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A Message to George W. Bush and Dick Cheney From a Dying Veteran

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posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 09:28 AM
The idea that the government would abandon its vetrans probably never entered the minds of those who signed up for service after 9/11.
The vets deserve better than what they get...never mind ww2 ww1 and all the past wars....
If one vet feels this way. i am sure there are fact i know vets who have similar tales of neglect.
We have simply lost any sort of humanity in the domination consumes their every thoght.....
They consider ALL of us as mere numbers not people..............

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 09:34 AM
reply to post by jjkenobi

lol.. yes because when a new president over takes the office, everything resets to 0. wait it didn't, Obama got the job with country in a turmoil, depression, and on going war(multiple unneeded war) the was in so deep sht that you can't pull out the next day because of repercussion of what bush did.

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 10:50 AM
do not forget, bush pushed the bill through before he left office
preventing him and others from being held liable for any war crimes.
It has been a while, but it was his last year in office, and it was one
bill that was put through that really stuck in my head and made me wonder
what else is there that we dont know about.

So any idea's of bringing him up on charges for war crimes, or anything
is a waste of time, he covered his butt before he left office.

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 11:14 AM
reply to post by stirling

I admit that many vets get the dirty end of the stick. American politicians really should do more for them.

I am lucky as I fall under AW2. Army Wounded Warrior Project. I get job training and placement, priority in medical treatment, and a rep that calls me weekly to see how I am (just to chew the fat so to speak, not a formal status update). He has connections, researches for information, helps me in dozens of ways.

I do not know why the army failed this soldier (and many others). Local staff, extent of injuries, lack of trying on his part. Many things go into the mix when it comes to the VA system.

I admit I have a chip on my shoulder against many current and former soldiers. Many joined to serve their country and many joined to earn a living. They served with honor and distinction (for the most part). Others, like this guy, joined for college money and a job he wasn't qualified for, got injured, and then denounces the service. He wanted to be a journalist and he was a desk jockey at Kinko's? How do you expect that situation to work out?

It just gets under my skin when people HATE all soldiers, until a soldier speaks out against the service (actually its just against Bush/Cheney). If this guy blamed Obama and said he was the cause of his injuries (for instance if he had been shot in an undeclared/undefended country in Africa), he wouldn't get support from people here. He would simply be another cold blooded, unintelligent, brain washed killer. But, he blames Bush so people give him sympathy.

+2 more 
posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 11:43 AM
you guys really need to stop calling iraq a war....a war is fought with armies. this was an invasion by the americans

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 01:04 PM
Perfect justice does not occur in this life.
It occurs in the next.

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 01:53 PM

Originally posted by 200Plus
reply to post by Seagle

I will obey the orders of the president and the orders of the officers appointed over me...." not " I will obey the orders that have been fully explained and that I agree with

Hmmm.... the problem with this thinking is.... and I will let the great Jean-Luc Picard say it for me as he tends to do so well.... "There are times, sir, when... men of good conscience cannot blindly follow orders."

Or how about this one: The claim 'I was only following orders' has been used to justify too many tragedies in our history. Starfleet doesn't want officers who will blindly follow orders without analyzing the situation."

Sadly, our military does want officers who will blindly follow orders, even if it means the killing of innocents. They don't want you to think for yourselves. They don't want you to analyze the situation. They want to erase your instinct of right and wrong. And they will gladly put your life on the line, as you are just a disposable drone, a toy to be played with.

They prey on the young, who are easy to influence, who may not yet understand the world around them, who are used to taking orders from their teachers and parents, and have not yet had much experience viewing the world through their own eyes. And after a few years of service, if they suddenly "wake up" to the truth around them, you can not blame them. Everything happening, the wars, the innocent lives taken, it's all such a meaningless tragedy and some authority should have to answer for it.

edit on 20-3-2013 by Under Water because: (no reason given)

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 02:00 PM
God forgive us all.

I hope that before your time on earth ends, as mine is now ending, you will find the strength of character to stand before the American public and the world, and in particular the Iraqi people, and beg for forgiveness

Bush doesn't have any inferiority complex. He knew what he was doing as well as the pilots knew it well in 9/11. Bush is a stain to American society and he is not the only one.

godblessed people wash stain from earth and these people just make it dirty with a blink of an eye.
edit on 20-3-2013 by mideast because: (no reason given)

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 02:01 PM
reply to post by Under Water

This isn't Star Trek, but I agree with your point. An order that violates the Laws of Land Warfare should never be followed. I do not condone illegal actions committed by any soldier regardless of the nation he serves.

