Japan tsunami survivors turn to exorcists for help- Many claim they are seeing ghosts of victims

So I thought this was a pretty bizarre story, just out today:

The tsunami that engulfed northeastern Japan two years ago has left some survivors believing that they are seeing ghosts.

In a society wary of admitting to mental problems, many are turning to exorcists for help.

Tales of spectral figures lined up at shops where now there is only rubble are a reaction to fear after the March 11, 2011, disaster in which nearly 19,000 people were killed, psychiatrists say.

“The places where people say they see ghosts are largely those areas completely swept away by the tsunami,” said Keizo Hara, a psychiatrist in Ishinomaki, one of the cities worst hit by the waves sparked by an offshore earthquake. “We think phenomena like ghost sightings are perhaps a mental projection of the terror and worries associated with those places.”

www.taipeitimes.com...

While it says that doctors attribute the ghost sightings to PTSD, to me that's just too easy an answer with all the other paranormal activity known to exist- and particularly the Scole experiments- in which communications with dead people seem to be a common occurrence. Good thread here on that:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

“There are headless ghosts and some missing hands or legs. Others are completely cut in half,” she said. “People were killed in so many different ways during the disaster and they were left like that in limbo. So it takes a heavy toll on us, we see them as they were when they died.”

That's gotta be rough.

So I wonder if this is occurring in Japan after that disaster, if anyone has heard any reports of people seeing ghosts after the even more deadly 2004 Sumatra quake and tsunami, in which over 200,000 died? Seems like there would be, if these reports out of Japan are true. I mean this is just crazy:

In some places destroyed by the tsunami, people have reported seeing ghostly apparitions lining up outside supermarkets that are now only rubble. Taxi drivers said they avoided the worst hit districts for fear of picking up phantom passengers.

They say truth is stranger than fiction, and that seeing is believing. But turning to exorcists? That always implied the extraction of an evil spirit to me. I guess when the doctors can offer no further help...

“They’ve started wanting to transmit their own messages to the dead,” Aizawa said.

Mediums and channels are the normal route to go for that, imo...Maybe the author of the article confused the term exorcist with them.

Even so, the story was still interesting.

I am a believer of the paranormal, but this could be a case of mass hysteria.

Four words.
PTSD.

The Japanese have a cultural predilection to obake.
Not at all surprising that PSTD would manifest in this form.

That is a bizarre story.. Seems as though alot of people are seeing those apparitions though which only makes it more mysterious. If it was one persons account then I would be skeptical but because numerous accounts are apparently being witnessed, I find this very interesting. It would be scary seeing those types of apparitions and why would people be lying about them?

Originally posted by Phage
The Japanese have a cultural predilection to obake.
Not at all surprising that PSTD would manifest in this form.

So then I suppose PTSD manifested in the same form after Hiroshima/Nagasaki? Lots of dead there too- but I can't recall any stories about them seeing ghosts of victims...

If I know you- you'll find a story of that exact thing, just to take the wind out of my sails...

Blah.

I don't care...find one...the point is, after seeing the Scole stuff, all bets are off. That's pretty darn convincing evidence that at least some are trapped after death, and/or still attempt to communicate with the living...

reply to post by TrueAmerican

I can't recall any stories about them seeing ghosts of victims

So that means that there weren't any? Not a strong position.

Kant, having given himself the premiss that we do not know that the grocer has an immediate inclination towards his customers, draws the conclusion that the grocer has no immediate inclination toward his customers.

www.jstor.org...

Scole, are you kidding? Sucked in by frauds.
skeptoid.com...

Remember hearing of a man who called himself Houdini? He dedicated a lot of his life to expose those fakers.

Bizarre story indeed. Either way, it shows that these victims are dealing with this in a hard way. Obviously they believe they are real, and that's gotta take a toll. Well, it already has taken it's toll.

reply to post by Phage


Well it may not be that strong a position- I agree to that, but until someone comes up with a historical link to such a story, I believe my position is still stronger than yours- and I did make a point. PTSD has become too much of a catch all. Not good enough to explain this away, imo.

I've heard about things like that before.
Sudden, violent death in large numbers, seems to be the common link.
But being from Pennsylvania, the one I've heard about since grade school days is Gettysburg.
The three day battle of the Civil War that took place in Gettysburgh, PA, killed over 40,000 men!

There are all kinds of reports of sightings, hearing gunshots & cannon fire,
horses screaming, men moaning & calling for help!
They even give different ghost tours!

www.ghostingettysburg.com...

The whole surrounding area is impressive enough in the daytime.
And had an eerie feeling about it even as it was just getting close to dusk.
And that was before I even knew about the ghost tours!
That's one tour I don't think I'd want to take. At least not the candle light one!!!
WOQ

reply to post by TrueAmerican

I believe my position is still stronger than yours

An argument from ignorance is never a strong (or valid) argument. My neighbor's cat is a robot. Nobody has shown my neighbor's cat isn't a robot so you can't tell me it isn't.

Not good enough to explain this away, imo.

Quite good enough. (and unless I say otherwise, the imo is always implied without being explicitly stated)

reply to post by TrueAmerican


I doubt it's ptsd.

