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A Website Find, from cave-paintings to the internet

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posted on Mar, 9 2013 @ 12:08 PM
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Here's a link to (EDIT: an amazing, comprehensive, totally jam-packed with information super-colossal one-person created) website on the history of information from cave-paintings to the internet that looks really interesting (hisoryofinformation.com), and I can't find it in the ATS search engine. Just ran across it as a link on a thread on the right-wing site Freerepublic (I like looking at their pages for science data, for the progressive entertainment value of right-wingers winging, and for breaking news). I'll list it here and we can explore it at the same time.

The real name of the site is "Jeremy Norman's history of information from cave-paintings to the internet". Neither the site's name nor Norman's came up in a search here.

www.historyofinformation.com...

If this turns out as good as it looks we may have to raise a toast to Jeremy Norman.

EDIT: Whew!!! Here's one example of Norman's use of their "Map" function, looks like a full data-base that can be zoomed in on for each era on many subjects. This one is "Art" from early stone-age sites 2.5 million years ago to 10,000 years ago. Darn, this looks like fun. www.historyofinformation.com...

EDIT: O My Goddess Just look at this. It's his expanded view of the site, and I just dipped into a couple of pages out of probably thousands and they are overflowing with data and information.

www.historyofinformation.com...

EDIT:Yes, it is all from one guy, Jeremy Norman (toast raised high). Who is this guy, and what kind of orderly mind and patience does he have to create this "'b]thing". He has a long page in the "About the site" section which talks about why he did it. One paragraph:


Anyone who reviews this database in detail, and appreciates its scope, might very well wonder why I have undertaken this project which is, of course, impossible to complete. Primarily, the database is an expression of the widest range of my historical curiosity- a way to unify many of my interests into a research source that will, I hope, become increasingly useful. As has often been said, we are presently experiencing one of the most significant and dramatic transitional phases in the evolution of information and media. The transition from a world in which information was primarily created, recorded, distributed and stored in physical form on paper to a world in which most information is produced, created, distributed and stored in digital form on the Internet has occurred mostly within my lifetime. I was born in 1945, just after World War II ended, and soon after the first general purpose electronic digital computer, the ENIAC, became operational. The ongoing dramatic changes in media, which all of us experience, caused me to wonder how all these changes came about. The more I delve into the history of media the more complex some of the historical problems appear. I suspect that it will require the passage of considerably more years before historians can look back at our rapidly changing time with genuine objectivity. One of the goals of this database is to provide raw material for histories or other scholarship that may be written now and also in the future.





Here's the Freerepublic thread I got it from, on the digitation of the Vatican Library, which someone may want to do a thread on:

www.freerepublic.com...




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posted on Mar, 9 2013 @ 12:53 PM
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Time to bump this, and to throw a party for people interested in this stuff. Whew, just look at this guy's website.



posted on Mar, 9 2013 @ 01:38 PM
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thats pretty cool actually, i've had a little look around, and while the map at least needs more info for the earliest periods, i reckon that could well change over time - there are also some great articles on the development of technology (what, no alieeens?) that a few people here should read too!

seeing as we are sharing inneresting links on history and that, here's a cool pictoral timeline of north american stone points.. you have to get zoomed in to see the flake scars well, but for ed value it's rather splendidwww.relicshack.com...

and a pretty fantastic virtual tour of the Lascaux caves of france, awesome cave paintings and all. with spooky music too
www.lascaux.culture.fr...#/en/02_00.xml

edit on 9-3-2013 by skalla because: how frikkin often do i say "awesome"? i dont even surf :/



posted on Mar, 9 2013 @ 05:48 PM
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Just had a quick play with the site and all I can say is WOW
Ill definately be spending a few hours on there over the next few weeks.

I dont have anything else to add but wanted to give the thread a bump so Ill leave the post minimal.

