Cyprus, Troika (ECB) Agree to Bail-in March 24, 2013

reply to post by FissionSurplus


it is bizarre to me how the whole system works. I've studied up on it the best I can, and it just seems funny to me how everything works off of........well, an illusion I suppose.

Originally posted by solongandgoodnight
reply to post by FissionSurplus

 

it is bizarre to me how the whole system works. I've studied up on it the best I can, and it just seems funny to me how everything works off of........well, an illusion I suppose.

Yes, it is an illusion. Has been for a long time, unfortunately. As long as the illusion is supported by TPTB, and we are told that all is well and our economy is "recovering" and we're "safe" from the financial evils that plague the rest of the world, we can go along with our daily lives and assume that everything is fine.

I see Cyprus as the first domino to fall. The latest stories coming out of Cyprus from people there indicate that their economy is frozen. Everything is cash only, no businesses are accepting credit or debit cards because they fear they won't be paid. ATMs are out of cash. No deliveries to businesses are being accepted because the vendors want cash. IF they open the banks, there will be a run on them, and the banks will crash, no doubt about it.

In essence, the entire economy of Cypress has been destroyed. People will lose businesses and properties because of this economic catastrophe....which is when the foreign vultures will come in and buy up properties and holdings at firesale prices.

This is the end result when the IMF comes in. They are the loan sharks of the world. The mafia was kinder, at least all they did was break your kneecaps.

networkedblogs.com...

I like the way Dmitry Medvedev puts it.

"The stealing of what has already been stolen continues."

This is massive. Most people are forgetting that there are people behind those numbers. How many companies are going to fold up once laiki bank closes? I would imagine there's people who have a very short tolerance level that have money in laiki, and once it's gone, they're going to be very pissed.

reply to post by JackBauer


I agree with you, they're going to be exceptionally pissed off. I think that is why TPTB chose Cyprus first....because it is a tiny country with a small populace, isolated on all sides by water.

It seems to me that this is a beta test. So far, the test is going very well, as far as certain elites are concerned.

You said it perfect, things are going to get dicey. This is definitly not a one time thing. The EU did this as a test. Once they pull off this theft once, they will not do it to any country in financial trouble. Which means America will be one day looking at this same prospect when we are broke and need a bailout from the EU or China. They will steal money right out of your accounts. I do not know about you, but I am pulling the majority of my cash out of the bank. I am going to buy gold an silver to keep in my safe along with several thousand dollars. I advise everyone to pull their money soon. You will regret not pulling your money a couple years from now. If all economies fail the only currency will be precious metals.

reply to post by FissionSurplus

For us, I see a currency crash......same thing as a haircut, only our money will not be worth diddly squat, so it's really the same thing in the end.

If the global economy does go belly up perhaps, but there are many threats and ways this could happen with different winners and losers. Inflation is very much a problem for the US with the paper bills only a small percentage of the expanding digital currency. If the US was to cut back all the big bank accounts then it would quickly reduce all the inflation pressure and avoid a period of hyper inflation as the currency dies through mismanagement.

One thing that economics do not respond well to is drastic and sudden change, it always upsets a lot of things as the rule book is rewritten. The EU has started a game of hot potato with its forceful position on Cyprus and really needs to chill out to avoid contagion. Instead of acting in crisis mode the head does need to realize the long term vision and start with smaller steps towards those aims. Corruption is part of this world and standard operating procedure in many parts, it does need to be reigned in for global stability. When removing damaged limbs a scalpel is a much better tool than a sledgehammer.

reply to post by Tattiio


Gold and silver is always a smart investment, and it has been for thousands of years. There are people who say, "you can't eat gold and silver"...which is technically true, but they're failing to see the bigger picture over the longer term.

We don't keep very much in our actual bank accounts, but we have an investment trading account that makes me nervous, because it's just digital numbers on a computer, and yeah....it could be stolen, just like that.

Things are so crazy, it is impossible to tell what's going down anymore. All we can tell is the direction: DOWN.

reply to post by kwakakev


Well said. I cannot help but feel that the EU / ECB is putting the screws to Cyprus to see what happens...although it is kind of obvious to anybody what will happen.

I am nervous about the bond bubble bursting here in the states....it'll make the housing bubble look like a picnic. And it will happen overnight. Just like that. We're gonna get that sledgehammer you speak of, and honestly, this shouldn't happen. But when crooks are in charge, what else can one expect?

This video is an interesting summary of this whole debaucle, which just came out today:

reply to post by FissionSurplus

But when crooks are in charge, what else can one expect?

That is very much the big x factor in all of this. One persons crook is another persons provider. As for why no Wall Street executives have been charged over the GFC despite clearly flawed policy and profiteering from toxic assets does raise a suggestion that the whole system would collapse if corruption was reined in. Considering the government position on 9/11 there is clearly a lot of things wrong at the top and the world knows it.

