VIPR team swarms Chicago Metra train for nuclear alert!

It would appear this was a real hit, too. It's not what they were thinking it was, but it's fascinating to see the detectors are all over and they are that sensitive.

CBS 2′s photojournalist Lana Hinshaw-Klann happened to be at the scene and used a cell-phone camera to record agents in action. Reporter Dave Savini looks into what agents were looking for and what they found.

Sources say the agents were members of the elite TSA VIPR team on the 5:04pm Union Pacific West line. They were carrying hand-held nuclear-detection devices that picked up a reading.

I'd personally call it reassuring. It's good to know they are out there and watching.

Once the agent said the word “isotope,” Jones says he realized he was the one they were looking for. He raised his hand to say he had a nuclear stress test.

The tests can leave patients emitting radiation for some time. After showing identification and proof of the nuclear test, Jones and the other passengers were allowed to go on their way.

Source

It's also good to hear that despite the alert and hit being legitimate, it was entirely benign. I've read about people being alerted on for this before, including a former member of Congress at a border checkpoint. Seeing a full team come on in a "no-drill" mode must be quite an experience though. Especially for anyone like an ATS member who would be sharp and likely recognize the nature of the equipment they were waving around everything.

I think I'd just about lose my dinner to realize they were there in a deadly serious posture ...with radiation detectors. How about everyone else? It would be a memorable experience, no matter what the outcome.

I agree that its a good thing they can respond so quickly. Its unfortunate that it is something that needs prepping for but it is the world we live in.

They may get a thousand false alarms, but that one time they stop one makes it worth it.

Some great questions raised on the article's page. Read them, I'd rather not repost them and associate them with my username.

I don't understand the protocol here. What is the point of walking around the train clearly identifiable as law enforcement, back and forth for ten minutes searching? I suppose the threat was contained at that point, but they were also downtown already. If someone wanted to blow something up wouldn't they just have done it during the ten minutes they were clearly being looked for?

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

So, where are the detectors that picked up on the trace radioactivity and alerted the "Team"? Do all cities have these "Teams" waiting around for nothing? Or wait... what is the perceived threat that requires all this hair trigger rapid response?

OMG, we have detected a glitch (insert sirens) call out the RAD squad (insert batman music), like this is ongoing threat ville because there is not threat but you know, we have this big budget... all these toys... and have to justify their expense. You Knooowww...

Maybe this report is just to make it look like we are always ready for anything. We can't stop one idiot (with orange hair) with a rifle.

Radioactive Man pulled over by police

Above is a news story where a man was simply driving down the road and was pulled over by a state police car that appears to have had a similar radiation detector in it.

It makes me wonder how widespread these efforts are. I have to think though that we'd be hearing about it all the time if these detectors are that abundant. Also, you'd think that with people getting these tests done as often as they do at hospitals, that the police/VIPR teams would never be able to keep up with everyone, let alone a real threat.

I'm editing to add a link below to a different photo on the above article that actually shows the trooper with the radioactivity detector.

trooper with radioactivity dector


The radioacticity detector that the trooper is carrying appears to be this unit below (or a simiar one) from Owens Scientific. If you'll look at the left side of the page, about halfway down the menu, there is a whole section of equipment marketed towards "Homeland Security" including Gate Monitors and Portal Monitors which I guess is something the guy in the OP had walked past to trigger the VIPR alert. Interesting stuff.

Hand Held Survey Meter

I once bought a large amount of Custard and Vaseline glass cullets and had them outside on a picnic table. About a week or so later, had a military looking helicopter hover over my house for a good three minutes until I went outside on the porch and waved at them, then they flew off. Always figured they picked something up from the cullets, if so that is pretty sensitive equipment, those types of glass are only 3-5% uranium oxides.

Hmmm,.
gotta wonder if this guy is friends with Obama.

The government always plays the deny, deny, deny card when subject of this type danger is brought forth into wider public domain.

The sensitivity and widespead use of detection devices point out a capability and higher probability of an attack being possible than readily admitted.

Disregarding a staged event, it is easy to imagine that those who'd like to carry out an attack of this magnitude only have to succeed once while the government cannot ever fail even once.

That makes the odds pretty crappy that this will be seen in our day.

Interesting article for me because I have taken this exact same train many times. I have never seen anything like this before or any detectors.