SnF
edit on 9/3/2013 by IkNOwSTuff because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 9 2013 @ 08:22 PM
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reply to post by Aleister
 


Thanks for the link OP thats me with new material to keep the gray matter entertained.






posted on Mar, 9 2013 @ 08:42 PM
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Wow is right gonna be spending alot of time reading that sire for sure



posted on Mar, 9 2013 @ 09:15 PM
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Thanks everyone, and my time is short for right now but will be back later. Wanted to say I emailed Jeremy Norton and alerted him to this thread, and asked him to join it (and ATS). This forum is just one part of the interest base for his site and research, and maybe we can hook him up to some of the best ATS threads in his subject areas and he can incorporate some of that data into his mental-and-physical-map of history which seems to be as extensive as I've seen from an entire university (if there's anything even comparable), and he's just one guy!

Norton may enjoy meeting some of the very good people here who've worked on any of his many topics (which seem endless). I too will be spending hours on his website. It's like finding a treasure chest in the woods, opening it (damn, I haven't thought of this in years, our grammar school had a carnival every year with this amazing treasure chest on stage and we'd get to open it if we won a something, faint memory, it was a key, we'd get keys! to open the chest, whew, will have to do a 30 minute memory scan of that one....I've digressed, of course), and finding that someone has done something spectacular and likes to share it - the best kind of inquisitive mind. I ramble, and places to go and people to see....



posted on Mar, 10 2013 @ 06:52 AM
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Originally posted by skalla
thats pretty cool actually, i've had a little look around, and while the map at least needs more info for the earliest periods, i reckon that could well change over time - there are also some great articles on the development of technology (what, no alieeens?) that a few people here should read too!

seeing as we are sharing inneresting links on history and that, here's a cool pictoral timeline of north american stone points.. you have to get zoomed in to see the flake scars well, but for ed value it's rather splendidwww.relicshack.com...

and a pretty fantastic virtual tour of the Lascaux caves of france, awesome cave paintings and all. with spooky music too
www.lascaux.culture.fr...#/en/02_00.xml

edit on 9-3-2013 by skalla because: how frikkin often do i say "awesome"? i dont even surf :/


Thanks for the links, this thread now officially contains some of the best links on early North American native historical artifacts. Have you got more?

And yes, if you know some of the other ATS'ers interested in these historical timelines you can let them know of Norman's work, and let Norman know of theirs, and some of the threads and/or knowledge base of ATSers can expand his work at some key points. You said you can see where his work needs expansion, and if you can point out some of those he can look at your post when he "arrives" here (if he does, or at least lurks.)

At a meeting of point and artifact researchers and collectors I met some of the people (usually older gentlemen) who have written about point history, and have asked a few of them to expand the wikipedia articles on their subjects (bird-stone, etc.) after explaining the importance of wikipedia to any field of research. Almost to a man they'd never looked at wikipedia themselves and didn't want to put in the time. Have you or someone in your collecting circle ever made an inventory of the wikipedia pages on the subject? I haven't. Anyway, what I'm getting on is Jeremy Norman's material may or may not be linked on external pages on wikipedia, which may be a valuable tool for lots of people who don't know of it (and vica versa, if Norman enjoys feedback and suggestion about how to improve or expand his depository.)



posted on Mar, 10 2013 @ 06:56 AM
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reply to post by Munkh
 

Thanks again everyone, and thanks Munkh. I notice you're new here, and welcome. You will find many adventures (such as this one), and when you have 20 posts you can start your own threads and share with us the data you know about and the questions you have. This is often like a big classroom in the near-sky (the internet is everywhere, like radio waves, literally present and accessible in the space we walk in). Good to meet you.



posted on Mar, 10 2013 @ 06:39 PM
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Originally posted by Aleister
Time to bump this, and to throw a party for people interested in this stuff. Whew, just look at this guy's website.