With the bond market, since it is tied into the creation of new money a crash here will put the whole currency into serious doubt. Bonds do provide a good way to quickly generate capital by effectively receiving loans through many source. Using this principle while an economy is growing looks to have been quite effective, as for its sustainability as an economy stabilizes has some issues. If the economy is to contract then serious shortfalls will open up, with inflation one tool to help meet this growing demand.

Personally I prefer Bitcoins approach to the economy with the value placed on security more that an asset. What is more important, knowing that my $1 will still be worth $1 in 5 years or left in the hands of market forces, inflation or other political pressure to determine its worth? The economy is very much a tough puzzle as the interests, needs and wants of global trade is a very complex and diverse picture.

reply to post by FissionSurplus


S&F I'm surprised this thread isn't getting more traffic. Maybe people do not want to know.

Personally, I think the whole EU/Euro set up was a NWO banking scam to begin with. This is about setting countries up to get into debt they cannot pay back and then having a built-in excuse to seize their property.

They signed away their national sovereignty when they joined the EU and are now forced to take orders from the Central EU bank -- not the Cypriot government or the Cypriot banks, but a FOREIGN bank that has authority over them.

Americans should be paying close attention to what's being done to the EU countries -- one by one. Because it's coming here. It's only a matter of time.

It's not just an astronomical national debt that's undermining our national credit rating, or the inflationary devaluation of the USD caused by QE's, but the fact that we are facing the very real probability that the USD will be dropped as the world's reserve currency.

When that happens the USD will not be worth the paper it's printed on. Total collapse of the US economy. Then the IMF will show up with a "solution" -- a new currency -- all we have to do is sign away our national sovereignty.

About five years ago (2007), I read an email that predicted the Saudis would drop the USD as oil currency within the next ten years. We've got another 4 or 5 years before that ten year marker comes up.

There's talk again of the Swiss issuing a gold-backed Franc. We're not talking about Saddam Hussein or Muammar Qaddafi, but the Swiss. The NWO banking axis of power is believed to be London and Switzerland/Liechtenstein.

I've posted a number of times on ATS that during the February 2008 Davos (Switzerland) Economic Forum, George Soros was urging the member nations to drop the USD as reserve currency. They voted against him.

Of course, Soros was a major backer of Obama. Clearly, he is NOT a friend of the US. It's also interesting to note that in 2008, Soros was estimated to be worth only about $8 Billion. Now, just over four years later he has more than DOUBLED his wealth: over $19 Billion.

reply to post by AuranVector


Excellent post!

Older threads typically do not get as much traffic if they are no longer featured on the "new topics" board, but that's okay. I don't start threads that often but when I do it is about something that I feel strongly about.

You bring up the other factor in our eventual financial demise here in the US, and that is the turning away from the USD as the currency of commerce. Previously, we were King of the Mountain because other countries always had to have USD in reserve. Now they're turning away from us and looking at other currencies. I cannot say that I blame them. I love my country but, damn, we've behaved so awfully that it is no wonder the rest of the world hates us.

I have family members that travel all over the world, and everywhere they go (northern or southern hemisphere), the general consensus is that the US is a hated pariah and they would love to see us thrown under the bus. I think we're being dismantled, piece by piece, and when the time is right we will get kicked to the curb. We will lose our sovereignity and our place as a world power. As painful as it is to admit, we did it to ourselves. We allowed this slippery slope to form and now we're sliding out of control.

Most people are not aware we're heading towards a brick wall, and will not be until we slam into it.

I have a sad, jaded view, but I calls 'em as I sees 'em, and this one is like watching a train wreck in slow motion.

I had a talk with my mother yesterday, who is in her mid 70s. She is savvy and money-wise, but completely lacked the information concerning Cyprus or how it affects us, because she gets all her info from the MSM. I was floored that she didn't understand it. She wanted to know why some tiny island in southern Europe would affect us. I had to tell her that the banking and financial systems are incestuously linked together and we're all part of the same chain of dominoes. But she still didn't quite get it, because in her mind we're still the America of the 50s, when she immigrated here. This NWO stuff is confusing and depressing for her to come to grips with.

I think many people are the same way. The MSM is doing a darned good job of making Cyrpus look like a "one off" situation, nothing to worry about, nothing to see here, go about your business.

Understanding the interconnected nature of modern day banking, the corruption, and that destroyer of economies, the IMF, is not for the faint of heart.

Originally posted by FissionSurplus
reply to post by AuranVector

 

...
Most people are not aware we're heading towards a brick wall, and will not be until we slam into it...

