ATS Exclusive - Turkey UFO Incident - New Details - A Fresh Look At The Kumburgaz Case 2007 to 2009

reply to post by CigaretteMan

Yes. You make a good point and I think I agree with this one. It is completely obvious what you are getting at. Well, at least to me. It really is inconceivable that it is not understood since the pictures paint an obvious picture of what this thing truly is and it completely destroys all the arguments against this. People that can't follow the logic here are just not seeing it as clearly as it is illustrated.

Originally posted by LordAdef
reply to post by wmd_2008

 

But you do really know about photography, of which my knowledge is zero.
The mirage effect is related to the lights filmed in the day. My points were mainly concerning the night object (the ship). I quote bellow my points and need your help to see if it's reasonable:

1. Day object is different from Night objects. I'd like to comment on the night things;
2. No one so far noticed two things about the 'night' ufo thing?
A. It's always like the ufo's shapes are "cropped" at their bottom half. The cropping effect is consistently similar in all films;
B. Again the Ufo shape is persistently not simetrical through out all shootings. Its centre is to the left

3. Finally, he seems to be too sucessfull zooming in the ufo at night. He is far less sucessful zooming in the lights when it's daytime. It should be the opposite unless the night ufo is much closer, or it's a model..

Good thread. For me the night ufo is a model. Actually, I believe it's a picture of something cut, glued maybe on a black cardboard paper, and then filmed.


I underlined the points I need help from you and ArMap.

edit on 23-3-2013 by LordAdef because: (no reason given)

Well lets get night time mirages out of the way.

The conditions for producing a mirage can take place at night. Under most conditions these are not observed. However, under some circumstances lights from moving vehicles, aircraft, ships, buildings, etc can be observed at night even though, as with a daytime mirage, they would not be other wise observable

A mirage is caused by layers of air at different temperatures this can still happen at night but of course you will need lights to see it.

As for him being more successful with his night time videos watch the first 30 secs or so.



Do you still think so.

Even hi spec DSLR cameras costing thounsands of £/$ have focus problems at night my camera didn't cost thousands just a few hundred, I would use manual focus myself and anyone taking night time pics of stars etc would use manual focus.

Also like myself and others have said why don't people further along the cost and nearer the object film it or report it

reply to post by wmd_2008



I´m with you. But forget the mirage effect for a while. What I'm saying is that his focus behavior is dodgy and behaves according to his interest. During the day he cannot get a close up of the lights (the mirage effect). That´s point 1;

My point 2 is that the night images seem to be cropped bellow, including the one you ask me to watch. So.. the focus is miraculous neat; the thing is always cropped; the light is too great to be true; my conclusion is this is a model OR a picture (cropped for some reason) attached to a cardboard then filmed.

The red lines below show the places I feel they ´re cropped:





See? Since the cropping threshold is static so it´s not a shade effect, or the object is 100% still
Debunked?

reply to post by CigaretteMan


I hope you´re following my conjectures once you asked us to contribute.
Adding to what I already said in the posts above, below I show a quick comparison of 4 different images, showing what ìm calling the "cropping" effect and how the dimensions are the same regardless of the year. One HAS to raise questions on the nature of these shootings. It points out towards a Hoax for me.

I don´t have a Photo editor, so it´s an approximation. However everithing indicates that further analysis will corroborate it.


(larger size if you open it in a new window)

reply to post by LordAdef


Excellent footage, I don't follow this case but this is a credible case and a credible video. The guy was constantly zomming in and out, the dog was barking at the lights, there was nothing that suggests this was a hoax or CGI - I can absolutely exclude that.

While the first part of the video and the end one showing some white/black object didn't give much credibility and looked like as if he's shooting a street lamp, the 4 lights and the dog barking at them, totally make this a good and genuine case.

reply to post by ImpactoR


Hi Impactor, first of all I'm a "believer". However if you read the whole thread you will see there're many 'ifs' from many members, including myself. The Op himself is open for debate.

No one ever suggested any CGI fraud, but one doesn't really need that to make up a Hoax. What I put in my last posts indicates something is wrong (actually, it's too right). And there's the mirage possibility.

The dog apparently barks towards the ufo. But a closer look will reveal there's someone swimming. Is the dog barking at his owner? A Coach attracting the dog's attention?

In the end, it's still an open case.

Originally posted by LordAdef
reply to post by wmd_2008

 

I´m with you. But forget the mirage effect for a while. What I'm saying is that his focus behavior is dodgy and behaves according to his interest. During the day he cannot get a close up of the lights (the mirage effect). That´s point 1;

My point 2 is that the night images seem to be cropped bellow, including the one you ask me to watch. So.. the focus is miraculous neat; the thing is always cropped; the light is too great to be true; my conclusion is this is a model OR a picture (cropped for some reason) attached to a cardboard then filmed.

