All people really want to be is Slaves or be the Enslavers.

reply to post by AthlonSavage

We are all creatures of servitude.

Who are you serving?

Could help bring perspective.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
reply to post by Itisnowagain

 

You know im a truth warrior itsnowagain i tell it how it is. We are all creatures of servitude.

"How it is" would be relative to your point of observation or perception. Just thought id throw that out there. One would either know how it is thus eliminating the need to ask any questions or they simply don't know how it is.

People don't want to be enslaved. It would be nice if they worked out they already were though...

reply to post by Bluesma


You see control as a natural mechanism to control sexual activity so to reproduce selectives genetic material. Interesting, may have to take this one off line with you dont really want to x rate this thread.

reply to post by Bluesma

Watching debate is kinda like mind porn.

Reading/listening to debate is my porn!

reply to post by AthlonSavage


Hmm... this is a very interesting subject for me to respond to.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
This brings me to the point i want to raise that life when it boils down to it is a battle of controlling wills. The nature of this battle will find everyone inside some form of fighting arena such as work, home, at the shops, and basically where ever human beings conglomerate togther.

This battle only exist because of hierarchy. In reality all water, food, and shelter is free, but when a few individuals take everything for themselves and then make others work to get back what was naturally free, this is when the artificial "competitions" seem to happen.

Animals may compete over food, but even if they do not get it they can always go else where to get it for free...

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
These biggest survival drivers for human beings is to gain as much control over their environment to improve their chances of existing longer in a healthy condition.

Not all. Some just want to have fun and do not care about their health (smoking, drinking, etc.)
I think the biggest survival driver for human beings is pleasure/fun. This is what makes life interesting and gives the motivation for survival... I do not think it is about "control" over the environment, rather being able to act on one's desire which will bring satisfaction.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
In real life terms this is acheived through battling and subjugating foes.

Only if the "foe" is trying to force their will upon you, otherwise there is no need to "subjugate" anyone as all will be minding their own business and you'll be free to act on your desire (unless you force your will upon another).

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
Everywhere we look in life someone is acting in a subjugated role reporting obediantly to someone higher up.

This is what hierarchy does. Those on top take whatever they want, and then the people at the bottom think that "life is suffering" and "nothing comes easily" just because the top was so greedy to take more than they'll ever use and make the "bottom" obey them. That is not a natural rule though, it is a social construct.

At least with animals the hierarchy has less control because nature is providing food and shelter everywhere. So if the animal does not like its leader it can still survive, whereas in human life, you need money to survive and therefore you need to obey the higher-ups otherwise you will have no shelter or food.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
In this situation the subugated person has the three choices, plot a strategy to move up the control ladder

Satanists and rich people. Those on the left hand path who do not care about others and that those below them will suffer...

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
or accept servitude.

These love in light people who are taught to always give to others. They live in "servitude" and therefore never move "up" anywhere except in their own self judgment of being "spiritually superior" to others for "giving" so much.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
here is a third choice of course to try and hide and isolate oneselfs as best possible from having direct interactions with people.

I agree with this, but only if the people you are isolating yourself from is controlling. I prefer to be around people that are not trying to manipulate/control me into doing things that I do not wish to do. Now, I just speak up for myself in a kind way, and if they are "angry" that they couldn't control me, it is seriously time for me to keep my distance from such an aggressive person...

Originally posted by AthlonSavage

I also mentioned its also about entertainment because where there is control always is found sporting entertainment. This sport is game of deriving pleasure from manipulating them who are subjugated. This entertainment reaches as cresendo sometimes with the thumbs down and crushing the life out of the subjugated. A sport for Kings and Queens no doubt.

This "game" sounds like a mental illness - sadistic personality disorder.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
What is your opinions do you agree all people really want to be is Slaves or be the Enslavers?

There are those who wish to be slaves (serving another), there are those who wish to be enslavers (controlling others), and then, there are those who believe in Free-will where they do whatever they want and allow the same for others as long as one's will isn't being forced upon another. It is the perfect balance.

reply to post by arpgme


At a survival level to allow fufilling basic needs i dont see the fight for resources that much different between humans and animals. Humans wil take and control their resources at the point of a barrel and animals do it with their claws and teeth.

The difference between control enslavement within the animal kingdom and human is the control over needs. You were saying that people seek to control for primary reason of desires. This isnt strictly true because the human being will have to first fulfill his/her basic needs for survivals before moving on to control of wants. What humans do than animals dont is control the wants.

If one looks into human societies you will see a system set up where people can always have shelter, food and clothing no matter what their position status is within the society. Its the control of the wants...or better term the desires the controllers work on. They do this by strangling and cuttting back indivdiuals resources on the needs side and then at same time bombarding them with images of desires. Can you see how effective this system of human control is? it has the human being living on the brink of the poverty line and using desires to motivate himself to follow and obey his controller.

Originally posted by arpgme
reply to post by AthlonSavage

 

There are those who wish to be slaves (serving another), there are those who wish to be enslavers (controlling others), and then, there are those who believe in Free-will where they do whatever they want and allow the same for others as long as one's will isn't being forced upon another. It is the perfect balance.