... The MSM is doing a darned good job of making Cyrpus look like a "one off" situation, nothing to worry about, nothing to see here, go about your business.

Understanding the interconnected nature of modern day banking, the corruption, and that destroyer of economies, the IMF, is not for the faint of heart.

If only more people would wake up.

I am constantly amazed at how (otherwise intelligent & well-educated) people swallow the %^&* whole from the MSM and the Obama Administration. This Admin. has to be one of the most cynically dishonest and corrupt Admin. in the history of this country.

Romney would have made a difference -- he would have SLOWED DOWN our descent. It would have bought us some more time to prepare.

Elites are not a monolith. There's in-fighting among the Elites. The hated Koch Brothers are pro-Capitalist, pro- USA, fiscal conservative Libertarians (just what this country needs) and they backed Romney.

Many Right-wingers dismissed Romney as an "Obama-Lite" -- a very real mistake. Romney would have fought to maintain US hegemony. Obama is an Anti-USA, self-serving, NWO shill.

It's stunning that a critical number of Right-wingers could not see any difference between Romney and Obama. So instead of voting for the lesser of two evils, they let the MOST EVIL one win.

Those critical voters who could have put Romney in the WH, decided to vote Libertarian or NOT AT ALL.

No, those self-righteous ones who wouldn't vote for anyone but Ron Paul or some other obscure person (who could NOT possibly carry the nation), let Obama win. They gave Obama another four years to wreak havoc on this country. It's just incredible.

I have very little hope for this country. The Dems have a good chance of taking the House in 2014, because the Fiscal Conservatives are so splintered. Really works out for the Left.

I posted more than a year ago, that the divisions among the Right-wingers would help get Obama re-elected.

I'm sure the Obama camp was cheering on the Ron Paul supporters and those who would actually vote Libertarian in the Presidential election. (There is NO WAY a Libertarian candidate is going to win a national election. There is NO WAY Ron Paul could have carried the nation.) DIVIDE & CONQUER.

So instead of combining forces to defeat a greater EVIL, Right-wingers would rather bicker over side issues like Gay marriage & abortion, than come together to save their country from a President who is clearly here to destroy it.

Romney was too center-of-the-road (never mind that's the only way a candidate has any hope of carrying the nation). Romney is a Mormon, not a "true" Christian. Romney flipped flopped too often. (Those are the hard realities of a political survivor.) Ad nauseum.

People in the Obama camp must have been laughing their @$$*% off.

No trick was too low for the Obama camp to use. Remember Biden in the Vice-Presidential debates? They knew how to use the Black & Latino voters & the new poor who depended on their food stamps. The Left-wingers could set aside their differences & come together to defeat the Right.

They will do it again in 2014, then Obama will be unobstructed.

Sorry for the political rant -- but it's most definitely tied to the economic demise of the US.

Sorry for the political rant -- but it's most definitely tied to the economic demise of the US.

reply to post by AuranVector


No problem....all rants gratefully accepted. It means that you are awake and are aghast at our current situation.

How many people are awake in America today? If I were to hazard a guess, I would say that 5 out of ten know that something awful is occuring, but only maybe 1 or 2 out of those 5 understand the severity and urgency of the situation.

We are headed for that brick wall. Obama is continuing what his predecessors have made possible, only Obama is accelerating it to an extreme degree. There are only a few things one can do: Leave the country entirely (not an option for me, I refuse to leave), or figuratively speaking, put on a helmet and body padding, and hope you can walk away from the wreck.

Incredibly sad state of affairs for both the US and Europe. As of this morning, the Cypriot banks are still closed, with vague promises of them opening in the next day or two about as solid as a wisp of smoke.

Originally posted by FissionSurplus
...
We are headed for that brick wall. Obama is continuing what his predecessors have made possible, only Obama is accelerating it to an extreme degree. There are only a few things one can do: Leave the country entirely (not an option for me, I refuse to leave), or figuratively speaking, put on a helmet and body padding, and hope you can walk away from the wreck.

Incredibly sad state of affairs for both the US and Europe. As of this morning, the Cypriot banks are still closed, with vague promises of them opening in the next day or two about as solid as a wisp of smoke.

I agree completely. The US is my country, I would loathe anyone or anything that forced me to leave it.
My people have been here since the 1640's, my ancestors fought in the Revolutionary War, the War of 1812, and the Civil War. I despise these self-serving politicians who care nothing about the US or its people.

Greece, Cyprus, and the other EU countries are the canaries in the mineshaft.

Can we keep this thread updated today purely on the opening of the banks?

I have a feeling it might end with clashes. I picked up some twitter news yesterday saying the about 200 G4S agents are giving the local police a drill how to handle these situations also i'm hearing that helicopters are flying over the banks.

