I have a question for those of you who believe in God.

Originally posted by bronto
The World is the ''way it is '' ,wars ,abortion ,drugs,murders ,rape ,destroying and polluting the earth etc because in the beginning humans decided they wanted to rule themselves make their own decisions .......... and the Creator gave them a'' Period of time'' to prove whether or not they could or NOT ! thats why we live in a corrupt world that we live in, Its like the book Lord of the Flies where the civilized school children get shipwrecked on a island and turn into savages because they dont have adults to guide them until a Navy destroyer appears and they return to civilization .The Period will eventually end. and the Creator will step in, a put a stop to the mayhem on this earth, he will not allow it to continue forever ,and mankinds corrupt rule over the Earth will End, God will take it back and those refusing to live under his Just Laws for the benefit of all on earth, will be removed permanently ,and then the Earth will be the way it was intended ,no wars, corruption ,sickness ,pollution ,lies,etc

Well, I surely hope a God comes down and rights our wrongs, but people have been saying that a LOOOONG time, and things have just progressive gotten worse. I am all for wishful thinking, but yeah... wishful thinking.

Originally posted by knowledgedesired
reply to post by Quibbler

 

How would you know what suffering is if you have never seen it or experienced it?

How would you know what love and hate is if you never experienced either?

How would you know the difference between pain and pleasure if you never experiened both?

Maybe you are to close minded to see god's work... AT WORK.

Life is about gaining experiences both good and bad IMHO.

So you're telling me that innocent children's murder is justified so we can feel both pain and love? It may sound extreme but that's the implication.

I agree with you, though. Without mountains you don't see valleys and valleys to mountains. The Yin and the Yang, how they manifest in one another; the one is the many and the many is the all as the Buddha would've said.

Not to sound pretentious but what is "God's work?" I must be too close-minded to see a point in all of this madness when this God is evidently all-loving, knowing, and powerful.

If the fate of my eternal soul depends on believing what a book says then believing one book over another without any proof as to which one, if either, are true would be foolish.Believing in the wrong book will lead to the same cosequences as not believing in any of them.
with such a major and long lasting decision to make,it`s not unreasonable to want some kind of proof or evidencce before making the decision.
If none of them can offer any proof then how can I have any faith or belief in my choice when I know that it`s just of matter of luck as to whether I picked the right one much like picking the correct number on a roulette wheel.

Rome, I would like to ask you an honest question, not meaning to put you down for your beliefs. I actually an interested in your response.

My question is :

Are you opposed to all gods equally and what are you main reservations against each? To specify, does Allah and his followers bother you as much as the God of the Bible? How about Buddha? etc

Please think about this and dig deep. Let's just single in on the gods and not their followers. It is too easy to put your thoughts onto human actions within the religions and discount the actual gods. Try not to do that.

I am just trying to understand you point of view more. Thanks

~OkieDokie

Greetings,
Boy o boy, did you ask an open ended question, or what.

I've been in the new thought area for or 50 years and I can guarantee you that you are not going to get a meaningful one or two line answer.

One of the biggest problems is the control of the "image of God" and It's attributes. He who controls the image of God controls the masses. This also applies to the teachings of the master teachers.

This does not mean there isn't a God, it just means manipulation thru dogma is the rule of the day and confusion is the result.

You are right in saying that reading and memorizing the bible, any bible does not mean there is a God, it also results in spiritual law ignorance and misapplication.

Last week a lady wondered into our church during services and during a conversation with her afterwards she told me she had read the bible ten times, yet, she said she didn't understand anything the minister was talking about. The sermon was about some basic, basic spiritual laws and how to use them. How can you possibly read the bible ten times and be in such a state of ignorance. Please forgive me if I don't go into a book length explanation.

There are some churches that are dogma free.
Science of Mind ( Religious Science) Centers are referred to as "Radiance Centers For Spiritual Living
Unity Christ Church
Divine Science
There may be others that I am unaware of.

My base is Religious Science. You can down load or read on line the "Science of Mind text book. The first couple of chapters should give you a reasonable insight as to how we view this topic.

