New York state offers $500 reward for reporting gun owners

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
reply to post by Indigo5

 

Well, you're usually a bit more circumspect and deliberate about your replies too. At least, you normally don't reply without fully reading and looking over the material.

Thanks Rabbit...what'd I miss?

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
The Title is the article headline.

Right. Apologies for the jab. I do blame the outlet. Over the years, BS has moved from commentary section on a news item, to the actual content of the news item, and now the Headline. I miss unbiased news.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
What part of fair and even handed was I missing here? I gave thought to it, but decided to run with my second half of allowable quote space for stories here to be the counter-point made by NYS officials when asked about it. As noted, I don't buy it...but I did use space I MUCH would have prefered using a different area of text in for the quote ....because I WAS trying to be as fair as I could in portraying this story.

I responded to a headline and sentiment...As OP author you were the one to respond to. But I mostly agree and in balance of content you offered more than most. In short...my bad...arrgh.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
Scenario? Fine... I live in NYS, my neighbor is a total jerk and I know he's got an old gun in a shoe box. In fact, I even know it's a gun NYS JUST RECENTLY declared within their new criteria for being outside their laws. So what the hell, right? I see one annoying neighbor bagged and booked for a gun he may have forgotten he even had ..and I get $500 in the bargain. NIce deal eh??

Unfortunately for you, that neighbor, if in fact in possesion of a gun that was recently declared illegal, is by law afforded 60 days to register the gun, or disable it or sell the gun out of state. The law allows people who purchased the weapon prior to the new law to keep that gun, even if it qualifies as an "AW" as long as they register it.

And as long as your nieghbor registers the weapon...you don't get the $500.

www.syracuse.com...

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
If you are aware of the operations of New York City police and particular the warrant units and/or Emergency Services Unit trucks, then you know the term "Gun Run". It refers to a search warrant service on nothing but the basis of a report of a firearm in a condition, location or circumstance it MAY not be legal in. They'll figure all that out for certain after the door is kicked down and the guys with the sub machine guns have cleared some poor bastards apartment.

Not familiar with that scenario in NYC, but am familiar with the excess of lawyers. I'd imgaine the "poor bastard" in that scenario would profit nicely from the unfounded violation.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
The problem with this law is that ANYONE can call on ANYONE for this.

Ditto 911

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
Many areas have tip lines, but how many decide to make a BIG new public relaunch of the program to insure everyone possible knows how easy the can score $500. All they have to do is inform on a friend or neighbor.

All that nieghbor has to do is register that weapon and the tipster gets squat. even if that weapon is amongst the "banned" guns, as long as they bought it prior to the ban, they keep it. And they have 60 days to go and register it.

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by Indigo5

 

This hotline actually discourages false claims because the caller must identify themselves to police and the claim must be proven for the caller to collect a reward.

So, if you give them the tip, then refuse to give them your name.....

How do they force you to give it?

Well.. 911 uses caller ID, traces...but more to the point...

If you aren't going to give your name and try to collect, then why call the line? 911 works? Why not call 911 if you are just going to make crap up and risk being identified?

The only motivation for using a hotline...that apparently no one has used in a year...is in identifying yourself.

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by Indigo5

 

I debated with myself as to whether to reply to you or not.
And as with all my debates on ATS, I lost!

Who in the hell is going to turn in gang-banger for a measly 500 bucks? C'mon! The gangs throw C notes around like Biden throws idiotic remarks!

I don't know...the scared girl he was trying to impress? The kid that he threatened with it? You seem to have a strange view of gang-bangers as Al Capone throwing money around everywhere he goes? During gun buy-backs folks trade guns for money...cuz they need it. Folks trade guns for drugs...cuz they don't have money. A boy with a gun in the inner city is not automatically rich, often just the opposite.

Originally posted by jibeho
Right out of the Obama playbook.

The Obama Truth Team

Fight the smears

Report people or orgs. who tell lies about Obamacare

Report your employer regarding Obamacare

www.barackobama.com...
my.barackobama.com...
They want us to become a Nanny/tattle tale nation with everyone answering to the Govt. Period. Plain and Simple. Control Control Control

Couldn't have said it better!

There ought to be a cash reward system for reporting all busy bodies sticking their noses in other people's business.

In a heavy whisper into the phone mouthpiece: Psssstttt....hey. My neighbor clings to his guns and his bible. How do I collect the reward?

Sounds like New York legislation has more money to spend these days then I thought.

reply to post by Indigo5

The basic argument here, all details to get lost in aside for the moment, is a very very basic one. Is it the Government role in society to turn us on each other, to do the work of the enforcement arms of that same Government? Should it be the role of the State to insure our general welfare and security as a people, or encourage us to do it for ourselves and to each other on their behalf?