I wonder how the people will react.

reply to post by FissionSurplus


They should just jump out of the Euro and switch to their own currency.

I am hearing that there aren't massive swarms of people at the banks, just mostly seniors or people who don't have ATM cards. I don't know if that's true or not.

They have limited to cash withdrawal to $383.00 and no check writing is allowed. They kept these banks closed so they could get policies in place to keep the public from closing their funds. They say it's for protection for the people (you mean, FROM the people, those crooks!)

Those poor people. I can't imagine what they're going through.

Here is the lastest info on this debaucle: www.silverdoctors.com...

The banks are acting like ATM machines, only allowing limited withdrawals, as was pointed out above.

There are massive crowds, which is why they hired the British security firm to keep things under control. It's a done deal now.

When the banks can steal money from people to prop themselves up, it is not capitalism. It is government-sactioned theft.

Trust in the banks is gone. I'm going to start pulling money out frequently to drain our accounts, only keeping the minimum to pay the bills. If they want to play this game, we have options before they go in this direction.

Originally posted by FissionSurplus
Here is the lastest info on this debaucle: www.silverdoctors.com...

The banks are acting like ATM machines, only allowing limited withdrawals, as was pointed out above.

There are massive crowds, which is why they hired the British security firm to keep things under control. It's a done deal now.

When the banks can steal money from people to prop themselves up, it is not capitalism. It is government-sactioned theft.

Trust in the banks is gone. I'm going to start pulling money out frequently to drain our accounts, only keeping the minimum to pay the bills. If they want to play this game, we have options before they go in this direction.

The USA is not Cyprus.
The Cyprus Banks went under because they invested their money in Greek Bonds.

USA Banks are strong.

Wells Fargo and JP Morgan Chase are the strong ones.

reply to post by TauCetixeta


Oh really? You don't think that our biggest banks are also heavily invested in risky debt and derivatives?

The derivatives bubble is set to pop.

JP Morgan Chase has a derivative exposure of $70.151 Trillion dollars.
$70 Trillion is roughly the size of the entire world's economy.
In 2012, JP Morgan (JPM) took a $2 billion loss on "Poorly Executed" Derivative Bets.

Wells Fargo has a derivative exposure of $3.332 Trillion dollars.
Its a too big to fail (TBTF) bank. WF has been charged for its role in allegedly pursuing illegal foreclosures and deceptive loan servicing. Wells Fargo was just slapped with a $85 million fine by Federal Reserve for putting good credit borrowers into bad-credit rating (high rate) loans.
In March 2010, Wachovia (owned by Wells Fargo) paid $110 million fine for allowing transactions connected to drug smuggling and a $50 million fine for failing to monitor cash used to ship 22 tons of coc aine. It also failed to monitor $378.4 billion (that's $378400 millions dollars) worth of transactions to Mexican "casas de cambio" (think WesternUnion, anonymous cash transfer) usually linked to drug cartels. Beyond that, WF lets its' VIP employees live in foreclosed mansions. WF knows how to cash your legit check, then claim "fraud" and close your account. WF also re-orders your transactions to create more overdraft fees

demonocracy.info...

The JP Morgan (JPM) trading blunder could result in a $100 billion loss, a contagion of its massive portfolio, and even the wipeout of its entire asset base. Even worse, these extremely risky and potentially-illegal actions on behalf of the CIO office and the "London Whale" could be the unexpected "shock" that breaks the market, derails the Fed's huge monetary stimulus, and sends us back into a global recession.

seekingalpha.com...

Last Friday, Senator Carl Levin told the Senate’s Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations that JPMorgan “piled on risk, hid losses, disregarded risk limits, manipulated risk models, dodged oversight, and misinformed the public.” And here’s the punch line: that’s not even the worst of what JPMorgan did.

wallstreetonparade.com...

Wells Fargo: large scale trading in derivative

But among the startling disclosures in the article in The Atlantic from examining the footnotes in its most recent annual report are:
•The sheer volume of proprietary trading at Wells Fargo suggests that this bank is not what it seems.
•A large part of that trading is not in safe conservative things like equities or bonds but in derivatives—the things that almost blew up the economy in 2008.
•These derivatives are hidden under seemingly the benign headings.
•The scale of this trading is breath-taking.
•The benignly labeled activity “customer accommodations” has derivatives on its books with notional risk of $2 trillion. That number, assuming it is accurate, can make any particular trading loss appear minuscule.

www.forbes.com...

I could keep going on and on....in fact, I could make a lengthly thread just on how crooked those two banks are, not to mention their cronies.

The derivatives bubble WILL pop, my friend, and the dominoes won't just fall, they'll shatter. But if you want to believe the hype, feel free to keep your money in them. Far be it for me to give financial advice to anybody. I know what I have to do to survive.