The red lines below show the places I feel they ´re cropped:

See? Since the cropping threshold is static so it´s not a shade effect, or the object is 100% still
Debunked?

edit on 24-3-2013 by LordAdef because: (no reason given)

I think the last image is a boat and I see what you posited out could be a model. I think those are 2 separate things..

reply to post by wmd_2008

Also like myself and others have said why don't people further along the cost and nearer the object film it or report it

Take a look at this. At 1:39, 3:50, 4:01, and 4:15 we see fishermen exhibiting no interest in the lights at all (lights which have a completely different configuration from the 2009 video). Maybe they understand that mirages often form over water and can do odd things to the lights of fishing boats.

reply to post by ArMaP

It's hard to say if it's cropped or if that it's the real shape. I would like to see the "much better quality" videos (that, apparently, are just "not amazingly clearer or vastly better") first.

Yep, better quality would be most appreciated but it's not really coming..
The point of the crop theory is that they are "identically" cropped, with "identical" sizes and same lights. And this takes were done in different years!! We don't need a better video to smell hoax with this.

I don't understand what's the problem with that.

Armap, do you forget we're talking about 3 different years' shootings??
The problem is simple: you CANNOT get the SAME perfect perspective like that unless the object is fixed and your position is the same, and the lights are absolutely the same.. In 2007, 2008,2009?

Or all these shootings were made in the day, or in controled circunstances

That's a good point.

It is. And isn't bizarre to have a night object with its lights off, and a day object with its lights on?

It looks too far away for that, but it's possible.

It's possible. Did you notice the yellow moon has something odd near the south pole? Maybe the moon is also fake too.

ps: by the way, where is the Op??

reply to post by LordAdef


The problem is we don't know if the level of zoom is the same for all shots,so we cant say they are all identical, if it was a cardboard cut out it would be some distance away as we have the spec for the camera and we see him zoom in.

As for the OP why doesn't he just upload the video during the night when he is asleep or when out at work etc.

reply to post by LordAdef


If it is a hoax, that's a well made one but still.

Someone swimming? Who would swim at 5.00 AM?? Not only that, I do not see a swimmer, I see waves... So I do not think the dog is barking at the waves...

reply to post by Phage


Mirage? Try better, this does not look like a mirage. And is not.

reply to post by ImpactoR

Mirage? Try better, this does not look like a mirage. And is not.

On the contrary. It looks like a mirage and is.

Originally posted by ImpactoR

Mirage? Try better, this does not look like a mirage. And is not.

Really



Still think it cant be a mirage

reply to post by wmd_2008


True. But then we have the lightning to corroborate the similarity. In the end I think there're hints that lead me to believe it's definitely a model.

I assume his doing his full zoom. Nevertheless the ufo proportions are the same, regardless the zoom factor.

The Op would really help by uploading the high quality videos.

reply to post by ImpactoR


There's a movie some pages ago showing clearly that in fact there's a man swimming (possibly Phage's). If it's too early for a swim or not it just reenforces the hoax claims (or not )

The mirage is a strong argument Impactor, as you can see in the links above.

www.adrive.com... KUMBURGAZ UFO Video.mpg

2007 1st generation - MPG - 1GB file is now up online at the above link.
If you click it. Then it will start downloading.

A few things to note:

1. The 2007 video was taken on 2 cassettes. The above link only has 1 but it has most of the 2007 footage, however some of the 2007 footage that you see online is still to be found. We are trying to locate most of the 2008 raw video. But 2009 is coming up next

2. Have fun downloading the 1 GB file.

Enjoy

Originally posted by LordAdef
reply to post by ImpactoR

 

There's a movie some pages ago showing clearly that in fact there's a man swimming (possibly Phage's). If it's too early for a swim or not it just reenforces the hoax claims (or not

)

The mirage is a strong argument Impactor, as you can see in the links above.

That blurry image you mentioned of a stick in the water is not a man swimming.

A stick in the water is just that. A stick in the water. Not a man swimming.

Everyone please have a look a this blogsite. turkeyufocase.blogspot.com...Thanks

P.S. a word to the debunkers - give it up - you will not be able to debunk this - everyone who has tried has failed - even hoaxkiller can't debunk it.

Stop embarassing yourself.

That being said I am a healthy skeptic which is different than a debunker.

do mirages occur at night?