E-Cigs second hand "smoke"? Safe or not for the non smoker?

reply to post by iterationzero


The TOC (carbon) was probably trace amounts from the heating coil that vapourises the liquid. This is the reason why the coil section needs to be either cleaned or periodically changed for a new one. A layer of carbonised crud builds up on the metal heating coil over time and it's probably a few molecules escaping with the vapour...as has been mentioned, this is safe..you'd get significantly more dangerous compounds into you if you sat outside in your garden and breathed the air.

Here in Norway, these e-cigs are being binned together legally with regular cigarettes.

You can basically smoke them at home if you don't have children and in open spaces where you are alone (not in bus stations etc).


I used to smoke since i was 12 years old, but quit about 10 years ago. I never figured out why you would fool your self with products like this. You either smoke your you don't. Claiming you are a non smoker when you are using these products is ridiculous. You are just as addicted (if not more) to nicotine.

It's extremely easy to stop smoking. You sweat/have symptoms for two weeks and that's it. Everyone can handle that.
Man up and stop smoking or quit complaining about the rest of us who prefer not to get poisoned.

Originally posted by tyfon
I never figured out why you would fool your self with products like this. You either smoke your you don't. Claiming you are a non smoker when you are using these products is ridiculous. You are just as addicted (if not more) to nicotine.

It's extremely easy to stop smoking. You sweat/have symptoms for two weeks and that's it. Everyone can handle that.
Man up and stop smoking or quit complaining about the rest of us who prefer not to get poisoned.

1- People use them because they are healthier, for one. Speculate all you want about the safety (and that's all you can do without a lot more extensive testing) but simple logic alone should tell you that breathing in a little bit of propylene glycol with a little bit of nicotine is far better than breathing in carbon monoxide, tar, smoke particulate, and the many other compounds that make up cigarette smoke.

2- That being said, some people have no desire to truly quit nicotine, but would rather "smoke" a safer nicotine alternative.

3- For others, e-cigarettes may make it easier for them to quit. Because you can adjust the amount of nicotine, this makes it easier to gradually lower the amount of nicotine consumed until there is none. This can avoid some or all of the symptoms you talked about, if done right, and makes quitting far easier for some. Which brings me to my next point...

4- If smoking is as easy to quit as you imply, then why do more people not do it? You need to understand that the difficulty of quitting a cigarette habit is not the same for everyone. People smoke different brands (with different contents) smoke different amounts, for different lengths of time, and have different biologies which act slightly differently to the presence or withdrawal of nicotine.

Perhaps more importantly, everyone is "wired" differently, and some people are far more prone to addiction and habituation than others. To assume that what is easy for you should automatically be easy for everyone else is an idea based mainly in ignorance. I can type well in excess of 80 words per minute with few to no mistakes, and without looking at the keyboard. This is almost second nature to me, and I don't have to think about it at all. I find it quite easy. Can you do this?

How about playing the guitar? Or the piano? Singing?

How about quantitative chemical analysis?

How about quantum physics?

Or doing 100 push-ups?

Or running a 4 minute mile?


All easy and attainable for some.....

Originally posted by angrymartian
I know that around where I live the malls and many of the stores and most theaters do not allow e-cigs at all. Their reasons are their own for the most part but they have told my friend how uses one of these that they received a lot of complaints from others and decided it best just to ban the use of them except for in designated smoking areas. Also the airlines do not allow them to be used on the plane or even in non smoking areas of the airport. It is true that there are fewer restrictions on them than conventional combustion smoking but they are still not accepted in many public spaces.

Also they are getting imported from areas where they are also loaded with other ingredients banned in our area not allowed in them. This has a lot of mall operators and theater operators concerned about them.

I find this quite ridiculous for reasons I've already stated. And I really hope this ridiculousness doesn't become the norm.

While I am cutting back with the eventual goal to quit, I also occasionally utilize my e-cigarette to get my nicotine fix when I'm in places where I otherwise couldn't smoke for an extended period of time.

So far I've used it in not only places like movie theaters, but also doctors offices and hospitals, without so much as a single word being said to me by anyone. Though to be fair, I also do it in the least obvious and least intrusive way possible. I don't hold it like a regular cig-- instead gripping it from the end (which would be burning, on a normal cig) so the tip lighting up is not apparent. I also carefully try to "measure" my drags so I'm only getting just enough vapor to get a bit of a hit-- and 75-90% of the time little to nothing actually comes out when I exhale.


