The Dead will Rise? The Fairy tales of Religion...

reply to post by logical7

and how will the accusers accuse?

however life works in that existence... I don't know...

As I've said, I have no memories of my previous existence... So all I could give you would be assumptions or theory...

i din't say about witness to resurrection, i said Jesus' pbuh claim to rebuilt temple is shown as said by a false witness. So Jesus pbuh may or may not have said that. In later gospels its just shown as true but in Mark it was a false witness trying to prove him guilty by any means.

I see what you're saying...

You're really debating with the wrong guy on this issue though... Christians rely on his death as a means to be saved, while I rely on his words while he was alive... I don't really care if he resurrected... in all honesty it sounds like theres an agenda behind his whole resurrection... but this is not the topic of the thread in any case.

I stay out of those arguments for the most part because both sides are speculation and nothing more... IF he did resurrect from the dead... great, it adds more weight to his words.

IF he didn't, it doesn't matter either way in my humble opinion

yes conciousness is due to neurons and harmonious firing of neurons.

Or do you think the spirit/soul resides in the brain somewhere?

I don't know.... I've heard many theories on what the soul/spirit is... I seem to prefer the soul having 7 parts combined, which is the result of my experiences with meditation... (chakra meditation to be exact)

All I can offer on what the soul is, or where its located... or anything really on the subject would only be from theories I've read about...

In islamic teachings, the soul leaves the body when we sleep, like the dreamwalkers in the movie Avatar.

I think the soul requires a body for its expression or maybe we are just an illusion and expression of our soul,
like Einstein said "Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one."
then the soul may just express itself again in another form in afterlife.

Interesting...

I like it...

Originally posted by Akragon
These words have a spiritual meaning, yet the religions of the world have turned them into a fairy tale...

In human history there is absolutely no evidence that Anyone has ever risen from the dead...

You are sadly mistaken...

Religion is the fairy tale.

God's Word is truth.

The two have absolutely NOTHING in common.

Religion is Satan's work....

The "Lazarus Phenomenon" is the hand of God at work.

A Buddhist Monk in Myanmar was dead for 3 days...

George Rodonaia was dead for 3 days in a morgue freezer...

Emanuel Tuwagirairmana was dead for 7 days!

Dr. Richard Eby came back to life in a totally bloodless corpse in a hospital morgue...

Ian McCormack is one of the most incredible examples of this:

Ian was night diving off the island of Mauritius when he was stung multiple times by Box Jellyfish, which are among the most venomous creatures in the world. His testimony relates how he clung to life while getting to hospital, was declared clinically dead soon afterwards, and how during this time he had an encounter with Jesus, which radically changed the direction of his life. Link

The Lazarus Phenomenon

Emanuel Tuwagirairmana's has to be the most incredibly miraculous, bizarre and extreme of all the NDE's I have yet read, because he was said to have been dead for at least seven days! Emanuel Tuwagirairmana was born in Rwanda and had been dead for 7 days after an ethnic cleansing attack. His arm had almost been eaten off by maggots!

"...no matter how much one's body has decayed, if your mission is not finished yet, your mission is not finished yet! "GO BACK!" Remember Lazarus? LINK

Nigerian pastor Daniel Ekechukwu physically died November 30th, 2001, was dead for at least 42 hours, visited heaven and hell during the time of his physical death, and was raised from the dead in the basement of the Grace of God Mission, located in Onitsha, Nigeria.

Around 2:00 A.M. Saturday morning, the mortician, who lived next to the mortuary, was disturbed by songs of worship coming from inside his mortuary, which stopped as soon as approached the mortuary doorway. Upon searching for the music’s source in his mortuary, he noticed light emanating from the face of Daniel’s corpse. This completely unnerved him.

The Resurrection of Pastor Daniel Ekechukwu

The Daniel Ekechukwu Reports
Answering Skeptics on the Resurrection of Daniel Ekechukwu
Concerning the Resurrection of Daniel Ekechukwu

"Dr. Rodonaia was a vocal Soviet dissident killed by the KGB, pronounced dead, taken to a freezer vault in the morgue for three days and returned to life during his own autopsy. Dr. Rodonaia was a psychiatric researcher who worked for the KGB and later became a dissident. He was a scientist trained in historical materialism and did not believe in God." Of all the cases I have investigated in my 26 years of work in the field, his is the most dramatic, the longest, the most evidential, and the most soul-stirring. LINK

Dr. Richard Eby was a professor and obstetrician who fell off a second story balcony in Chicago and hit his head and died instantly and found himself in Paradise.