It really is that simple to me. There is never an argument among reasonable and decent minded folks about the reporting of vicious, violent or predatory crime. At least there had better not be and I will have hard words for anyone who would suggest that reporting is wrong on any level. However, that's a pretty strong set of qualifiers and the mere possession of a tool crafted of steel, alloy and wood does not, in ANY WAY, constitute 'violent', 'vicious', or 'predatory'. It's about as victim-less a crime as visiting a prostitute in an establishment for the purpose. All perspective. In Nevada, they call it a booming business and tax it. In other states, they call it a serious crime and prosecute it. That's just one example of another pure crime of policy and subjective morality from individual people.

In this case, it's about as low brow as it gets though, by exploiting the hard times (Government itself has largely CAUSED) to play people off each other, chasing after direct financial gain for the effort. Snitching for profit, literally.

That is where I see the core issue of this $500 bounty being re-introduced in a new P.R. campaign, on the heels of a law that almost has parts of New York State in revolt over it's draconian terms. THEY don't want to collect those guns ..and why should they? They can get us to turn on each other and save them the manpower of looking for them.

The reason they are really pushing this is because 90% of the counties in NY have passed propositions denouncing the SAFE ACT ie gun ban.

All of the sheriffs of those counties have said they will not enforce the law. The Governor has no pull over the sheriffs so he will use State and local police to track down the tips.

Guess what?

Most of the cops say they wont follow thru with tracking people down or going to their houses, unless they think it's a REAL bad guy/gal.

More games. Sad thing is, how long before these sheriffs get voted out through voter fraud or cops start getting fired?

It is going to get much worse.

Even though most cops know they are there to enforce the constitution, they have families to feed and unless the high courts say its UNconstitutional...they are kind of stuck.

reply to post by coltcall


I had one of those types in my neighborhood....she was po'd about the neighbor taking down HIS trees and she was losing the shade over her pool so she called Child Prot. Serv. and had them investigated....guilty until proven innocent.

Luckily now, she is gone and we are mostly cops and firemen.

reply to post by timetothink

Funny you should mention that. We had child protective services out here once as well for something very similar. It traced back to someone we'd thrown out from renting a back bedroom after things went south between the adults. Our Son was never a part of anything and was actually loved by all involved, including the one we'd evicted. No question WHO called because some details were too specific and they weren't bright enough to have considered that. Still.... It COULD have gone very very badly if the wrong sort of case agent came out on a big power trip. THAT agency literally CAN do whatever the hell it wants to and it's up to you to prove it all different in court later. Kids stay in state custody in the mean time, as I've seen this play out with others.

In this case, we got along with the case worker well enough and she was downright pissed to have been used that way. Apparently she had a couple legitimate BAD cases going and this had drawn her off one of them. So, I'm really touchy on the whole idea of citizen snitch programs and how they can be maliciously abused. Indeed.

It happens more than people might like to consider ...and no kidding on the guilty until proven otherwise for some things.

Originally posted by timetothink
reply to post by coltcall

 

I had one of those types in my neighborhood....she was po'd about the neighbor taking down HIS trees and she was losing the shade over her pool

so she called Child Prot. Serv. and had them investigated....guilty until proven innocent.

Luckily now, she is gone and we are mostly cops and firemen.

Wow. You ever watch the Showtime series 'Shameless.' Frank, the alcoholic father, got angry at his children and called Child Protective Services on them.

Not thinking that he was the father of the children he called Protective Services on......he called from a bar during one of his drunken sprees.

Then the judge ordered him to take a urine test to get his children and his home back. Frank had to take a mouthful of someone else's urine so that when he turned his back on the protective agent, he spit the urine into the cup, making it look like he was actually urinating into the cup....from the back view.

You had to see that series to appreciate it.

Oh, yeah....the series takes place in Chicago........DUH...........

The law on gun ownership in the whole United States will be repealed one way or another....
Your weapons will be confiscated....
If not this time, maybe just a particular type next time...then more expensive fees to have a gun, huntng licences etc....
Slowly by the time this generation dies...theyll have a majority of gun surrenderers instead of constitutional patriots.....the writing is on the wall...."barring a new pearl harbour.."..of course...

Originally posted by stirling
The law on gun ownership in the whole United States will be repealed one way or another....
Your weapons will be confiscated....
If not this time, maybe just a particular type next time...then more expensive fees to have a gun, huntng licences etc....
Slowly by the time this generation dies...theyll have a majority of gun surrenderers instead of constitutional patriots.....the writing is on the wall...."barring a new pearl harbour.."..of course...