Oh yes -- that would be me! What an amazing website! I can see that I'm going to spend a lot of time exploring the place.



posted on Mar, 10 2013 @ 06:42 PM
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Originally posted by skalla
thats pretty cool actually, i've had a little look around, and while the map at least needs more info for the earliest periods, i reckon that could well change over time - there are also some great articles on the development of technology (what, no alieeens?) that a few people here should read too!

I particularly like that he got the Homo Erectus "workshop" -- there's been times when I went looking for that link to make an argument, and couldn't find the darn thing.

Heh. He may have quite a problem with Ancient Egypt because there's a string of new stuff that's constantly being done.



posted on Mar, 10 2013 @ 06:48 PM
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Originally posted by Byrd

Originally posted by skalla
Heh. He may have quite a problem with Ancient Egypt because there's a string of new stuff that's constantly being done.


(EDIT: The quote quoted above is by Byrd, I just cropped some of the code somewhere)

That's one reason I hope he responds to my email and comes here, he can be hooked up with some of our "experts" and/or thread links and maybe find some data he may have missed (or vica versa). When I first looked him up I thought he'd be a major university prof, with a wikipedia page overflowing with citations, and he's just a guy hanging out in Ohio, if I read his stuff right, selling manuscripts or rare books or something. I'd like to ask him how many hours a week or day he spends adding to or polishing his website.
edit on 10-3-2013 by Aleister because: (no reason given)
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posted on Mar, 10 2013 @ 07:56 PM
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reply to post by Aleister
 


my pleasure..
as to his map, my comment is from a stone age/primitive tech buff's POV and unfortunately it would be a pretty major job for my scatter gun and easily distracted brain to update/advise etc - i will certainly return to the site (possibly many times) though so who knows, i may be able to contribute some way in the future.. my problem though is that there are just too many things that interest me in relation to the time i have, often leading me to flit from interest to interest depending on what seems shiniest
at any given time
i'm not part of a collecting community, though i am at times part of knapping and ancient or traditional craft/exp-arch (ish) practicing/teaching communities and work within that environment... you are right though that wikipedia only has limited info on points/lithics etc - such folk tend to congregate in specialist forums where the language of platforms, overshoots, hinges and FOG etc is intimidating to the new comer or outsider.

most of my links re points and primitive tech may be a little old now, and more interactive resources may be around now (yup, ats amongst other things has been more shiny in the last year or so, and other crafts have overtaken knapping for me this past year too) but here are a few i dug out, they contain some high level lithic porn though, be advised.

www.worldmuseumofman.org... contains a wealth of pics and info on bones and material cuture, some drool worthy stone tools are on here, i had to prevent myself from delving in or i would possibly not have finished this post


www.stonedagger.com... contains, amongst other things, good advice for collectors

paleoplanet69529.yuku.com... Paleoplanet is the be all and end all of primitive skills forums. anyone with an interest in bushcraft or learning the practical side of how our most distant ancestors built the skills that are the foundation of what we do today should look at this - it's really experimental archaeology and deserves far more recognition.

flintknapper.com... Larry Kinsella's site has a whole heap of great stuff on it, i've only ever looked at a bit of it, but he's an expert on the making and use of ground stone axes and plenty more beside it seems.

www.alaskanartifacts.com... loads of pics of alaskan prehistoric artifacts

elfshotgallery.blogspot.ca... elfshot is blog by an experimental archaeologist re the stone tools and ancient tech of canada and the arctic, i cant recommend it highly enough.

www.arrowheadology.com... maybe you already know this one? the name says it all...

www.glenbow.org... a fascinating exploration of a whalebone house, only a thousand years old, but a window to much more ancient times too

www.modern-flintknapping.com... up to date uber rock porn, using modern methods. no antler and hammerstones here..

flintknappers.com... expert modern knappers selling their work - really, really worth a look

also check out paleomanjim's and allergichobbit's YT channel, they have fascinating insights/demos on stone tool tech and production..... but i'm just geeking-out now. obvs i have more links too... enjoy!



posted on Mar, 10 2013 @ 09:33 PM
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reply to post by skalla
 

That looks like a fantastic collection of sites, and they no doubt have their own links as well. Thank you for pulling that together and then posting it. No time to explore them now, but will do so in the day(s) ahead.