I think it's most likely hysteria.

Or maybe the radiation did something to the ghosts, making them more visible.

reply to post by Phage


If your neighbor has a cat, by definition it can't be a robot. Even if it is a robot made to look like a cat. Cause even then, it would still be a robot, and not a cat. It might be a robotic cat.

Ok, so... from now on if you see ghosts or apparitions, people, you are suffering from PTSD. Got it?

:shk:

Come on...this is a specific set of circumstances here, and although I don't think the article says how many people are experiencing this, the apparent fact that more than one are seeing ghosts, in the very areas swept away, is intriguing. I'm glad we get to all form our own opinions- cause if it was up to Phage- we all WOULD be robots...

reply to post by TrueAmerican

Ok, so... from now on if you see ghosts or apparitions, people, you are suffering from PTSD. Got it?

Who said that? Not I. That would be a straw man argument.
And your argument from ignorance about Hiroshima is still an argument from ignorance.
That's two logical fallacies. But who's counting.

the apparent fact that more than one are seeing ghosts

And the actual fact that the Japanese have strong cultural influences regarding ancestral ghosts (check out Obon). Traumatic experiences could well result in hallucinations which draw from those cultural influences.

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by TrueAmerican

 

Ok, so... from now on if you see ghosts or apparitions, people, you are suffering from PTSD. Got it?

Who said that? Not I. That would be a straw man argument.
And your argument from ignorance about Hiroshima is still an argument from ignorance.
That's two logical fallacies. But who's counting.

the apparent fact that more than one are seeing ghosts

And the actual fact that the Japanese have strong cultural influences regarding ancestral ghosts (check out Obon). Traumatic experiences could well result in hallucinations which draw from those cultural influences.

edit on 3/7/2013 by Phage because: (no reason given)

Damn Phage why don't you draw a conclusion between hallucinations and excessive radiation poisoning while your at it! lol

I actually like Phage and feel this place needs someone like him to keep this place from going bat shyte crazy but I swear sometimes he has the ability to take the fun right out of a thread like a swift kick in the balls will wipe the smile off a face

reply to post by digital01anarchy

I'm not the one drawing conclusions.
Or using logical fallacies to bolster my case.

48 warren rd. Framingham MA.
I grew up there, nothing anyone can say will convince me that there are no such things as "ghosts".
What they are i can say, spirits, demons, lost souls, emotional impressions on locations, spacial/dimensional bleedthrough....
I have read and heard so many theories on how or why these phenomenon exist and the only thing i can say for certain is that they do exist.

It doesnt surprise me that this type phnomenon would be reported where such a dramatic event occured.

This sounds all too much like the episode from Dr. Who where people start seeing ghosts... AND THEN CYBERMEN! I'd be careful Japan, just sayin.

I might go against Phage on this one, except the article itself doesn't really present a compelling case for an epidemic of sightings; it only presents a handful of cases. What it does present is a slow news day!

These are desolate quiet areas that are heavily associated with tradgedy and loss. I'd be worried if they didn't make people feel uneasy, it's in our nature to escape danger and horror. The news story is certainly creepy.

I guess I'm just not sure ghosts as a general rule are deceased people, because the vast majority of apparitions that are seen are exactly what we would expect to see based on our culture / knowledge etc ... Ghosts (to my understanding, please correct me if I missed something) have never given us unique knowledge of our past.

Guess the other feeling I have is ... if humans can see them, they must interact with light in some way and therefore can be photographed ... yet they are not. Evidence here would at least point to them being images contained within our minds or at least percieved with something other than physical light.

I'd personally believe the vast majority are contained within our own minds but maybe am wrong and now and then one is 'put' there.

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by TrueAmerican

 

I can't recall any stories about them seeing ghosts of victims

So that means that there weren't any? Not a strong position.

Kant, having given himself the premiss that we do not know that the grocer has an immediate inclination towards his customers, draws the conclusion that the grocer has no immediate inclination toward his customers.

www.jstor.org...

Scole, are you kidding? Sucked in by frauds.
skeptoid.com...

Remember hearing of a man who called himself Houdini? He dedicated a lot of his life to expose those fakers.

edit on 3/7/2013 by Phage because: (no reason given)

I don't believe the Scole Reports either but I do believe in "ghosts" and other paranormal phenomena.

Anyway, the Scole Experiments began in 1993, so am I to presume that it was the ghost of Harry Houdini who tried to expose them? If so, why do you say that Houdini spent most of his "life" exposing the fraudsters? Surely you meant to say "afterlife"? Even so, its nice to know that, with your skeptical beliefs, you still maintain a healthy faith in the supernatural... I knew there was some semblance of something human inside you! I'd love to see a thread about your Houdini theory, or any other supernatural or unexplained experience you've had. It could really bolster our moral around here to see you open up a little and admit that our world is not so cut and dry as it would seem. Surely you've had SOME experience that made you wonder... And I don't mean looking up at the sky at night -_-

If I were ever in a disaster on a scale like the 2011 tsunami I wouldn't know what to believe. These people have gone through something severely traumatic. If they say they're seeing ghosts who am I to question them?