By that time we will all have Lightning Propellant Tubes made by Thor Industries....or 3D printed at home....and the flash will be ten times hotter than the surface of the sun.

Oh, yeah....and we'll be wearing welder's goggles when firing these babies.

And we're teaching our newborn how to use these Lightning Propellant Tubes.

And when Pearl Harbor comes back around. we'll light up the sky with burning propeller driven dive bomber fighter planes.

Originally posted by stirling
The law on gun ownership in the whole United States will be repealed one way or another....
Your weapons will be confiscated....
If not this time, maybe just a particular type next time...then more expensive fees to have a gun, huntng licences etc....
Slowly by the time this generation dies...theyll have a majority of gun surrenderers instead of constitutional patriots.....the writing is on the wall...."barring a new pearl harbour.."..of course...

You may be right about the generational thing. There is NO WAY in this lifetime that they take our guns. However, that's the rub, isn't it? When our generations are gone and past ..... what we're all guided by in direct personal experience and having watched the horrible results of some of what's happening as retread ideas now, will all die with us.

Do we read about the 40's and 50's seeking profound wisdom and guidance for our lives? You're right. Neither will following generations look to our time or times we all remember well. They'll just know what they've learned and what we see now is the best it'll likely get for that being accurate. That's scary!

I'm not in New York (obviously), but if I was I think I'd use the local newspaper crime reports to my great advantage with this hotline. Read the crime report:
"Oh, John Q. Newyorker was arrested this morning for petty theft. Let's Google that name and rough address usually provided in those reports. Here he is! John Q. Newyorker from 1234 Any Street in Queens. Let's dial the hotline. Oh hello, I'd like to report that I believe John Q. Newyorker of 1234 Any Street in Queens has an illegal firearm." Wash, rinse, repeat, get all the members of every gun club, legal gun owner, friends, family members, a virtual pyramid scheme of hotline clogging New Yorkers, in the state to join in and suddenly you've successfully and legally clogged the hotline with dozens of calls per hour about legitimate criminals who could, potentially, have "illegal" firearms. System broken and shut down within just a few months of aggrivatiion, wasted time, and silliness.

Problem solved.

You know the History Channel series 'Life After People'......well, two hundred years after people, there we are still with our guns.

Now Kerry and Obama are working on the Gun Treaty with the UN.

This is going to be a bloody fight.

Will Americans finally wake up when the blue hats are at their door asking where the guns are?

Not only will we lose the 2nd amendment, we lose everything, the constitution, our sovereignty as a nation...EVERYTHING.

And lets be honest, these times are not like our founders times.

Most people dont give a crap who RULES them as long as their needs are met in some way. Freedom be damned.

Bureaucrats from 150 nations are ramping up efforts to impose gun control through international pact. Here in the United States, the United Nations Arms Trade Treaty has become the vehicle to drive an agenda that is deeply controversial because once a treaty is ratified by the Senate, it becomes the supreme law of the land.

Last week, Secretary of State John F. Kerry — no friend of the Second Amendment — announced support for the treaty, which calls for international regulations on firearms, including personal firearms as well as military weapons.

During the presidential campaign, President Obama was evasive about his position on the treaty. Now that he has fully “evolved” on the Second Amendment, he has the “flexibility” of not having to face voters again, and is pushing for the treaty.

EDITORIAL: Gun control by the U.N.
The White House attempts an end run around the House

m.washingtontimes.com...

and before anyone jumps in with the old line "its only about illegal gun running", NO....that's not what it's about.

The “Review Conference on Illicit Small Arms Trade” adopted a “consensus outcome document” that states in Article 2, Paragraph 4 that signatories to the treaty would “establish or update, as appropriate, and maintain a national control list that shall include the items that fall within paragraph A1 .” Paragraph A1 includes small personal firearms.

Under Article 6, Paragraph 3, signatories (including the United States) would be required to set up an “effective, transparent and predictable national control system regulating the transfer of conventional arms .”

Once again, “conventional arms” would include civilian firearms protected by the Second Amendment.

Article 8, Paragraph 2 requires countries to “put in place adequate measures that will allow them, where necessary, to monitor and control imports of items covered by the scope of this Treaty.”

This could prevent U.S. gun owners from buying foreign guns and parts. Other provisions of the document “underscored efforts in marking, record-keeping and cooperation in tracing small arms .”

Tracing weapons is legalese for the creation of a gun registry.

So what do you think?

Anyone stupid enough to take the $500 blood money is buying their own death. One need only see how NY released the names of people who are gun owners, to realize that someone will release the names of those who reported their neighbors, If painting a target on your forehead is what you want, I suspect that some irate gun owner that has been ratted will take that shot. Is your life worth only $500?