People have been brainwashed to believe that socialism is evil...

reply to post by TheBlackHat


What is closer to the Christian paradigm is that
Christ said "The poor will always be with you."
Rich people and capitalism begets competition
and motivation.
These two things propel humans to develop new and better wheels.

reply to post by coltcall


without outside imposed values and morals basic human nature chooses one or a combination of the seven deadly sins.
Gluttony
Greed
Sloth
Lust
Wrath
Envy
Pride

Originally posted by slugger9787
reply to post by TheBlackHat

 

What is closer to the Christian paradigm is that
Christ said "The poor will always be with you."
Rich people and capitalism begets competition
and motivation.
These two things propel humans to develop new and better wheels.

You say that Capitalism prompts competition and motivation? well you may be right but a serial killer is highly motivated..and Lance Armstrong was highly competitive...I mean none of those two traits necessarily means anything positive, does it. And the competition and motivation in capitalism are usually not positive..because the obvious flaw with being motivated and competitive in a capitalist model..is your only motivation is for personal gain..self interest. And most people who are highly motivated and competitive are not people you want to mess with...are you getting this obvious fact..in other words psychopaths. Yes psychopaths flourish in capitalism, they lead governments and lots of multinational companies etc...I mean who other that a uncaring, soulless person could run an oil company????? Or even McDonalds...or NIKE.
I also don't see any better wheels...
What I do see...is an oil based economy.
If capitalism really "begets" a better wheel..we would all be living in a clean environment, with clean energy.
because we know clean energy exists but we have not exchanged fossil fuels for this clean technology...why???
Because of capitalism...profits and power.
Capitalism is a bu77# lie for the people who wish to bury their head in the sand and live in denial, of the actual damage capitalism does.
capitalism simply prompts greed, at the planets cost..



Oh and rich people...to give rich people any credit at all shows how ignorant you are...Most rich people are born into wealth, they do nothing productive to gain wealth. Don't forget the rich people who marry wealth..Then we have the smallest minority of rich people...The self made ones.. I think it's about 30% of rich people who actually made the money themselves..

Even those self made rich people...lets look at them...sports stars...celebrities...etc...why exactly are they to be respected and admired because they are rich..or because of their talents..? according to your logic simply because someone is rich they are admirable.

Some of the worst criminals in the world are rich...

Your idiotic obviously.


And last but not least...the only reason capitalism can operate, is because socialism operated in tandem with it.
The road you drive on is not funded by capitalist principals, nor is the sidewalk you walk on...The basic infrastructure of any country is funded by socialism. Your taxes, are not given over to the government willingly, you do it because your forced to hand over those tax dollars.

and its the taxes that build and maintain the infrastructure. Well taxing people isn't very capitalistic is it? No it isn't. It's redistributing wealth equally among society, so that we all have a road to drive on etc...or a school to send our kids to...And dont forget all those government and state employees, all funded by taxes...thats not very capitalist either.

Thats what really gets me p155ed off with people who trumpet capitalism, your living in denial, you can only exist in a capitalism that relies on a socialist foundation. Because you cant drive a Rolls Royce when there is no road to drive it on. You cant even fill the gas tank unless you have an army funded by tax dollars to go and invade the middle east.

Like I said capitalism would never give taxes over willingly to a socialist foundation. Thats why capitalism is a lie.

Originally posted by slugger9787
reply to post by coltcall

 

without outside imposed values and morals basic human nature chooses one or a combination of the seven deadly sins.
Gluttony
Greed
Sloth
Lust
Wrath
Envy
Pride

Humanbeings are capable of all these emotions...but we are also capable of
caring
empathy
selflessness
love
forgiveness
common sense
community
etc

If people were not capable of being right minded..then we would never have had civilizations. You give the impression the only civilization in existence is this one..based on the bible...you forget ancient Greece, Egypt, Rome etc..etc.

And your also wrong about needing outside values and morals. That's a crock. If you never were taught right from wrong, you would still feel empathy because its hard wired in your brain.

the fact that we are all taught morals and the laws of the land, and yet over 2 million people are incarcerated in the states alone...proves that people do not need to be told whats good and evil..people will either be good or bad based on their upbringing and genetics..it has little to do with being told whats right or wrong.