There's usually a stone-age knife in my pocket for "everyday" use (will change them out every few weeks), and it's easy to imagine that when one of the craftsmen made an exceptional point or tool they would show it around to their fellows, or make "pretty" ones out of colorful rock for their women. Hopefully all (or most) of my stuff is "real" in terms of prehistoric age (fingers crossed). Every piece I keep has to pass one test - when I'm in the correct mood and using a magnifying glass I can make out images of forest animals and scenes within the rock - wolves, bears, eagles, faces or outlines of native indians, buffalo. All my stuff has them, and when someone doubts it I can show them where I'm seeing the animals and then they can see them too (none of them are put there on purpose, but are on and within the rock structure itself).

Thanks again for the links and descriptions. You obviously work and play in the heart of the woods, literally or symbolically.



posted on Mar, 11 2013 @ 10:36 AM
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These are excellent resources, -- some superb ones mentioned in the thread. I think I will make this a permanent resource by "topping" the thread (locking it so it's a top post) later this week. This is the kind of material that needs to be considered (no matter what your beliefs on ancient history.)



posted on Mar, 11 2013 @ 10:48 AM
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reply to post by Aleister
 


Aleister,

A very very big thank you from me for sharing this resource. I have just had an extremely quick skim through one of the links and i was blown away. There maybe stuff that proves contentious (probably will be given the huge amount of information contained there) but just WOW anyway. Huge kudos to the guy.


If i could give multiple flags and stars i would. I have just bookmarked it to my favourites section and will be perusing at leisure - probably for months to come!



posted on Mar, 11 2013 @ 02:50 PM
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Originally posted by Flavian
reply to post by Aleister
 


Aleister,

A very very big thank you from me for sharing this resource. I have just had an extremely quick skim through one of the links and i was blown away. There maybe stuff that proves contentious (probably will be given the huge amount of information contained there) but just WOW anyway. Huge kudos to the guy.


If i could give multiple flags and stars i would. I have just bookmarked it to my favourites section and will be perusing at leisure - probably for months to come!


You're welcome. But I feel the same way, and my stars and flags will go towards Jeremy Norman, the fellow who created the site that I was just lucky to run across on another website (see first post), when and if he logs in as a member.



posted on Mar, 12 2013 @ 07:10 AM
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reply to post by Aleister
 


Materials from flax fibres 32'000 to 28'000 years ago? Didn't know that and actually rather surprised. What a clever little species we are.
That really is a significant technological breakthrough.

I was also rather surprised by the evidence for ocean voyages dating back 190'000 years. That is an area of special interest for me and i have to be honest and admit i wasn't aware of that site. I did know of the site of East Timor and thought the fish hooks from between 21'000 and 16'000 years ago were rather significant but the date from Crete blows that out of the water.

Just a couple of doozies from a very brief scan through.



posted on Mar, 15 2013 @ 08:16 PM
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reply to post by Flavian
 


Nice finds. I'd emailed Norman twice and haven't received an answer, nor has he posted here. At a miniumum he may find some pages on this site which can fit into his scope of history. The recent neanderthal thread is one that he could possibly gleam new data from, and there are, of course, many more.

I'll link the neanderthal thread here in case Norman drops by, and it would be helpful to both have his views on it and if he can add any more data to the thread:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

edit on 15-3-2013 by Aleister because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 10 2013 @ 04:03 PM
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Just doing a bump to the thread. Figure if one more person clicks on it and finds the amazing website then this bump is worth it.

Jeremy Norman never answered my email. I haven't phoned him yet, and hope he's still among the living. He's provided a great website with so much information that it does need a few hours to explore the caverns and caves he has electronically carved out.





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