If you literally can't even see the vapor on 3/4 of my exhalations, I don't see how this should be objectionable to any other reasonable person, or "contaminate" their air.

Lots of information here...

CASAA - The Consumer Advocates for Smoke-free Alternatives Association

Biggest Myths

I'm only fifteen (please continue reading, I know what you're thinking), but today on the bus to school three kids sat in the seats in front of me and started using e cigarettes. Not only should they not having been using them on the busses, but it seemed as though one of them was releasing vapors directly from the e cigarette and was talking to the others about how it "tasted". The only reason I even heard them talking was because at first I smelled something really strong and then nothing. A few moments later I began to feel strange and looked over at them and saw them intentionally releasing the vapors. I began to feel very light headed and like I was going to throw up, so I was lucky it was a short ride to school. I am diabetic but this feeling would only have gotten worse as I only have that feeling from a low blood sugar and it wouldn't have gone away. This is probably unrelated, but I later before lunch my sugar was much higher than it usually is. I am very concerned with the use of e-cigarettes by kids of my age in the area I recently moved to. One was even smoking one after finals a while ago and was surprised when it got confiscated and he got in trouble. The use of these e-cigs has to be maintained for other's safety so this type of thing doesn't happen anymore.

reply to post by Chrisfishenstein

Oh snap!! Looks like you better give up eating too. www.reuters.com...

tyfon
I never figured out why you would fool your self with products like this. You either smoke your you don't. Claiming you are a non smoker when you are using these products is ridiculous. You are just as addicted (if not more) to nicotine.

It's extremely easy to stop smoking. You sweat/have symptoms for two weeks and that's it. Everyone can handle that.
Man up and stop smoking or quit complaining about the rest of us who prefer not to get poisoned.

Why do you make the assumption anyone is trying to fool themselves? Most people who are addicted to smoking cigarettes are mainly addicted to the nicotine. Nicotine by itself is not a terribly dangerous drug, it's similar to caffeine, and nicotine has been shown in studies to actually protect the brain in many ways.

The dangers of smoking are the tar, carbon monoxide, radioactive fertilizers used in growing, etc. Inhaling burning plant matter is horrible for you regardless of what plant it is. With an ecig there is no tar, carbon monoxide, there is no combustion period.

People who use ecigs are NOT smokers, what's ridiculous is your inability to decipher between two very easy concepts, which are combustion vs vaporization. When you boil water are you burning the water? Do you call steam "water smoke" No, because that's stupid. Just like calling an ecig user a smoker is stupid. They are not smoking, it's impossible for them to be smoking becuase THERE IS NO SMOKE, PERIOD.

This is not some semantics, there are very obvious differences. Just because you are not educated enough to tell the difference doesn't mean there isn't one. [snip]

Why do you bring up still being addicted to nicotine? What does that matter? You are addicted to food, to air, to water, to human contact, to all sorts of things, why does it matter if you are addicted to nicotine if it doesn't cause you any harm?

And to get deeper into the matter, ecig users are generally less addicted to ecigs, than they were to cigarettes. Cigarettes contain some freebase nicotine which is absorbed quicker and is more addictive than the nicotine found in ecigs. Additionally tobacco naturally has many other alkaloids that are responsible for the effects of smoking, some are addictive themselves, some make the nicotine addiction stronger.

Quit complaining about the rest who don't want to get poisoned? You're being dramatic and silly. Second hand ecig vapor is not poisoning anybody, and until you can provide concrete proof it is, you're just posting bull crap.

You don't like ecigs, cool, everyone has their preferences. Don't turn your preferences into a judgement on other people or things, because you'll be wrong, and someone will call you on it.

What makes me laugh is people's fear of nicotine. Ooh scary stuff! What most don't realise is that nicotine isn't restricted to tobacco! If people are so worried about it they should stop eating tomatos and aubagines/egg plant or drinking tea! Nicotene is naturally occurring in those and many other foods that we eat. It is very closely related to the b group of vitamins (does niacin sound similar to anything else?). There are so many lies and cover ups going round when it comes to ecigs. Dig a little deeper and there is so much proof of the good that they do and very little evidence of any harm. The worst tptb can really find is "we have no knowledge of long term effects". Well I've been a vaper for 2 1/2 years and I know vapers who have been using for 5 years plus and we are all still here and fitter than ever! I'm a moderator on one of the uk's leading vaping forums (planet of the vapes) and every day we have new members signing up totally blown away by the improvement to their health.
The big conspiracy here is how much big pharma wants to ban us. The evidence is all out there and easy to find, but money talks and us vapers are having an effect on the traditional quitting aids and costing our governments a lot of money in lost taxes. People question the ingredients of ecigs but take a look at the ingredients of quick mist nasal spray-fancy some hydrochloric acid up your nose?

reply to post by Chrisfishenstein


Quit your whining. it is no more dangerous than the fumes coming from your wife's perfume.