Originally posted by TheBlackHat
people will either be good or bad based on their upbringing and genetics..

I wouldn't be so sure about the genetics part. If you look into epigenetics you might see otherwise : www.wholescience.net...

But yeah, agreed with the idea that (and this also includes if and when we can get rid of all the current programming that we're having to deal with.) we don't need an outside source imposing anything on us. (In-tuition that we can access properly should be able to take care of that problem.) That's one of the core parts of anarchism, after all.

reply to post by TheBlackHat


The seven deadly sins are not EMOTIONS.
They are VICES, initiators of behavior and actions.

Their opposites are VIRTUES like

Fortitude
Faith
Hope
Charity
Justice
Courage
Prudence

morals and values do not exist
within a person unless they
have been taught and instructed
along that vein.


Emotions are listed below
SAD
HURT
ANGRY
AFRAID
ASHAMED
GLAD

reply to post by slugger9787


I disagree again.
It has already been documented in science, through brain scans between psychopaths and normal people. That a particular segment of the brain is undeveloped in psychopaths. This portion of the brain is the part that allows people to feel empathy for other human beings and animals. In other words you are hard wired to not want to hurt people. unless you are born as a psychopath.

If your born as a psychopath it hardly matters if you are brought up in a religion or educated to be moral...because your not going to "get it"or care anyway.

Aside from psychopaths we know that many normal people also commit crimes, including murder. They commit crimes because they allow their ego's to guide them rather than their common sense.

The ego is at the heart of all crime. And it's egotism that is encouraged by the material civilization. We are told that what we own is who we are..and the more we own the greater we are. This way of looking at life leads to a prison population of over 2 million in the states alone. And remember most of those inmates are Christians..but the real religion they follow is materialism.

reply to post by TheBlackHat


I worked in maximum security prisons for 10-12 years.
Quite familiar with the "it aint my fault.....I was born that way" argument.
Or "It is mommies fault for sitting me on the potty crookedly"
So spare me and others the "scientific studies confirm....."

Back on the topic:
It is not the fault of BRAINWASHING that causes people
to sour on socialism. It is common sense and experience that
lends credence to the fact that it is an utter fail.

Originally posted by slugger9787
reply to post by TheBlackHat

 

I worked in maximum security prisons for 10-12 years.
Quite familiar with the "it aint my fault.....I was born that way" argument.
Or "It is mommies fault for sitting me on the potty crookedly"
So spare me and others the "scientific studies confirm....."

Back on the topic:
It is not the fault of BRAINWASHING that causes people
to sour on socialism. It is common sense and experience that
lends credence to the fact that it is an utter fail.

And im the king of Spain. It's easy to come out with credentials over the internet to back up your argument...the fact your playing that card is weak.
If your stating people commit seriously bad crimes because they didn't read the bible then id say your the one who is sadly misguided. Serious criminals clearly have something wrong upstairs..because it is not normal to have compulsions to commit crime..unlike what you are hinting at..it is in fact abnormal criminal behavior..

reply to post by TheBlackHat


Well your Hine ass, as king of spain, do you

intend to introduce socialism into the country?

I was not playing a credential card.
I was serious.
If you like, since you are calling me a liar
about the work experience, i can scan and send
you my work and education history?

I am who I say I am and I do and did what I say I do or did.

Hmm. . .

How about the Law of Consecration?

Under the Law of Consecration put forth by the being we identify as Jesus Christ, but his real name is Yashua (which means "Yahweh is Salvation"); we reap the following benefits:

Private Property.
Profit.
Voluntary Participation in the Law.
Family is made the basic social unit.
Your Personal Security is your Responsibility.
Competition with our Neighbors for Profit.
Decentralized Supervision.
And the right to worship your religion as you please according to your conscience.

reply to post by Cabin


There is no capitalists brainwashing in socialism. Proponents of socialism seem to just ignore the main flaw, HUMAN BEHAVIOR. Socialism at any level can only exists with the absence of greed. Solve greed and maybe socialism will work. The reason capitalism was so successful is because it embraced that(greed) natural human trait.