Show the war crimes committed by Bush/Cheney.

Problem with this soldier is he joined for monetary reasons. He wanted the military to "get him out of an economic slump" as he put it. He got shot, that's what soldiers do. He doesn't mention how much he was and is being paid by the government. He doesn't mention that he was part of the 'war crimes" he claims were committed.

If a man walks into a casino and bets everything he has on a hand of blackjack he is a fool. When he loses he shouldn't blame the owner/manager of the casino.

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 02:09 PM

Show the war crimes committed by Bush/Cheney.

I have no doubt, one day it will come out. Unfortunately, it may happen in a later generation.

If a man walks into a casino and bets everything he has on a hand of blackjack he is a fool. When he loses he shouldn't blame the owner/manager of the casino.

True, but a far different scenario. The owner didn't do anything wrong. The same however, can not be said about our government. I'm sure they are far from innocent in all of this.
edit on 20-3-2013 by Under Water because: (no reason given)

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 02:12 PM
reply to post by 200Plus

If a man walks into a casino and bets everything he has on a hand of blackjack he is a fool. When he loses he shouldn't blame the owner/manager of the casino.

Well said , let me complete it.

These soldiers were not forced to go to war. They knew what was going on.

Why ?

Because people think very well in war-zone. At least they can observe well because .Death is not like gameover in a computer game.It is deadly serious.

So , if he has chosen to be a tool in war-machine , he couldn't be complete ignorant about what they were doing.

I agree with you completely , but Maybe he is upset about what he has done and he asked god to forgive him.

+ It is plain clear that he is sorry about it and it also shows he has the courage to talk about it.

+ It is a good sign that one soldier learns that he has done wrong thing and informs other people.
edit on 20-3-2013 by mideast because: (no reason given)

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 03:51 PM
My sympathy for wounded veterans of the war in Iraq is probably not what it should be. Didn't these soldiers volunteer to be part of a government funded death squad commanded by psychopaths? When you SIGNED UP for military duty, what did you think all the guns and bombs were for? Did you think the opposing side of the conflict would be unarmed? Would not fight back? I dunno. This seems akin to writing a letter to Count Dracula bitching about his bloodlust and lack of morals.

ETA I understand promises were broken here, but we're talking about the US government. Should have seen it coming miles off...

"Military men are just dumb, stupid animals to be used as pawns in foreign policy"
Love and Kisses,
~Henry Kissinger
edit on 20-3-2013 by Urantia1111 because: (no reason given)

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 04:16 PM
Yep, you can read all about it in '"...and any other number of antiwar and antiUS blogs.

Yes, this is bad, but you are only seeing the liberal view. For example, in Arizona you still see cars with 'Remember Shane' on them. Yes, Shane got shot...while he was invading a home after a night of drug use. He had a history of home invasion and assault of elderly home owners. His background reflects gang membership, drugs, DUI and several home invasions...but still people want to remember Shane.

When everyone says, "he was just starting to turn his life around", you know the real story

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 04:32 PM

Originally posted by 200Plus
Show the war crimes committed by Bush/Cheney.

Cheney admits authorizing detainee's torture

"I supported it," he said regarding the practice known as "water-boarding," a form of simulated drowning. After World War II, Japanese soldiers were tried and convicted of war crimes in US courts for water-boarding, a practice which the outgoing Bush administration attempted to enshrine in policy. "I was aware of the program, certainly, and involved in helping get the process cleared, as the agency in effect came in and wanted to know what they could and couldn't do," Cheney said. "And they talked to me, as well as others, to explain what they wanted to do. And I supported it."

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 04:52 PM
reply to post by ArtooDetoo

Close, but I'm not convinced. Yes I fully admit that water boarding is a form of torture and that all torture is wrong.

However, water boarding was AMONG crimes men were charged with. If I walk against a light and shoot two people (not that I would), I will be charged with two counts of murder and jay-walking. I will not be given life for jay-walking, but you can twist it that way.

+Water boarding was one of several techniques used by the Japanese that involved water. All interrogation and torture using water was catalogued as "water based" torture. Whether it was water boarding, sleep deprivation (forcing a person to stand to remain above water), or forced ingestion of water. That is a pretty broad spectrum of lethality and severity. Yet, water boarding is among them and it is picked out amongst all the others.
edit on 20-3-2013 by 200Plus because: (no reason given)

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 05:23 PM
reply to post by CthulhuRising

While my heart goes out to wounded vets, their families and the families of those who have given their lives, I would like to remind everyone that our military is voluntary.