I would also recommend,
Web search for, Ra/The Law of One. On line material.
Seth Speaks, by Jane Roberts Several books
Course In Miracles, available on line. This material takes about a year to (reasonably), properly understand and absorb.

Now there is a way to communicate with your higher self and having done so I can say that the above recommended material is valid.

Have fun.

reply to post by DrumsRfun


oh dear - its like shoting fish in a barrel :

Why do you even care what others believe??

why does every major eligion " care " [1] about what others believe ??

notes :

[1] - when i say " care " about - what i mean is - desperatly attempt to ensure that everyone else believes the same crap as they do - by force , co-ercion , threat , promise , bribe or lie

Worry about what you believe in and allow others to believe what they want.

why does no major religion practice this maxim ?

reply to post by ignorant_ape

why does no major religion practice this maxim ?

Its much like conspiracy theorists who think they know something and need to get what they believe out to the masses. (masses....get where i am going with this?)
When you choose to call it horse dung...you get called a shill.

Same thing really.

Conspiracy theorists always use the term wake up,sheep and shill.

Religious speak is just more of the same thing.

Not to sound pretentious but what is "God's work?"

reply to post by RomeByFire


You are gods work and so am I.

God's work to me is...
Subjecting us to life experiences that we need to learn and grow as an individual to someday be reunited with the everything. Take a look around and admire what "god" has put before us... Even if you don't believe in "god" which I don't because I believe in creator not some dude wandering in the desert with a cross writing books telling us what to do.

What if you knew 100% that when you died there was an after life?

Would you still sympathize with the dead in the same manner if you knew for a fact that after they died they re-united with their true self or soul and then made choices for the next incarnation.

[1] - when i say " care " about - what i mean is - desperately attempt to ensure that everyone else believes the same crap as they do - by force , co-coercion , threat , promise , bribe or lie

Because they inherently know it's BS. To be accepted and validate your misbelief you have to get others to buy into the BS. Psychology 101.

Ask young children about who they are and if they have not been indoctrinated you'll get a surprising answer.

As long as we buy into the predatory religions the world will not change.

reply to post by RomeByFire

I'm sorry, but I'm still waiting for irrefutable evidence that the Bible is anything more than just a book that tells stories.

It is just a book that tells stories. Since man does not want to take the time to open up and hear God, the book is all he has that gives him a glimpse into what God is.

I don't believe in ANY organized religion. People spend their entire lives studying a book, and they become so engrossed in symbolism and underlining themes with confusing names, dates, places, etc; it becomes a mess.

This is true. Many get lost in the details rather than the simple message that is said.

Believers should spend less time memorizing and regurgitating passages and verses; and spend more time being kind to others and offering their guidance rather than offering their very, VERY biased and subjective belief that doesn't have any proof.

You are correct. Father would want the same thing. He would want to used what is learned rather than just repeating from memorization.

Originally posted by DrumsRfun
reply to post by RomeByFire

 

Why do you even care what others believe??

Worry about what you believe in and allow others to believe what they want.

Threads like this are borderline antagonistic and silly.

Because there are a number of prolific religious folk who would be akin to having someone stand by the side fo the road, and help you cross it.

No traffic? No problem, here let me help you.
No need for a helping hand? No problem, I'll still help you as you walk across the road.
No intention of crossing the road? No problem, come with me I'll help you cross the road.

Despite all protestations, they grab your awm and help you cross that dangerous street.

You stop short and say "STOP IT." and suddenly they go "I'm only trying to help you."

It's not because they believe in a man written book that they believe is the word of god, it's because they can't just read it in peace.

They have to Help everyone else get across an imaginary street.

I have absolutely no problem with religious people per se. But I do have one with busy bodies that recite the bible verbatim to refute common logic, who condemn others for not following in their path, or who pontificate the immorality of others while being guilty of human nature themselves.

Religion should be Do as I do, not as I say. But as it is not, we have an awful lot of very loud people preaching to everyone, and they resort to the 'word of god' to be their entire set of rules of engagement.

Funny thing I noticed.

Religious folk have been making an inordinate number of god this, christ that, heaven this threads of late. All in the various religious forums on ATS.