"Jesus, where am I？I gasped！ Suddenly in a new body in a new place with new life, I was ecstatically joyful: no pain, no tears, no sorrow, no memory. Instantly, before I could complete my query, that same Voice in a tone of gentle thunder echoed within my head:　"Didn’t you read my book？‘This day shalt thou be with Me in Paradise！’

When he came back to a bloodless corpse in the hospital morgue, the atheist Doctor who was in the room refused to believe he was alive and told him to 'shut up and don't give me any of that #' because he knew that Eby had been taken into the hospital as a totally bloodless dead body. Caught Up Into Paradise

"Yeshua began His answer: "If you had read My Book you would have known all the answers."

"In fact, everything that My children need to know about how God thinks and works and judges and rewards, either before or after the Cross, is already in My Book. That is why I commanded mankind to ‘engrave My Words upon their hearts,’ and to pass them along from generation to generation. I wanted everyone to hear and know just Who I AM, the Messiah, their one hope of Salvation, their Most High God."

Dr. Richard Eby dies, visits heaven, and returns with a startling message

reply to post by Murgatroid

A Buddhist Monk in Myanmar was dead for 3 days...

George Rodonaia was dead for 3 days in a morgue freezer...

Emanuel Tuwagirairmana was dead for 7 days!

Dr. Richard Eby came back to life in a totally bloodless corpse in a hospital morgue...

Ian McCormack is one of the most incredible examples of this:

I think his might be the first time you've replied to me where I have nothing...

Its very possible these people weren't actually dead... Though im not about to call these people liars either...

there Is a vast difference between "near death" and death of the brain... where the internal structure of said organ starts to break down...

And again, we're talking about corpses.... people that have been dead for decades, maybe even centuries jumping out of their graves...

Which is not the same as a person who has recently died so to speak...

Good post though... a star for you

reply to post by Murgatroid


I suggest you make this into a thread in Paranormal called "Raised from the Dead" - it will make front page guaranteed.

reply to post by Lionhearte

Isaiah 26:19
"But your dead will live, LORD; their bodies will rise-- let those who dwell in the dust wake up and shout for joy-- your dew is like the dew of the morning; the earth will give birth to her dead."

This is referring to the resurrection of the dead in order to receive their rewards / punishment.

Its like what Daniel was told towards the end of his chapter...
You will rest, and then at the end of the days, you will rise again to receive the inheritance set aside for you.”

reply to post by Akragon


Christ's reference in verse 25 is about the spiritually dead, not the physically dead.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by Akragon

 

Christ's reference in verse 25 is about the spiritually dead, not the physically dead.

I realise that... and i'll refer you to my reply to Jmdewey

Kinda backs my point doesn't it.... The dead do not return to life...

reply to post by Akragon


He was talking about the spirit being immortal. Not the body. You are certainly more than your body. You will never find evidence of this except by looking within. Being buried in a grave is not the end at all. Death is when we go to our real home.

reply to post by Cancerwarrior


Preachin to the choir my friend...

reply to post by NOTurTypical

Christ's reference in verse 25 is about the spiritually dead, not the physically dead.

Thanks for exposing the fraudulent claim of your cult as being literalist.
Seems you are happy to throw overboard anything that inconveniently interferes with your cult's pet theory on the rapture.
To chuck out any mention of Jesus' authority as being so much figurative rhetoric.
Seems the reality of your cult's methodology is to pick and choose what to decide is literal or not, depending on how that decision will support the theory you already decided was right because that is what you were told to believe in by the cult leaders.

Originally posted by Akragon
The dead do not return to life...

Jesus disagrees...

Jesus came, although the doors were locked, and stood in their midst and said, “Peace be with you.” Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here and see my hands, and bring your hand and put it into my side, and do not be unbelieving, but believe.” Thomas answered and said to him, “My Lord and my God!” Jesus said to him, “Have you come to believe because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and have believed.”

The resurrection of Jesus, Lazarus, and countless others are proof that death IS in fact reversible.

Dave Roberson has raised 30+ people from the dead.

T.L. Osborne has raised over 100 people from the dead in Africa.

Smith Wigglesworth raised at least 25 people from the dead including his wife.

David Hogan's ministry in Mexico has raised over 400 people from the dead!

"From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things ... and be killed, and be raised again the third day." Matthew 16:21 (Mark 8:31)

Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die.

Do you believe this?" She said to Him, "Yes, Lord, I believe that You are the Christ, the Son of God, who is to come into the world." - John 11

reply to post by Lionhearte


All ofyour quotes about people rising just proves to me that they were all whackos imo.

reply to post by Cancerwarrior

He was talking about the spirit being immortal. Not the body.

Is that just a guess?

You are certainly more than your body. You will never find evidence of this except by looking within. Being buried in a grave is not the end at all. Death is when we go to our real home.