*** Attnention ***

Stay on topic and do so without the insults !!!

Your post will be removed and you may be post banned.

I debated second hand smoke back in high school. A lot of the anti-smoking organizations are non-profit, and keep themselves in business by promoting biased studies. There is a LOT of money to be made in making anti-smoking and anti-second hand smoke commercials/promotions.

Which is ironic because if people stopped smoking, governments would stand to loose a TON of tax revenue. So, the government doesn't reeeeeealy want you to stop smoking.

One finding I always remember is that milk has a higher "carcinogen" rating than second hand smoke. Additionally, you get more toxic chemicals BBQ'ing in the summer with charcoal than from second hand smoke.

The power of the mind is incredible, most people that complain about second hand smoke work themselves up and manifest physical "symptoms". The placebo effect is strong with anti-smokers.

shadowcloak



I'm only fifteen (please continue reading, I know what you're thinking), but today on the bus to school three kids sat in the seats in front of me and started using e cigarettes. Not only should they not having been using them on the busses, but it seemed as though one of them was releasing vapors directly from the e cigarette and was talking to the others about how it "tasted". The only reason I even heard them talking was because at first I smelled something really strong and then nothing. A few moments later I began to feel strange and looked over at them and saw them intentionally releasing the vapors. I began to feel very light headed and like I was going to throw up, so I was lucky it was a short ride to school. I am diabetic but this feeling would only have gotten worse as I only have that feeling from a low blood sugar and it wouldn't have gone away. This is probably unrelated, but I later before lunch my sugar was much higher than it usually is. I am very concerned with the use of e-cigarettes by kids of my age in the area I recently moved to. One was even smoking one after finals a while ago and was surprised when it got confiscated and he got in trouble. The use of these e-cigs has to be maintained for other's safety so this type of thing doesn't happen anymore.

You should set up a dinner date with the OP. You are peas in a pod. Just the thought of someone doing something you don't like makes you feel sick. I would say way more mental than physical. Please don't ever wear perfume if you are serious about what you are saying.

reply to post by Chrisfishenstein


If you do not want your wife to be exposed to Propylene Glycol, then by all means throw all of her makeup away immediately! Also, do not leave the house!

No wait, most of the products in your house contain it...

Live in a bubble!

Oh wait, but you still have to eat...

Don't eat!!


THAT should protect you from all Propylene Glycol...

Most consumers will get in contact with propylene glycol during their normal everyday life, when consuming personal care articles like creams, sprays, lotions, when enjoying soft drinks, sweets and other foods, or when taking a medicine or being vaccinated against a severe disease.

Also --

I used to have a huge tank of glycol that I used to de-ice sidewalks.

I'm a smoker, and I've tried e-cigs. They burn my throat/lungs more than a cigarette and taste nasty. Also, the thought of inhaling a de-icer doesn't sit well with me.

I don't want to breathe in the pollutants from peoples car exhaust neither do my children but itcs always amazes me how people are quite happy to snipe at smokers and those who use e cigs but then get into a car. Hypocrites one and all.

reply to post by xmaddness

Most consumers will get in contact with propylene glycol during their normal everyday life, when consuming personal care articles like creams, sprays, lotions, when enjoying soft drinks, sweets and other foods, or when taking a medicine or being vaccinated against a severe disease.

Good, we use just about 0% of anything on this list other than "other foods".....Now I don't want to breathe in your stupid e-cig either!

No bubble, I just don't want the garbage you are putting in your system to have to be breathed in by me....Say what you will, but that is MY choice!

The other very intelligent replies (/sarcasm) are about to make me change my mind also!!

"Live in a bubble"
"wear a butt plug so I don't have to smell your farts"

Wow, these are very intelligent replies! I will voice whatever opinion I would like, if you don't like the topic then stay away from the thread!