A Vote For President Bush = A Vote For A Better America

... *caugh* REPUBLICAN *Caugh*

Seems to me that the Bush admin is paranoid in that it believes that all the Islamic nations support terrorism.

Who cares if Iran is building nukes.... they are building them to deter future American military imperialism. The USA likes to pretend it can dictate who can have weapons and who can't.. because it wants to maintain military superiority over all countries.

Bottom line.. Iran has the right to defend itself from american imperialism.. no different than the resistance movement in Iraq... you would be doing the same if someone marched into your country and begun blowing up houses and killing children.

Originally posted by RedOctober90
Seems to me that the Bush admin is paranoid in that it believes that all the Islamic nations support terrorism.

Who cares if Iran is building nukes.... they are building them to deter future American military imperialism. The USA likes to pretend it can dictate who can have weapons and who can't.. because it wants to maintain military superiority over all countries.

Bottom line.. Iran has the right to defend itself from american imperialism.. no different than the resistance movement in Iraq... you would be doing the same if someone marched into your country and begun blowing up houses and killing children.

Who cares WHAT our policy is with the Middle East. Regardless of what we do, we will have a reasonable threat from that area due to the big fat target we have painted on ourselves.

What we should look at is changing America from the inside. No, I don't mean socialism either, because that would do us as little good as it does now.

Let's try to place socialist policy over top of a few hundred years of capitalism, especially with the internal rot so apparent in Washington.

That would be like giving prime slop to the hogs. Overhead til the cows came home, waste, overpricing, overtaxing, overpricing.

Socialism is a nice idea, but not suitable for America, especially not any time soon.

A Vote For President Bush = A Vote For A Better America

NO

A vote for Bush = A vote for World War Three within 4 years, and putting off the vote of 2008.

With the increasing unemployment and poverty rate in this country... something is definately going haywire.

And no corporations are not leaving the country because they are "overtaxed" Corporations make billions of dollars per year.. it's because they refuse to pay an American worker $10 an hour when they could pay some guy in South American a pitiful pittance of .2 cents an hour. Another reason is that in the US they are forced to keep emissions and pollution down, they are angry that they have to pay to install equipment to decrease pollution. So they go somewhere else where they can dump toxins and all kinds of crap into the ecosystem so we all have to breathe it, drink.. or whatever in.

I support the ever growing struggle of the worker.


But I pretty much agree with the "target painted" statement.. we've done it to ourselves. Glad to see that we have reasonable and realistic conservatices around here instead of the ultra-patriot "we are Americans, so we do everything right" types out there.

[edit on 2-11-2004 by RedOctober90]

The growing needs of the worker do not include health care, unemployment, higher taxes, and rising costs.

I was speaking of taxation of citizens rather than corporate tax.

What they need is jobs, not higher taxes (or even the same amount of tax). The way to get jobs is through economic recovery.

What we almost need is a serious revolution or a serious market crash.

This is the only way to fix this country aside from voting for third parties.

But often the jobs are not *there* I think that some conservatives only thought is about this "laziness" they always talk about. Ask any of the unemployed and I am dead certain they would tell you they would get back to work as soon as it was possible. Some of them say the reason there is large unemployment is because of laziness... which is simply not the case.

Not everyone will be capable of high paying jobs, there will always be a different classes.. but nobody then should really be forced to eat out of dumpsters either, especially in a society where there is more than enough.

But as a socialist I believe that nobody's basic needs should be denied because of lack of wealth. Especially in the business I work in.. I see how many products are wasted on a daily basis... it's sad!

If the more socialist system I talk about was set at a local level.. there wouldn't be this huge tax increase. Because funds would be properly managed and not misplaced.

[edit on 2-11-2004 by RedOctober90]

Perhaps, but you are saying two things.

1) That the lack of jobs is the reason rather than a cause of something else. This type of short range thinking is what is keeping us in this political quagmire that we seem to be in with the lesser of two evils.

Try to think more long range.

2) That tacking on more taxes and entitlements will not affect government dependancy or system of government.

Allowing people to get for themselves is certainly the most effective way to go, being that almost ANYONE can do things cheaper, faster, and better than the Federal Government.

Call any State or Federal branch and try to get results. It's worse than the DMV. Boy, I can't wait til Health Care is this jumbled and conveluded.

But there are those unable to get for themselves.. I don't think we should throw them on the street and let them die. Remmember that the majority of people are capable and do "get" for themselves.

I'd rather atleast wait for healthcare rather than not getting healthcare at all if I could not afford it.

ahhhh yes.... All this talk of Bush being so bad....

He got my vote today

Yeha and we will see how many more women and children will be killed or disabled in Iraq "in the name of democracy" I'm sure you would love your house being blown up.. your job ruind.. your kids slaughtered or your limbs blown off... Think about others besides Americans

If there are any French reading this board.. you have my support.. you do not have to go along and do whatever the USA says... the USA is not your master.

Good thing many other nations will abide by this... hopefully Iran does have the capabilities to defend itself from future American imperialism.

[edit on 2-11-2004 by RedOctober90]

Originally posted by RedOctober90
But there are those unable to get for themselves.. I don't think we should throw them on the street and let them die. Remmember that the majority of people are capable and do "get" for themselves.

Correct, but two things bother me as to why you would say this.

1) America is certainly one of the (if not the most) charitable countries in the world domestically and internationally. I wonder what would happen if the American people spent as much on charity as the government purports to. I think we could effectively tie up the poverty problem in America for a while.

2) I'm scared to hear your reason for wanting the Federal Government to handle much past national defense and national regulations and standards. They have proven to be wasteful and horrible with our money (and not even all of them are Republican, by far). That considered, there really is no good short term solution so we might as well pack in for the long haul.