Jesus is saying being buried in a grave is not the end, that at some point those in the grave will be caused to come to life for judgment.

reply to post by Akragon

I see what you're saying... You're really debating with the wrong guy on this issue though... Christians rely on his death as a means to be saved, while I rely on his words while he was alive... I don't really care if he resurrected... in all honesty it sounds like theres an agenda behind his whole resurrection... but this is not the topic of the thread in any case.

i don't want to debate with you and i like your opinion about it. I had just mentioned it in passing and said that its not the topic but you had asked me the verses

All I can offer on what the soul is, or
where its located... or anything really
on the subject would only be from
theories I've read about...

ofcourse we don't know much about that and most is speculation.

The topic is walking dead which i think has never happened except in movies.
Resurrection with a body is another topic and as we have discussed on another thread Jesus pbuh talked about having wine in afterlife and its hard to take it metaphorically and for it to be literal it would need a body. He also talked about houses in nextlife.

Originally posted by adjensen
Well...

a) God is omnipotent, so he could certainly do that if he wanted to

and

b) Most Christians don't believe that their existing body is required for resurrection, so I think you're confusing terminology. If you read Paul, he talks about putting on a body of incorruptibility, not about fixing the old one.

See The Risen Body Will Be Incorruptible, Glorious, Full of Dynamism, and Spiritual by Pope John Paul II.

The upshot, of course, is in favour of people who are concerned that being cremated (or otherwise having their physical body destroyed) would preclude one from being resurrected.

you may wish to real-ise that pope john paul 2 is not really to be trusted.

The Fatima Hoax and the Staged Shooting of Pope John Paul II.

or you may not.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by Lionhearte

 

Isaiah 26:19
"But your dead will live, LORD; their bodies will rise-- let those who dwell in the dust wake up and shout for joy-- your dew is like the dew of the morning; the earth will give birth to her dead."

This is referring to the resurrection of the dead in order to receive their rewards / punishment.

Its like what Daniel was told towards the end of his chapter...
You will rest, and then at the end of the days, you will rise again to receive the inheritance set aside for you.”

And in a passage just prior, in Revelation, the tribes of Israel are risen, and sealed, an 144 thousand. Unto them are given white raments, and asked to wait a season longer.

Do these passages, when taken together, mean that heaven and hell as being an instantaneous event upon death, are untrue? One can take from these passages that, until the Great Day of Judgement, that no man enter heaven or hell, but that they rest a time until Jesus returns. A sort of purgatory, if you will.

If this is the case, then what of those who claim near death experiences where they have been one place or another?

Furthermore, even the Bible itself says Satan was cast down to Earth, and he and his angels are among men. Does this mean that Satan himself has not yet even entered the gates of Hell? From all I have read and understand, no man no soul, nor Satan, nor demon, has been to Hell nor to Heaven, but only Jesus. It is not until Revelation that a star falls from heaven, and unto him is given the key to the pit into which Satan is cast.

And, last but not least, to interject a question to the thread in general, if creamation or destruction of the body were to interfere with Judgement Day, what of those poor people who, through no fault of their own, die in horrible accidents such as fires, volcanoes, earthquakes, or even murders? Are all if these multitudes damned to hell and preselected before death, so they don't matter anyway? I find that hard to believe. The very thought itself is ignorant and unfair to those innocents.

Originally posted by Akragon

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by Akragon

 

Christ's reference in verse 25 is about the spiritually dead, not the physically dead.

I realise that... and i'll refer you to my reply to Jmdewey

Kinda backs my point doesn't it.... The dead do not return to life...

Not yet.

The resurrection of all people is at the end.

Originally posted by OutonaLimb
you may wish to real-ise that pope john paul 2 is not really to be trusted.

The Fatima Hoax and the Staged Shooting of Pope John Paul II.

or you may not.

I am not your garden variety Catholic and I've had my fill of irrational anti-Catholic blathering in the three million other threads on ATS focused on it, so no, I am not interested in yours.

reply to post by Libertygal

. . . what of those poor people who, through no fault of their own, die in horrible accidents such as fires . . .

I'm sure that no one on this thread thinks that is a factor.
One person was arguing that if you believe Paul's statement in the New Testament, then the logical (to that poster) conclusion would be that cremation disqualifies one for resurrection.
He was just using that as a tool to ridicule the authority of the Bible.

I once was dead, but now I am risen. Or more like I die so many times not so many people can perceive that many deaths that quickly. What happens every heart beat? What happens every time we sneeze? What happens every time we think? Do you define death as the primitives did? What happens every time our lungs collapse? What is the difference between sleeping and death? How long before we die do we sleep to be considered to be in a coma?