or hate Amanda Knox by the tabloids in Europe

edit on 4/3/2013 by FlyersFan because: (no reason given)

No, I have been conditioned, not to hate, because hate does not fully express just how much despise you and your "country", by a lifetime spent watching your "country" and its "citizens" abuse and # on the world and its people, escaping justice every single time.

reply to post by MiG24


Since you hate Amanda Knox & the U.S. so much, why do you rely on U.S. technology to write here on the Internet? Oh, I'm sure you hate Microsoft, Apple & Google too. After all them fake royals must of invented something worthwhile besides fugly hair do's - hey maybe they wrote an app for your wireless phone. Maybe their dork daddy will buy them script kiddies a prog, so they can put their name on it and pretend for heritage or history's sake.

Originally posted by verylowfrequency
reply to post by MiG24

 

Since you hate Amanda Knox & the U.S. so much, why do you rely on U.S. technology to write here on the Internet? Oh, I'm sure you hate Microsoft, Apple & Google too. After all them fake royals must of invented something worthwhile besides fugly hair do's - hey maybe they wrote an app for your wireless phone. Maybe their dork daddy will buy them script kiddies a prog, so they can put their name on it and pretend for heritage or history's sake.

edit on 4/3/13 by verylowfrequency because: (no reason given)

Ah yes, the standard response of the cornered yank.

Me personally? I'm using a laptop, itself a development of the British invented electronic computer, which was made by a British company, manufactured in China, running Linux which is Finnish. This is the WWW, an English invention, by a Sir Tim Berners Lee.

Nice try though.

One day your country might actually be able to invent something on its own, unlike your usual method, which is just to steal it and credit it to yourself.

i]reply to post by Tnellecxe


What exactly does that have to do with the Amanda Knox new trial - the subject of this thread?

You must be the sock puppet of mr mig24, both new with no other posts.

More fake history and heritage no doubt.

O rly?

en.wikipedia.org...

Colossus was the world's first electronic digital computer that was at all programmable. The Colossus computers were used by British codebreakers during World War II to help in the cryptanalysis of the Lorenz cipher. Without them, the Allies would have been deprived of the very valuable intelligence that was obtained from reading the vast quantity of encrypted high-level telegraphic messages between the German High Command (OKW) and their army commands throughout occupied Europe. Colossus used thermionic valves (vacuum tubes) to perform Boolean operations and calculations. Colossus was designed by engineer Tommy Flowers, to solve a problem posed by mathematician Max Newman at the Government Code and Cypher School (GC&CS) at Bletchley Park. The prototype, Colossus Mark 1, was shown to be working in December 1943 and was operational at Bletchley Park by 5 February 1944.[1] An improved Colossus Mark 2 first worked on 1 June 1944,[2] just in time for the Normandy Landings. Ten Colossus computers were in use by the end of the war.

en.wikipedia.org...

Alan Mathison Turing, OBE, FRS (pron.: /ˈtjʊərɪŋ/ TEWR-ing; 23 June 1912 – 7 June 1954), was a British mathematician, logician, cryptanalyst, and computer scientist. He was highly influential in the development of computer science, giving a formalisation of the concepts of "algorithm" and "computation" with the Turing machine, which can be considered a model of a general purpose computer.[2][3][4] Turing is widely considered to be the father of computer science and artificial intelligence.[5] During World War II, Turing worked for the Government Code and Cypher School (GC&CS) at Bletchley Park, Britain's codebreaking centre. For a time he was head of Hut 8, the section responsible for German naval cryptanalysis. He devised a number of techniques for breaking German ciphers, including the method of the bombe, an electromechanical machine that could find settings for the Enigma machine. After the war, he worked at the National Physical Laboratory, where he designed the ACE, one of the first designs for a stored-program computer. In 1948 Turing joined Max Newman's Computing Laboratory at Manchester University, where he assisted in the development of the Manchester computers[6] and became interested in mathematical biology. He wrote a paper on the chemical basis of morphogenesis, and predicted oscillating chemical reactions such as the Belousov–Zhabotinsky reaction, which were first observed in the 1960s.

en.wikipedia.org...

The World Wide Web (abbreviated as WWW or W3,[2] commonly known as the Web), is a system of interlinked hypertext documents accessed via the Internet. With a web browser, one can view web pages that may contain text, images, videos, and other multimedia, and navigate between them via hyperlinks. Using concepts from his earlier hypertext systems like ENQUIRE, British engineer, computer scientist and at that time employee of CERN, Sir Tim Berners-Lee, now Director of the World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), wrote a proposal in March 1989 for what would eventually become the World Wide Web.[1] At CERN, a European research organisation near Geneva situated on Swiss and French soil,[3] Berners-Lee and Belgian computer scientist Robert Cailliau proposed in 1990 to use hypertext "to link and access information of various kinds as a web of nodes in which the user can browse at will",[4] and they publicly introduced the project in December of the same year.[5]

en.wikipedia.org...

Charles Babbage, FRS (26 December 1791 – 18 October 1871[1]) was an English mathematician, philosopher, inventor and mechanical engineer who originated the concept of a programmable computer.[2] Considered a "father of the computer",[3] Babbage is credited with inventing the first mechanical computer that eventually led to more complex designs.[4] Parts of his uncompleted mechanisms are on display in the London Science Museum. In 1991, a perfectly functioning difference engine was constructed from Babbage's original plans. Built to tolerances achievable in the 19th century, the success of the finished engine indicated that Babbage's machine would have worked. Nine years later, the Science Museum completed the printer Babbage had designed for the difference engine.[5]

So much for:

Originally posted by verylowfrequency
More fake history and heritage no doubt. Computers and the Internet were not and never have been a British invention at least in the sense of being original. Sure no doubt, they copied another it became their own, perhaps as Airbus copied Boeing.

Thanks for playing, come back soon!