Well said. The atom agrees with you
"All matter is made up of atoms. An atom is like a tiny solar system. In the center of the atom is the nucleus which is a cluster of protons and neutrons. The protons have a positive electric charge while the neutrons are electrically neutral. The nucleus makes up almost all of an atom's mass or weight. Whirling at fantastic speeds around the nucleus are smaller and lighter particles called electrons which have a negative electric charge.

An atom has the same number of electrons (- ve charge) and protons (+ ve charge) to make the atom electrically neutral. An extremely powerful force, called the nuclear force, holds the protons together in the nucleus as they naturally repelled one another electrically."

Sounds like the perfect balance to me

reply to post by arpgme

This is what makes life interesting and gives the motivation for survival... I do not think it is about "control" over the environment, rather being able to act on one's desire which will bring satisfaction.

My respected friend, I challenge you to give example of 'acting on desire to bring satisfaction' that doesn't constitute control.

First one must free oneself from being a slave to the mind.
youtu.be...

If you do not realize that the mind is your master you can never be free.

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy

Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
My respected friend, I challenge you to give example of 'acting on desire to bring satisfaction' that doesn't constitute control.

There are many desire which does not require one to control / force their will upon another.

For example, eating delicious food, or spending time with a loved one.

When two people agree to something because they want to, it is not control, it is consent.

Control is forcing your will upon others because you either desire Control itself - or because you are powerless and believe that controlling others is the only way to get what you want...

reply to post by arpgme

Control is forcing your will upon others because you either desire Control itself - or because you are powerless and believe that controlling others is the only way to get what you want

Yes we are powerless to this force. That has been my point.

Part of my point, is that this isn't intrinsically 'bad'. Your words suggest otherwise.

Perhaps it's semantics. What's your personal understanding of what 'control' means? I am being mostly literal in my meaning.

Control is forcing your will upon others

....because if it means this.... we are all guilty of it! Enforcing our will is our history. Whether towards the environment of Earth or the environment of People.

The Freedom of Not Wanting Anything:
youtu.be...

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy


I already gave my definition:

Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy

Control is forcing your will upon others

Controlling is unfair. Why should you have the right to force your will upon another? Also, control is not power, it is WEAKNESS. If you need to control others to get your way, then you are weak and result to manipulation...

reply to post by arpgme

Controlling is unfair. Why should you have the right to force your will upon another? Also, control is not power, it is WEAKNESS. If you need to control others to get your way, then you are weak and result to manipulation...

No it isnt if there is consentual domineer submissive roles which are taken willingly.

You want a world where everyone is equal and treated fairly so they never encounter the situations where someone is imposing on their free will. This cant happen because of the way Nature has made the world. Its a Jungle of survival, the dog eat dog law of the wild. There is also a spiritual reason and that is everyone is at a different stage of advancement in their soul evolution which requires some going through the pain of control to learn the process of being free. How can a person known and value freedom if they have never been a slave.

Originally posted by arpgme
Control is forcing your will upon others

Right. I am not in disagreement there. As I stated earlier, I don't see how that is inherently, necessarily, bad.

Controlling is unfair.

Is it? Interesting. Any comments on my earlier posts and points? I think controlling is very much integral to our human experience. Both to flourish as a society and as an individual. It's quite inescapable. Perhaps it's unfair. We have the drive regardless.

Why should you have the right to force your will upon another?

Why should you not?

Truly not off topic. Not tangent to your point. Watch this vid. It's 20 mins and addresses what you just asked. I agree with him.

reply to post by Lucid Lunacy

Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
Why should you not?

Well if there is nothing wrong with forcing your will upon others. Then slavery is perfectly ok. Why should you not do it? Would you like it if people were controlling you and stopping you from living your life and doing what you want?


By the way, to all of those people who believe in duality saying that you can't know "peace" until you know "stress" or you can't know "freedom" until you know "slavery". Nature disagrees with you. Everyone is born with freedom and peace until they are put under stress and into slavery.

reply to post by arpgme

You want a world where everyone is equal and treated fairly so they never encounter the situations where someone is imposing on their free will. This cant happen because of the way Nature has made the world. Its a Jungle of survival, the dog eat dog law of the wild. There is also a spiritual reason and that is everyone is at a different stage of advancement in their soul evolution which requires some going through the pain of control to learn the process of being free. How can a person known and value freedom if they have never been a slave.

If you cant see this above reality then YOU are against nature.

reply to post by arpgme


You see arpgme i know you believe in the Dark power of Isis and she represents the will of Nature mother earth. What you havent seen is that Isis if for Control. The ancient Eyptians made no secret they used Slavery. Slavery and control are Natural. What appears to have been recently foundout is the Slaves took servitude happily and willingly. This tells me that theuy understood that the path to understanding truely what freedom is a path of control which makes sense when you think it over. People who are slaves naturally dream of Freedom and when they finally achieve it they value it wholey. A person who never has been slave can never know what real freedom is.

Originally posted by AthlonSavage
reply to post by Lucid Lunacy

 

We are control freaks.

If you are correct this thread will be a test of that. There will be them who compete control of the debate and them who say one thing and scurry off to avoid direct confrontation. Im watching with interest.

Hi Athlon, i've only read up to here so far but from the off, i was wondering which you would class yourself as. does the above statement make you an enslaver of sorts?