I don't know how they really expect to scan everyone. There are no controlled entrances and tickets are checked on the train. It's always packed with about a THOUSAND people. There has to be about 20 ways into the station and people usually board in packed groups.

reply to post by intrptr

I'm not sure right off hand where the detectors would be in Chicago or within their Metra system. I've seen many variations of the detection equipment though, as a trucker. Long before 9/11, for example, there was a place in Southern Oklahoma that produces the manhole covers you see everywhere. This particular plant also produced the raw materials in a fine powder, which was melted down into what they needed to form the product.

On the way out and before reaching the gate, the truck was required to cross a small scale (It needed it...loads ran right to the weight limits) and drive between two small plastic rectangles, held about 10 feet off the ground and 3 feet to the side of the path of the truck on each side. I'd asked what they were..and indeed. Those were highly sensitive and fine tuned radiation detectors. They never would tell me WHY a supplier to foundries needed that or what I COULD pick up in their facility that would trip it ...but it gave me a very close look at them before they became common place everywhere.

Odds are.. You've seen them and never had a clue what they were.

I've gone out and gotten some pictures. Unfortunately and maddeningly, I can't find the precise ones I'd seen up close. They were much smaller and more compact that these. I am thinking the ones I saw and had to pass through were much more basic. They may have simply been a GO/NO GO sensor to say there was or wasn't radiation and nothing more for information....where some of these probably tell everything imaginable.

This first one is what they put up when they don't simply want GO/NO GO readings but want precisely what is being detected, where and roughly in what quantity it's being seen.



These next ones are a smaller version of the above with much the same purpose. The ones I describe driving through and seeing close with time to look were about half this size and close to the last picture in the group.



This following unit is what you may well see in a transportation platform like a subway or train area. The main unit may or may not be with it and so, somewhere out of the way and lines of sight, you may only see the tube segment of the set up....which would likely not draw any attention at all.



This is a different version of the same type of system before installation.



Finally, this isn't a radiation detector. It's actually an RFID detector to scan passing traffic for something entirely different. I include it because it's as close as I've seen to some of what I know ARE radiation detection panels on the interstates. They can be seen on bridges and other structures along the open highway in some places and 10's of miles away from the nearest building, civilization or services of any kind. Just mounted to a bridge in some cases...pointing down into the traffic lane. I saw those start appearing in the year after 9/11.

Originally posted by Daughter2
Interesting article for me because I have taken this exact same train many times. I have never seen anything like this before or any detectors.

I don't know how they really expect to scan everyone. There are no controlled entrances and tickets are checked on the train. It's always packed with about a THOUSAND people. There has to be about 20 ways into the station and people usually board in packed groups.

I'm just guessing...but if I were looking around a platform in Chicago to be the clever one and spot the detectors....I'd look at what happened here. They had to board a train with nothing more than the fact they had a hot spot that moved into that train..somewhere.

So...what does that say? They aren't scanning persons..but ALL the people. I'd look around the platform itself (since they knew which train). The ceiling structures and pipes or wiring in particular. See any panels or tubes like what I pictured? I'll bet there is one somewhere...... I'd also look at the entry/exit thresholds where the train passes to enter and leave the stations. See any rectangular panels pointed generally toward the sides of the train?

I figure they have something to do a general crowd scan...it told them there was a hit and I'm thinking, it told them the type of hit they were looking for (material...not warhead type radiation). Hence...they wandered through, searching everyone, since nothing gave them better detail than that ...and I doubt they'd be hand searching if a hit showed a likely tactical warhead. I dunno what it would look like...but I'll bet no one in the city it happened in would ever forget THAT response. lol.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

Thank you wrabbit for the info and pics. I appreciate that the authorities are monitoring the people on some level... for a variety of reasons(tongue in cheek)

The problem with actually detecting a Radioactive threat is the difficulty of differentiating between that and other sources. There are so many of those, false alarms would be rampant. I don't mean with the port of entry gateways or other roadway, airport, etc.

Remember the Chicago airport alarms right after Fukushima? Arriving jets set them off. Nowadays so many other sources also set off these kinds of "surveying" detection devices like medical, industrial, etc.

I use the word "surveying" because these kinds of panel and other detectors you showed pictures of are only capable of detecting "ionizing" radiation at a distance of several feet or meters. This limits their application to detecting only sources that emit gamma radiation. "Alpha emitters" are only detectable at a range of microns to inches and are easily blocked by just a thin layer of material. A box, suitcase, jeans pocket, whatever.