Yet in order to safely make one asking why it is they use a book of myths to do so, it must be posted in a Rant section.

funny that.

Originally posted by Quibbler
I see children dying for no reason. I see infants being born a little over a pound in weight, only to die days later. I see wars being fought in the name of a god. I see people across the globe starving. I see so many things that shouldn't be, but are. If there is a god, he isn't doing a good job right now.

Some will tell you that this is gods plan. Each one of those souls suffering is to teach them lessons in life.

To me, it seems as if their god is the one who needs to be taught the lesson.

What sort of malevolent entity would allow the death of billions of billions from all of creation, to teach them something.

One that lacks the worthiness of worship if you ask me.

Whenever speaking about God or religion one must articulate which God or religion one is speaking about as the term God encompass various entities from many cultures and religion is as anyone can understand not one religion but a multitude as well.

However, the reason many referr to the Holy Bible when speaking of the present is because there are several passages and verses in it that offers explanation to history, the present and the future as well as quite large quantities of profound wisdom. Not neglecting the fact that one may find contradictions in it too but one must keep in mind that it has been altered, translated and rewritten countless times over the ages.

Also, extremely important to note is that most religions speak of reincarnation and karma. Worth looking into because it explains why God doesn't intervene in human affairs.

I choose to believe in a supreme Creator and universal consciousness, but I do not follow nor frown upon any religion for it is not my right to judge another person. I may have my opinion about all of everything but that does not mean I am supposed or should voice it against things I have little to no experience with.

With that said, I leave you with this;

"You keep praying for a miracle to appear as if you cannot percieve it so let me ask you this for the sake of all that is; you are indeed praying, are you not?", said the insightful blind man to the hawk eyed student and left him there to see.

That is all I need.

reply to post by RomeByFire


Nice job Romebyfire. Everyone responding to this thread apparently believes in God (pinned them down).

reply to post by vethumanbeing


Assumption only makes asses out of people.


Terrible job vethumanbeing.

I go for tolerance...not idiocy.

reply to post by RomeByFire

Well, not even necessarily believe in God more than a Holy Book such as The Bible that is so commonly used as a "proof" to God's existence. I'll keep this nice and short. Why do you guys who follow the Bible or whatever Holy Book constantly use verses and phrases from said book when debating?

You can't debate religion, because you can't argue with faith.

Faith and Proof are diametrically opposed. If you can PROVE something, then FAITH in it is no longer needed, as now it is KNOWN.

Religious folks use quotes from their books to reinforce their beliefs, and show why they feel the way they do. Stories and parables cannot be used as "proof", but they can be used to illustrate ideas.

A quick background here...I was raised Southern Baptist, but doubted it...and eventually became an atheist. I then studied (as a hobby, and in school) other religions, and was very exposed to Islam and Judaism when I lived in the Middle East. In the end, I'm no longer an atheist, but more agnostic. I believe there is SOMETHING to all of this, all of us....I simply don't think man has been able to quantify it yet, so we all made various stories, ideas to "fill in the gap"...

So, I have FAITH that there's some kind of divine force (not a conscious entity) behind everything, some kind of guidance, but I don't believe any Earthly religion has it even close. Can I PROVE it? No...but oddly, many of the most recent advances in quantum physics are pointing more towards the divine, than away from it...something to ponder.

Originally posted by DrumsRfun
reply to post by vethumanbeing

 

Assumption only makes asses out of people.

Terrible job vethumanbeing.

I go for tolerance...not idiocy.

ASS-UMPTION Gumption. Clearly stated in the Title "open sesame please", those responding to this thread are ass-(con)sumed to be believers in God. Do not know the last time Lucifer hopped a thread titled "GET OUT OF HEAVEN FREE CARD" (you realize I responded to this thread or did that miss your concideration).

I didn't read the whole OP.

But anyway, the Bible states that in the last days scoffers will come, and you have proven it correct!

2 Peter 3:3(KJV)
3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

But, not to worry, OP, because: The Father will bring the light, friend. It's all in God's hand and he will show you the truth through Christ.