I served in Vietnam, as a draftee and my daughter served in Kuwait as a volunteer. The fact that she volunteered did not make me worry less, and if she had been wounded or killed it would not have made the hurt any less.

Wars happen, unfortunately. While we can blame this, that or the other, the fact is humankind is at fault and always has been since the first stone was thrown by the first of our ancestors...

We can all claim to take the high road, being holier than the next, more liberal than the next, more intelligent than the next but there is one immutable fact:

The veneer we call civilization is very doesnt take much to strip it away and expose us for what we ultimately remain: barbarians.

You can claim that you are above all that, but I promise you that I could, in mere moments, strip away all that is civilized about you and create an individual who behaves according to the most basic of instincts.

To deny the truth of that is to exhibit an ignorance that can only come from sitting safely on a couch somewhere and never having been exposed to the true reality of life.

Fair does not exist in nature...fair/justice is merely a concept that man created...a smoke and mirrors act that only comes into play when those of power have something to gain by implementing it.

As proof I give you predator and prey. Is it fair? Is there justice? No...and for man to make claim to fairness and justice is to believe in fairy tales with the innocence of a child.

At least Bush had the balls, had the respect, to visit wounded vets.... Something our current commander in chief will never do. You will see him on the golf course, but never in a vet's hospital.

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 05:34 PM
I don't have a problem with his letter, but I have only one question.

Where is his letter to Obama? Where is his outrage for the current Commander-in-Cheif who continues the wars he feels are illegal?

Until this is addressed, this all feels like propaganda.

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 06:29 PM
reply to post by CthulhuRising

Thanks for posting this. It's a shame that so many people in the usa and iraq and other countries have lost their lives for what? a group of power hungry, ruthless, souless despots. But worse than that, it puzzles me that over half of americans were stupid enough to vote for that little drunk, not once but twice. I see that as showing so many in the most powerful country in the world as fools. imho

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 06:48 PM
Why is it that college is for the privileged . But fighting and dying is for the working class?

edit on 20-3-2013 by openminded2011 because: (no reason given)

posted on Mar, 20 2013 @ 06:53 PM
I disagree on this formal equality implied by some of you between the two Presidents.
Bush did start a war - and it turned out to be on false pretexts. Millions have suffered on account of that. Some of that was no doubt war crimes.

My assumption is that Obama would not have started such a war if he had been in power in 2003.
About Afghanistan - I have doubts, it ties to what anyone thinks of 911.
I personally think it is likely that a certain faction of power did let those terrorists commit what they did (if not even contributed to the demise of the WTC), and that faction is shown to specifically be tied to the right-wing style of Bush and Cheney, not to Obama (or Gore). So my reasoning is that 911 would not have happened at all under a Democratic President. (I know Johnson did not exactly have a clean record concerning Vietnam).

On the other hand, it is less and less easy for Mr. Obama to explain to the general public why the war in Afghanistan goes on at all with US participation. Why can't we simply pull out? That corner of the Earth seems to be quite unconquerable, the British Empire failed at it, the Soviets failed at it, so why do we keep on trying?

Obama finished the Iraq war far later than what he had promised in his campaign and he did not end the Afghan war at all. I think he should have. Unless we all do not know something he does - some global secret hiding in Afghanistan of all places. But then, how long will it be before he shares this knowledge?

In that, his detractors do have a strong point. Although finishing a messy war is not the same thing as starting it, he should have had ample time perhaps for the US to pull out.

Unless history shows later that he was being pressured and blackmailed by the same groups that started these inhuman wars in the first place. Which is possible but by no means proven.

I do not think it is OK to think that "wars happen." In the Middle Ages, people used to think it is unfortunate that you could be tortured to death publicly if your neighbor thought you were unorthodox in religion, such as a heretic, Jewish or the like.
Luckily, in some more progressive lands people had gradually adopted different views, according to which it was no longer OK to do that - public tortures of witches and practicing Jews are no longer looked upon in our times like facts of nature - diseases, storms or bad luck.
We could all arrive in a few hundred years at a yet more advanced state of society where physical violence will be a troubled memory from a barbarous past.

My sympathies to this poor brave man. I hope his next life will be in such a peaceful civilization.
I do not judge him for wanting to end his life or for making his bitter judgment public.
In fact as an American I am proud of him.

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