The danger comes primarily from ingesting radioactive substances that emit alpha rays. This would be the chosen type of element for "dirtying" a subway, air terminal, stadium or hi rise air conditioner intake.

Radioactive materials that emit gamma would be picked up by these panel detectors in a moment. Your article source is one incident. Alpha emitters would pass by in quantity. I wonder if I am making sense of this?

A terror dirty bomb would be a cardboard box filled with plutonium say and thrown off a building top upwind above Manhattan Avenue. The dust would cascade all over the city street and end up being breathed by lots of people (any dose is fatal). But that box would pass thru any "gate" or "choke point" detector.

So this report of rad swat teams doesn't make sense from that viewpoint. I can see them responding to intel or tracking a 'source' with their portable equipment, but this report of intercepting a cancer or MRI patient is a little "over the top".

Thanks for your post and all the neat pics. I am in the metals recycling business and am familiar with how important it is to prevent radioactive contamination from getting into the recycle center.

This is a bit long and techy but is good for helping people to understand the differences between gamma and alpha emitters. And how easy it is to hide alpha emitters from detection.

Watch the first minute and the part beginning at 2 minutes. Cheers!

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

I'd look around the platform itself (since they knew which train). The ceiling structures and pipes or wiring in particular. See any panels or tubes like what I pictured? I'll bet there is one somewhere...... I'd also look at the entry/exit thresholds where the train passes to enter and leave the stations. See any rectangular panels pointed generally toward the sides of the train?

Sooo... I googled "subway platforms", clicked on "images' and...

Boingo!

reply to post by intrptr

I appreciate that video. That IS interesting. Very interesting. Basically then, I have something in my own smoke detector that, if ingested, would make me look like former FSB Agent Alexander Litvinenko. I imagine you're familiar with the case and the books I picked up about it to kill time on the truck gave a great deal of basis for learning about Alpha emitters and Polonium in particular. Had I not read all that and how he was assassinated in busy metro London by insanely deadly radioactive material without hurting anyone else ...I wouldn't necessary understand all that.

However, having read it, it's amazing isn't it? What can tear you inside out and make you wish death would come as a sweet relief (Reading precisely how he died was brutal)....can be blocked and shielded with a simple piece of writing paper.

Shhhhhh..... You keep saying how there is a WHOLE CLASS of deadly radioactive material they can't detect. I'll bet ears are burning at DHS right now. lol.... I think that's among their BIGGEST dirty little secrets as they try and convince everyone they are God-Like with power over all and knowledge about everything.

In reality, they have their pants down and bare butt hanging out for half the world to see more often than not, IMO.

*

I am curious on something though. You mention a box of Plutonium base material as a Dirty Bomb type weapon to disperse from above. Now I agree this is one of DHS's greatest nightmares and there are whole scenarios you can find to read about how they see that happening someday too. What confuses me tho....how do you see Plutonium in an unshielded state (Like in a box someone is hand carrying) not setting off the basic detector arrays? I've never heard Plutonium to be an Alpha emitter as it's primary issue. Polonium, yes...but that's literally impossible for anyone but a nation state to produce and have for technical reasons.

Some of us think the whole frickin' thing was staged. How convenient that the photojournalist was in attendance to capture it on her cellphone...

How many people travel via train that have had 'nuclear' procedures done by their doctor? It was never caught before? Or it was caught before, but we just did not hear about it? Isn't it great that the lawyer feels safe due to the presence of VIPR?

Is this to give credence to the much-hated TSA? I STILL hate them. I hate anybody who thinks he/she has the right to either touch my body, touch my body in intimate places, or expects me to enter into a machine that emits radiation, but also shows my body as if naked--WITHOUT MY CONSENT! I am an old lady, from an era when modesty was not ridiculed. Not to mention, I have dignity and self-respect--the whole darn world doesn't need to see me naked, plus I GET TO DECIDE just who does see me naked!! [not that there's anything worth seeing anymore, but that's not the point ]

Is this whole set-up a precursor to a 'nuclear false flag', destined to be blamed on Iran?? "They" have wanted to Bomb, Bomb, Bomb Iran for how long now??

reply to post by Habit4ming

Is there any basis to believe this was set up?