Socialism at any form is taking from one and giving it to someone else, in one way or another. This goes against human nature and will never work, and the reason it never has. It will continue to be a wishful theory by college kids that they later on in life try to implement with failed results, or by those who seek to control the masses.

reply to post by Cabin


I agree socialism is a valid economic ideal, but disregarding all the positivity the free market brings is a bad ideal.

Socialism can work with the free market, but by itself it is a stupid and stifling economic philosophy.

That's why a growing number of people side with liberalism. The free market has numerous negative aspects, but combined with liberal policies these negative aspects are for the most part negated.

reply to post by On7a7higher7plane


The path lie's some were between the two but I believe a work fair scheme for any benefit system would be necessary as one thing that separate's us from the animal's is the will to care for our vulnerable,.

A system by which you earn point's based on TIME not tax paid in full time work were your wage has been notified to the government, fair job protection ensuring there income to keep the employee's confidence in there ability to invest there wage's by making arbitrary and unfair dismissal a thing of the past (we had this in England but it is being destroyed by the chamber of commerce), free high quality education so that the diamond is not left in the rough, and for those whom can not work a decent benefit system giving them a quality of life, but htose whom are true scrounger's a voucher system,. This will not happen because it is fair, the wealthy make there wage's off the economy and good pay increases the flow of money in the economy, it is called enlightened self interest.

It does not require
brainwashing to
come to the conclusion
that socialism will not work.

It actually only requires the first word of the compound word.

Brain

reply to post by Cabin


We are paying for socialism but we are not getting it.

The Socialism that we are talking about is AGENDA 21 that is being force fed to us all . We as the commoners will have much less than we have now and the fat cats will have more . Air Conditioner will be one of the things we will not have and no cars will be allowed for us . We will live where the powers that will be says . That is if they allow us to live .
This thing is no joke and it's not something in the future . It is here now during the implementation phase . This is what we see now .

www.youtube.com...

originally posted by: Druscilla
reply to post by Cabin

 

To the title: yup, go figure.

You can thank USA's war on Communism for that.
There's also the taint left over from another other Socialist regime that was in power in Germany during WWII.

Socialism, however, aint bad.
Anyone wants to yell about it can pull their children out of PUBLIC School, which is a very very very Socialist program.
They can also sign off to never ever ever dip into SOCIAL Security once they get old.

There's lots of socialist programs alive and well in the USA as well as other first world countries all over that make for excellent systems.

Typically, however, it's under-educated ignorance that brings about blind hatred toward such systems.

All insurance is socialism, whether for profit or not. At least as long as it does good on its contractual obligations.

The banking / monetary system is also socialism, albeit hijacked by the rich for their own further enrichment.

Public infrastructure is socialism.

Public services are socialism (education, emergency, police, fire dept., national guard).

Etc.

originally posted by: SimonPeter
The Socialism that we are talking about is AGENDA 21 that is being force fed to us all . We as the commoners will have much less than we have now and the fat cats will have more . Air Conditioner will be one of the things we will not have and no cars will be allowed for us . We will live where the powers that will be says . That is if they allow us to live .
This thing is no joke and it's not something in the future . It is here now during the implementation phase . This is what we see now .

Air conditioning is unhealthy. It would be better to build offices and domiciles more efficient such that they require no to little active cooling or heating.

Also, what's the issue with doing away with cars in favour of mass transit and cycling, for instance?

I would almost guarantee that if a computer program was designed to control the distribution of wealth and resources in a country without greedy little humans being considered in the programming, a system to appropriate labor and control inventory and distribution....It would look different than it does now.

All systems have rules, some rules can be bent, others broken.

Remove the human factor and a system may be developed that actually does work for the benefit of a larger percentage of the population, but then the "Old World Order" which is the actual thing we are trying to fight our way out from under right now would fight it.

Lets just allow things to become mechanized the rest of the way and stop fighting it, nobody wants to work until they die anyway, never mind it really isn't necessary any more.

Ah, but wait!, there will always be those who feel the need to look down on others as lesser beings than themselves.......Y'all can thank religion for that and most other problems in this world, anyone who considers themselves to be "chosen" won't go for anything like equality.

The problems started long ago.