I prefer freedom to slavery, but to each his own.

I 'd rather atleast wait for healthcare rather than not getting healthcare at all if I could not afford it.

Really? Why not reform the system instead so anyone CAN afford it. I pay about $18 dollars a month for a half a million dollar life insurance policy. That sounds good to me.

I'll say it again, if the system is broken, why not fix it rather than adding more complications, burdens, and problems?

Especially when you have very little transparency on the Federal Level.

So you saying democratic socialism is slavery.... Hmm.. my friend in Germany doesen't think of socialism as slavery.. the people have access to universal healthcare.. they tend to be in alot better health because of it. Education is not as costly.. almost all can go to a university/college.. it sort of explains why they tend to know what is going on in the world.

The paranoia of "the lazy people will get my money" must be put aside. There are benefits to be repeated from a more socialist system. Instead of spending all that money on creating slaughterhouses out of other peoples nations... we could spend it on the things I have listed.

Hell, why not use that slaughter money to fix roads and stuff? Clean up cities and the environment?

Originally posted by RedOctober90
So you saying democratic socialism is slavery....

To me, yes. Personally I think of Socialism as yet another workable system. The problem lies in placing ANYTHING on top of what we have already. This will only compound the problem and increase debt, taxes, and unemployment because of the system, not neccessarily the dependancy issue.

The paranoia of "the lazy people will get my money" must be put aside.

There is a difference between "the lazy people will get my money" complaint (which if I recall I have never said anywhere on this board) and wanting to be in control of the money you earn, and the money you use charitably.

The system is simply too wasteful to even propose an idea like socialism. In fact, it's rather silly without a severly complicated and painful transition (which no one wants because it would be too much).

There are benefits to be repeated from a more socialist system. Instead of spending all that money on creating slaughterhouses out of other peoples nations... we could spend it on the things I have listed.

Hell, why not use that slaughter money to fix roads and stuff? Clean up cities and the environment?

Sure, but wouldn't that money be better spent by the people who earned it to, hmm I don't know, PAY for things.

Imagine if we eliminated the IRS totally. You would get 30% or more in take home pay every month. That would be a huge boost to everything in general. Job growth, economy, healthcare, etc.

We don't have to spend our money in either place, because trust me, the imperialistic tactics of the US over the past 50 years has been insane, and costly (i.e. 9-11).

We need our money, our power, our control, and our government in OUR control.

What you propose would only serve to deaden America of life and continue it on the path to distruction (and within our lifetimes at that).

What I stand for is a way to eliminate severe poverty.. we are not going to give everyone a free car and a house.. but atleast people will get the very basic of needs to survive.. It is moral and right in my book.

And I also stand for funding public works projects to better communities.. anything but funding these goddamned wars!

Originally posted by RedOctober90
What I stand for is a way to eliminate severe poverty.. we are not going to give everyone a free car and a house.. but atleast people will get the very basic of needs to survive.. It is moral and right in my book.

And I also stand for funding public works projects to better communities.. anything but funding these goddamned wars!

How would you accomplish the elimination of "severe poverty"?

Originally posted by KrazyJethro

Originally posted by RedOctober90
What I stand for is a way to eliminate severe poverty.. we are not going to give everyone a free car and a house.. but atleast people will get the very basic of needs to survive.. It is moral and right in my book.

And I also stand for funding public works projects to better communities.. anything but funding these goddamned wars!

How would you accomplish the elimination of "severe poverty"?

Alot of it could be fixed with funds that are spent on giving foreign peoples.. and instead work on feeding the hungry inside our country first. I think it is the fair thing to do. A country needs to take care of it's own first. Also... with all that money being wasted on these wars... and I think the military budget could be slashed a bit. I think the government wastes too much money on preparing and arming for "future war" War is definately not a progressive ideal.

Originally posted by RedOctober90
Alot of it could be fixed with funds that are spent on giving foreign peoples.. and instead work on feeding the hungry inside our country first. I think it is the fair thing to do. A country needs to take care of it's own first. Also... with all that money being wasted on these wars... and I think the military budget could be slashed a bit. I think the government wastes too much money on preparing and arming for "future war" War is definately not a progressive ideal.

OK, same ideas, different approach. I'm sure it would be wise to use a portion of that money to go to social programs, but ONLY with a concrete timeline while the money going back to the American people has time to take root (which wouldn't be long, but everything takes some time).

I think my Avatar speaks for what I have to say on this subject

Socialism may work in Germany, France, Sweden, etc.

But what is the population of those countries? Do you really think a country the size of the US will ever be able to set up a working socialist system?

I surely dont think so. We are a capitalist country. Socialism basically (in my humble opinion) implies that the government knows better what what to do with my money. I will never, ever, believe in that.

You can't take my freedom or my guns!!!!

Originally posted by elevatedone
President Bush, a man who honestly does care. You can see it on his face and in his eyes.

He is a human being, compassionate about being president and being an American.

He was our President on September 11, 2001. We rallied behind him then and should continue to do so today. He had nothing to do with that tragic day, I think he did as good a job handeling that situation as anyone else could have.

He is our President in the time of war, we don't need a change now, we need to keep President Bush in office and see this thing completed, won !

We might not always agree with the decisions that he makes, but he is a good man. He is not evil as some may suggest. He served his country as a young man and is doing so again, as an older wiser man.

He believes in America, he believes he can make it better, we need to give him 4 more years, he'll show us that he can make a difference, he can make America a better place.

I ask you to please give your vote to President Bush tomorrow and your support for the next 4 years.

Thank You and God Bless.

Do you regret starting this thread?