It's a MAJOR commuter line during the evening commute, as I read this. Chicago is a nightmare of a city for car owners. Nothing like New York, perhaps...but as much as I was there in a truck? I'd take the train too if I was there as a tourist. I'll bet there are any number of people who happen to work in Journalism on every commuter train in a big city....and EVERYONE has a camera phone these days?

Additionally... If you google..you'll see these hits on people with Nuclear Medicine testing aren't rare or even all THAT unusual. This stood out to share with ATS because it triggered a search for the source on a commuter train at rush, for everyone to see and possibly get worked up about.

What would be the gain or purpose to running this as a drill..and saying it wasn't a drill? What of the man who openly admits and documented the fact he did actually have the testing which is well known to trigger these hits?

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

You're right. Were both in deep radioactive sheet. Actually, the sources for any quantity of dangerous elements are carefully guarded. Unless you have 10 million old smoke detectors in your garage. Those have been phased out, by the way. Same with radium clock faces, coleman lantern wicks, etc. Good luck refining any harmful amount of that.

I think we're pretty safe... from... our own government.

I mentioned Plutonium because it is an alpha emitter. There are numerous elements, isotopes and nuclides. Most emit both (plus Beta). The smoke alarm uses Americium ( ah-mur-ee-see-um 241). They chose that element because it is "primarily" an alpha emitter (short decay path).

A spent fuel rod is probably the most deadly radioactive thing on the planet (except maybe a whole meltdown). You can't even pass by "spent fuel" on a motor cycle without receiving a lethal dose of "ionizing" radiation. But once you get a few meters from it, you are removed from the source. Same with the alpha emitters. You saw how close the detector had to be to register. The detectors in place in choke points monitoring people would of course detect increases to the "normal background" and that could "alert" authorities to make a more careful sweep. The public detectors would not tell you what element was detected either, just that there was a momentary increase of ionizing radiation "detected". If that spike is high enough then (silent) alarms sound.

However, if it were possible to divide up one pound of Plutonium and feed it to everyone on the planet, they would all eventually die of cancer. So, its not radiation or even radioactivity that is the main concern, it is ingesting a small amount of radioactive contamination that is the serious threat to human health (in the long term).

But (and also) the detectors in public places do detect gamma radiation from sources that could be used in contaminating drinking water or even, what if shipping containers had bombs in them mailed to every major city in the US?

reply to post by intrptr

Thanks for creeping me out. You know recently I read a short story titled We See Things Differently by Bruce Sterling. It's about an islamist "reporter" that interviews a man and gives him a lethal dose of cancer causing compounds. He also administers it to himself so that they both die.

Originally posted by intrptr
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

So, where are the detectors that picked up on the trace radioactivity and alerted the "Team"? Do all cities have these "Teams" waiting around for nothing? Or wait... what is the perceived threat that requires all this hair trigger rapid response?

They're at some major cities' transport hubs. Airports, train stations, subways. Generally near where you board, thus they can tell what train you're on.

All cities? No. Mostly major NE and north midwest cities. Some in LA, SF, DC, the DC area is rife with them. NYC has the same thing, they have every bridge in the area of NYC set up.

The 'perceived threat' is a gamma emitter. That'll set 'em off every time.

Oh, and some cities, mostly DC and NYC, have biological agent sensing systems too. If you spray anthrax by the reflecting pool, you'll be toast in about 5 minutes flat.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
I am curious on something though. You mention a box of Plutonium base material as a Dirty Bomb type weapon to disperse from above. Now I agree this is one of DHS's greatest nightmares and there are whole scenarios you can find to read about how they see that happening someday too. What confuses me tho....how do you see Plutonium in an unshielded state (Like in a box someone is hand carrying) not setting off the basic detector arrays? I've never heard Plutonium to be an Alpha emitter as it's primary issue. Polonium, yes...but that's literally impossible for anyone but a nation state to produce and have for technical reasons.

Plutonium IS primarily an alpha emitter. It's also not that radioactive, unless it's really crappy plutonium.

One of the more awful scenarios is the one where you wait for a temperature inversion to stall the air over NYC, then some whack job ignites a ceramic cup full of plutonium chips with a railroad flare atop the Empire State Building.

Pu burns, is pyrophoric, and the lethal inhaled dose is pretty low, causing death by pulmonary fibrosis. Big dose sooner, little dose later.